Gadolhadorah

A good start would be for all the MEN constantly whining about the “tzinius crisis’ to step back this chodesh Elul and look in a good mirror and focus their musar internally. I can’t believe we have the most erliche male population among yidden today since dor ha’midbor and they have exhausted all opportunities for self-improvement in their emunah and hashkafah and thus the only issue left for them to focus their lives on is for women to become more machmir in their observance of tzinius.

Who or what is “Bloris”???

Joseph….are you insinuating that Rav Tendler, shlita, was somehow not aware of your chumrah or simply felt in a yekeshe mood the day of his chassanah?? I doubt either he or R’ Moshe, ZTL, would have not been aware of what halacha required

The story is told about Rav Apron Soloveichik Z’tl, who responded to a shaylah from either his gabbai (or some talmidim) who said he/they had gone to a friend’s wedding and was surprised that there was mixed seating for the singles attending and what should he/they do in the future when those circumstances arose.. According to the telling of this story, the Rav sighed, and said something along the lines of, “Oy vey – how do you think I met Ella?” I’ve heard numerous variations of similar stories attributed to various rabbonim who were both makil and machmir on this issue with the R’ Breuer/Yekeshe practice at one end of the spectrum and the more mainstream Chassidus at the other end….

So long hair is the underlying cause of the shidduch crisis in Lakewood?? I would think the real cause is the absence of “real’ beards” among the BMG crowd (aka facial hair cut too short)

Some use the term in EY to refer to power that has generated without any yidden working at the powerplant on Shabbos or in any way indirectly resulting in chilul Shabbos for power consumed. Some areas of Meah Shearim etc. have their own “Shabbos generators”…
I’m sure there may be other meanings but this is one possibility.

Motcha11:
I don’t know where you get the mesorah that the Rebbe, Z’TL, taught his chassidim that all yidden, Litvish, misnagdim, other chassidus etc. will magically become Lubavitch at the time of z’man moishiach. Somehow the visuals of the BMG crowd in Lakewood and Skver from monsey joining hands on Eastern Parkway and waving yellow flags saying “Welcome Rebbe Moishiach” are a bit difficult to internalize.

we saw it several weeks ago and enjoyed it. If you like this genre of “gritty” message movie (aka widower father’s love for his son v. rebbe’s insistence on need for a “stable family life” etc.) its reasonably well done and edited down to a short length. I’m not sure what the “mamash soton” element of this movie as its quite harmless….

My presumption is that the majority of readers do not conduct their daily lives exclusively in certain neighborhoods of Willy, BP, Lakewood and Monsey. The point I made very early in this thread is that there is more widespread legal and social acceptance of nursing in public areas with varying degrees of attention to “modesty” (I won’t use the term tzinius to avoid confusion) among young women outside of the frum tzibur. Yidden who travel will have to accommodate these diverse visual encounters since they are only going to increase. To my knowledge, few (if any) of the 48 states that have legalized nursing in public specify limits on the mother’s exposure.

To L&uL
these are NOT two entirely different scenarios. Even among non-frum women, most will seek to discreetly nurse even in public (cover over with blanket or something like that). It may not be “strictly tziniusdkik by your standards but still discreet. The few wild-eyed nursing fanatics who do it openly and “in your face” are not the ones who really care about their children as much as their own political agendas. Some insist on nursing their children until they reach school age and the mother is told she cannot come on the school bus. At least in my experience, there are very few of these types of women in the frum community and most exercise common sense. Agree the my definition of “common sense” may clash with your definition of 100 percent tziniusdik/.

Best advice: Follow your head, then your heart and if all else fails, follow the eitzah from Joseph.

Meno:

According to a recent survey, forty-seven states, DC and the Virgin Islands have adopted laws that specifically allow moms to breastfeed in any public or private location. Two of the remaining states — South Dakota and Virginia — exempt breastfeeding moms from public indecency laws, and Idaho is the only state that has yet to pass any similar laws. Currently, the only protection nursing moms have in Idaho is jury duty exemption. I’m not allowed to post the link for this survey of state laws but if you google, you will find same results (or roughly similar since the terminology and degree of exemption from specific statutes may vary by survey). From a medical perspective, there are peer review studies that highlight the importance for nursing moms to nurse when their own and the baby’s needs dictate

I don’t see Joe’s views as mainstream even among my yeshivish friends, much less as typical of the MO or frum tzibur in general. If you are saying that Joe is the resident troll and should be ignored, than perhaps I give his rants too much credence from an obviously “leftist” perspective….However, when he keeps pushing the same perspective on seemingly a new thread every few days, and seeks to legitimize an ignorant and hurtful view of young women who c’v havent’ married in their teens, than I will respond since these view have a long-term hurtful impact on so many b’nos yisroel who make their own life choices that include personal growth and education.

Not sure if you realize that there may be some young men and women (who for some reason I cannot personally relate to) do not want to marry and have children. Thats clearly the exception in the frum tzibur and off your radar screen but those numbers are actually rising, albeit based on anecdotal data. My personal objection is the tendency to label those individuals as dysfunctional, damaged goods or whatever since we don’t know (nor should we) why they may have made the decision to defer marriage or simply not to marry.

Hey Joe….Irs not just the courts….the majority of states, including many of the “torah belt states”, have enacted laws giving women the legal right to nurse their babies in any public location. A baby doesn’t care if the mother is at home, on the subway or in shul. When they want to be fed, they let the mother know. Most women typically find some way of nursing their child in a discrete way but thats the mother’s chocie. If something as natural as nursing a baby troubles you than perhaps you need to deal with that issue

It is not up to the phone dealer to install filters prior to selling a device to yidden….given the vast diversity of opinions among rabbonim about smartphones and their use, its up to each individual to follow the guidance of their local rav/posek in terms of what level of filtering (if any) they should install. If these idiots who demonstrate at the home of this dealer don’t want to use any smarphone, thats their deicsion but its not their right to impose their views on others.

It is comical that in the 21st century, t is predominantly men who are postulating on what is good for women’s spiritual, physical and economic well being. Clearly, looking around at the state of affairs in many areas of the tzibur, they have been doing a great job. Perhaps wake up and realize that a young woman is no more susceptible to the yetzer horah than a man ( and biologically probably less so). As one of the other posters noted, a young woman with strong hashkafah and upbriinging can find many opportunities for pursuing her edcuation and career without compromising her yiddeshkeit, If she chooses to delay starting a family for several years, thats probably a net positive for the future success of that family since she will be able to contribute to their economic and educational well being.

Several posters’ (in this thread and others) voiced variations of Joe’s theme that “going to college somehow reduces a girl’s ruchniyos outlook on life…”. Not sure how to respond to such a misogynistic allegation other than to note that bochurim are equally (if not more) susceptible to “worldly” influences once they step outside the narrow yeshiva/kollel world they have evolved from….in fact, girls attending college to be able to assure a parnassah for themselves and a prospective choson probably have greater maturity and more discipline to focus on what they are there for (i.e. obtaining job skills) and less on the more secular, mundane or social aspects of college life that Joe worries will adversely affect her ruchnioyos

Given that there is a wide spectrum of views among rabbonim on the use of smartphones and PDAs with various filtering apps installed, there can be no singular “daas torah” as some of the above postings have suggested with respect to the sale of these devices. Yes, there is a legal right for these zