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Of course you’d say that. But you seem to know a little law. So answer my question – “They used to post after the SCOTUS decision just saying it means “not more than de minimis cost”. Now they added in “or burden on business operations;”.”
When did they add it in?
I think they changed it after my Court case!!
This is because at that time I was legally correct!
Once again, without knowing what your case was I have to assume that the courts were correct. TWA vs. Hardison could have been decided against Hardison based on either standard. In addition, either standard would be considered “undue hardship”.
They change the meaning every time they feel like it!
This is because they are subtlety Antisemitic!!!
But keep voting DemonCrat!!!
Worse, they are pro Union. Even when the company is willing to make an accommodation, if the union gets in the way, the Union gets first dibs on not allowing the accommodation to go through.
In all fairness to the court though, making exceptions to the union contract, even where there may be reason due to discrimination, would be more than a “de minimis” cost, as forced exceptions to seniority would cause discontent within the ranks and possible reopening of the negotiated contract (i.e. “burden on business operations”). So either way (whether you call it “de minimis” or “burden on business operations”) I believe TWA v Hardison was decided appropriately.
As we don’t know what your case was, I can’t speak to your specific scenario, but have to assume that the courts were correct in their decision there as well.
No, but don’t come back here with more cases. I’m not going to say yes or no. I’m not going to reveal my name. You can reveal your name – if the Mods let you!
No problem. Just don’t expect any sympathy from anyone when you claim you were discriminated against, as none of us have any clue what you are talking about.
Rav Elyashiv paskened that if a goy underwent a geirus while believing the world is older than 6,000 years, the conversion is invalid and he remains a goy.
Define “the world”.
Health – Wilshin v. Allstate? The case seems to be correctly decided based on the offer to be open on Sunday instead of Saturday.
P.S. It doesn’t help you to end every paragraph with an exclamation point!!
Health – Until you can show me the case, I have to assume you are not telling the truth. 🙁
lilmod ulelamaid – Thank you kindly
Health – I don’t know what a “law search” is, but I did a Google search and nothing came up. If you want people to believe you (which at this point no one has backed you up), then you need to tell everyone how to look up your specific case. The title would be the best way to do so.
In any event, once you pull the Daas Torah card, the discussion ends, and B”H for that. We get it – you liberals will vote Clinton. She will probably win, and when the results are disasterous we can all laugh at you and say “Told you so”.
I fully expect the results of Mrs. Clinton to be against what I would like to happen, perhaps even “disastrous” (most of which can be avoided by not taking federal funding, which is a point that everyone ignores. It really is all about the Kesef). I can live with that, just like I did under Pres. Obama. What I can’t live with is someone who wishes to distribute nukes, removes protections for religious groups, and has no idea when to quit a fight, let alone how not get into one. I don’t like Mrs. Clinton, but I like the possibility of Nuclear War even less. If only the Republicans had put up a cardboard box for president instead of Trump, they would be winning by a landslide.
#neverTrump
I’ve never ravened, but I’ve seen it at Kiddushim. It is absolutely disgusting, and probably even more dangerous for shorts, as they get trampled by talls.
Eyes can’t lie as they can’t speak. It was a good misdirection by nisht, and I appreciate it. It was cute, not “funny”.
I don’t think Joseph ever said it was ZD’s eyes that were lying.
🙂
And that one was NOT so funny
they will, Gd forbid, wonder what else you made up.
Facts only get in the way of indoctrination. See: Making of a Gadol, among others.
I guess it’s another reason why I’m “Left wing”. The Emes is essential, and Sheker has no feet.
By hearing Joseph’s portrayal of college vs my own experience, I think I missed something. Maybe I just imagined going and I really wasnt there
Who will you believe: Joe’s description from his Rosh Yeshiva or your own lying eyes?
I have to agree with CTLawyer. As much as I may not like Mrs. Clinton’s positions on many issues, she is smart, extremely qualified, and has reached across the aisle in the past.
Mr. Trump is dangerous, not only to the United States but to the world at large. If Putin insults Trump, will Trump start a war? I wouldn’t put it past someone like Trump. Trump will solidify the idea of treating people differently based on their religion or ethnicity. He has no concrete plan for any issue, believe me 🙂
To paraphrase…..
Because I was not a Muslim.
And the next group they always come for are the Jews.
#NeverTrump
Joe – Guess so. If claiming Mishkav Nikeiva with underage children is only a “misdemeanor” and not a big deal is part of being in the religious “right”, I’ll be a happy member of the religious “left”.
Joe – don’t really care. Sorry.
Pasul is Pasul, and this guy is Pasul in my book.
Furthermore, the author supports (on his blog) Malka Leifer not being extradited to Australia (or alternatively, being locked up in Israel). That most certainly poisons that well for me.
Don’t bother with a review on my account, I’m not interested in what he has to say.
Joseph – We would like to see your review of the material discussed. Does it talk about Avodas Yom HaKippurim (hence the title)?
Edit: Read the first Amazon review. If he defines “Charaidi” as someone who “upholds Torah study and Mitzvot observance as the most important thing in his life”, then it includes diverse people such as Rabbis Avi Weiss, Aharon Teitelbaum, Herschel Shachter and Leib Tropper. That alone makes me think the book is a bit off.
Joseph: You intentionally misread that Rambam and Shulchan Aruch.
Don’t feed the Troll (more than once) 😉
Joe – So you’re a Chasid Shote, and I’m Open Orthodox. I’ll take the OO side any day over the Chasid Shote side, and twice on Yom Tov 🙂
As far as important, in the context of the aforementioned Shulchan Aruch, it would mean any unavoidable travel.
Says you. As you’ve already shown yourself to be a Chassid Shote, I would say that others, including Chazal, would say differently.
To quote Hamilton, as much as I may disagree with many of Hillary’s opinions,
But when all is said and all is done
Jefferson has beliefs. Burr has none
“Those who know don’t tell, and those who tell don’t know”.
There is a YU Rosh Yeshiva
🙂
’nuff said.
Sparkly – Kol HaKavod. From what I’ve heard, MO (as in YU crowd) doesn’t have the same issues with the “shidduch crisis” as the Yeshivish group (which would B’derech Klal be looking for a learning boy, even if they have a lucrative position). Simply put, you can go to the Upper West Side or Washington Heights and find your own boy.
Sam, the answer could easily be yes, save her life (of course) but not necessarily give her a ride for her convenience.
Once again, if you are so worried, hand over the keys and walk home.
Sparkly – Bederech Klal, learning boys don’t want to marry medical students. They are away too often and the money doesn’t come in quick enough. From what I’ve seen they many times end up marrying other medical students that they hang out with.
Rav Avigdor Miller:
“A Beis Yaakov girl should be wed soon after or before graduation. Every day after she leaves the Beis Yaakov marks another step away from idealism, for the street and the office and the secular school have an unfailing effect which increases from day to day.”
Rabbi Miller was also strongly against Kollel. They go hand in hand.
“but i choose to because im more religious than mo.”
I’m frummer than you are, I’m frummer than you are
🙂
A regular Yid is a Chiloni (as per Onkelos).
BSD
Frum, no it is not Frum. Joseph as usual will give the knee-jerk Chassid Shote response (Noshim are Assur!). Others will care what the Olam thinks, so they can show everyone how Frum (!) they are by leaving Noshim in the cold or rain.
If there is Yichud, it is certainly assur (but then again you wouldn’t take someone out on a date L’toeles there either). See below for my suggestion regarding what to do.
If it somewhere where you would interact with Noshim L’toeles, helping someone out is just as much L’toeles. There is no need to shmooze, and as a geder, you can have your Ema or spouse (if you have one) on the phone the entire trip (my Rov’s suggestion when this question came up).
That being said, everyone should know themselves. If they think that they may be nichshal by helping this person, then lend them your car and you should walk home (or take the bus) in the rain and the cold. As the SA says, “Tzarich Adam L’hisrachech mehaNashim Meod Meod”.
Just to clarify, when I say “the battle is lost”, that is from their perspective, that they are fighting to keep us out. We don’t have to “fight” to move into areas, we can purchase just like any other person.
If she’s single, she cannot join Imamother.
From their front page:
Welcome! Imamother is a warm community of married and once married frum Jewish women.
The Wolf
Never been, didn’t know. Thanks.
BachurTzvi – This is controversial, but….
Very simply put, they want to keep Religious Jews out. It is probably not antisemitism per say, but rather recognizing what happens to a community every time the Religious Jews move in, whether it is Lakewood, Rockland, Kiryas Joel, etc. (With a single exception of the Five Towns, and even that was contentious). Schools that go bust due to redirected funding, increased traffic, no care for zoning or other building restrictions, and officials that seem to not care about anyone but their own and are willing to skirt the law (on some occasions) to help their own to the detriment of others.
If this in Lakewood, the battle has already been lost, just give it a few years. If you are in one of the outlying towns (Toms River, Jackson, etc.) then you will have to wait and see what happens.
P.S. Are there specific reasons why you just don’t bring the issue for a vote?
I would love to hear advice from women who have been doing this all their life 🙂
Honestly, you are in the wrong place. Go to Imamother.com. 🙂
Seriously, find a rebbitzen with whom you are comfortable discussing these issues. Don’t do it on a forum where you have no idea if the advice is any good for your situation.
DaasYochid, CTRebbe – Could be. I’d like to see your cheshbon on how much (gross) a family of 12 needs (10 children ages 5 – 20, let’s say).
I only know from someone who actually made 400K and showed that he needed a scholarship. Don’t remember the exact details at this minute, but there may have been mitigating circumstances.
Gavra………..
Your 400K gross would not suffer 50% tax bite for a couple with 10 children who would have 12 deductions.
Having a mortgage, property tax and other deductions it is unlikely the tax bite would exceed $100K
Thus the bottom line would be 130K not 30K
I’d also question a 4k per month mortgage payment in this low interest rate market
Most of which get kicked out due to AMT. Add state taxes plus social security, and you are easily at 40%.
I didn’t even count health insurance or camp of some sort, so add another 15K for health (pre-tax) and depending on the type of camp, up to 50K (5K per child for sleep away, 1.5K for day camp?). Assuming 4 in sleep away, that makes another 30K (including tips and the sort).
ironpenguin – Stop dealing with what you would like the world to be, and deal with it the way it is.
One famous Lakewood Shaddchan says consistently that the number one criteria for finding a boy is money.
So if a boy really likes the way a girl looks and decides to date her even if her father doesn’t have Cayman Island bank accounts, all the better for her. You need to grab every advantage you can get.
This disturbs me and I’d rather not succumb to what I see as a threat to Orthodox continuity.
That’s a new one. Claim Halacha if you would like, but with 3 or 4 reaching maturity that is more than the typical Jewish family 150 or even 100 years ago.
My question to those parents of many, is how they do it?
Either make a boatload of money or claim poverty. Saving and scrimping will not help unless you make a boatload anyway. Even if you make a boatload you may still need deductions, like the familiy with 10 children and the father making 400K a year.
400K pretax = 200K Net.
200K net – 120K tuition (assume 12K per child, may be more) = 80K
80K – 50K Mortgage + Utilities = 30K
30K = Insufficient for necessities of 10 children, including Minivan, insurance, food and clothing.
this is all happening when the UJA spends 300 MILLION dollars a year and only 1 million on yeshivas, the rest on Goyim or toeiva tolerance groups and the like.
And the Russian government spends billions on Vodka. So?
I am surprised that no one on this thread has blamed the kollel system as hurting the yeshiva ketanas.
To the best of my knowledge, discounts are not offered (in my area) to those who support their children after marriage monetarily. Somewhere like Lakewood, it wouldn’t shock me if they would give priority to Kollel, but then that is a choice to support Kollel over Rabbaim, not a problem.
gavra, and if the family of eight is about to become homeless, do we first give money to the yeshiva or first to insure the family has shelter?
You can invite them into your own home, and give the money to Yeshivos.
Go fight with the Shulchan Aruch, not me. I’m done with “what ifs”.
Typo. I meant hypothetical. Fixed.
!@#$%^&^ spellcheck! 🙂
gavra, does a yeshiva have kadima for tzedaka over a poor Jew whose family is on the verge of starving?
Yes. You give the starving family food (after all, if you give them money they might die from starvation before they can convert it into food) and the Yeshiva money. We throw out so much food that it would not be necessary to spend additional funds.
Gavra, therea are good reasons why none of those will ever happen. Since you’re being entirely hypocritical anyhow, you could have saved yourself a lot of typing and simply wrote one word: vouchers.
Not sure how “hypocritical” applies, mind explaining yourself?
I thought about vouchers and didn’t include them, but will with an asterisk. Vouchers require external funding that is not in our control. As the Gemorah terms it “Taloui B’daas Acheirim”. Therefore it can’t be included as a fix.
*However, now that I think about it, Wisconsin has a voucher program in place currently. A possible solution would be for Lakewood Yeshiva (as well as others who are interested) to pick up and move to Wisconsin, which would be helpful in more ways than one.
How do you think it can be fixed?
1: Re-prioritize. The Shulchan Aruch says that Chinuch HaBanim is the most critical Tzedaka (YD 249:16). If people would prioritize giving to Yeshivos for scholarships over giving to Aniyim who walk around collecting, Kupat hair, and the “popular” causes such as a “Rabbaim simcha fund” (like no one else struggles to make simchos), then we would have more money for Yeshivoa.
2: Incentivize – There should be incentives not to request a tuition discount. This would include giving those who pay full tuition recognition at the school dinner and events, the ability to choose teachers, and smaller classes.
3: Enforcement – It’s great that the grandparents want to buy fancy clothes, take their children on trips, and lease new cars for their grandchildren. But if they do, those grandchildren are not eligible for tuition discounts. Yeshivos should consider requesting time or objects in lieu of tuition, and should have the right to request budgets.
4: Mortgage – The Yeshiva should create a program in which someone who is getting a discount but owns a home has a lien placed on the property for the value of the discount, updated each year. That way, even if they don’t get the money now, they will get it when the property changes hands. This will be a huge help 10 – 20 years down the road, when serious money starts coming in.
Just a few ideas I’ve heard, none of which will ever happen.
As horrible as is for the families who aren’t getting the income they need, it’s at most not being m’kayem an aseh (assuming they are allocating their funds properly).
And associated Lavim, such as Bal Talin, if they apply. Ask your LOR. But yes, I agree generally.
The Yeshiva system is in crisis and nobody really can fix it.
It can be fixed, but no one wants to make the tough decisions that are needed to fix it.
Charlie, do you pasken that a yeshiva can serve treif so they can pay their staff?
I have to agree with DY here. Out of all the choices they have (closing, firing staff, turning off electricity, etc.) not paying workers may be the best one. When the school’s owner has taken all he can out of his home, sold his silver, and just can’t come up with additional funds, one possible avairah (after asking Da’as Torah, of course) may be the best answer in a bad situation.
That isn’t an accurate summary, gavra. The keywords were the halacha is not like them.
I saw that, and still read it the same way, that it is perfectly reasonable and acceptable to disagree and hold the other way.
Thanks for the clarification. That makes more sense.
Agreed. Makes it more like “we don’t want the unwashed masses to know there are other, valid opinions”, but those opinions are not Apikorsus.
Joe – Interesting you bring that up. I don’t see you actually doing anything the CC says you should be doing. Where are you outing and embarrassing Orthoprax (or known Kofrim)?
Emor Harbei, V’Aseh Miyat.
I don’t know what the orthoprax really believes. I just read an article about a guy who is OTD, and has conversations with God often, with the topic of being extremely angry at God that he doesn’t exist. It is Pashut to me that this person is a Maamin in ways that unfortunately most Religious people are not.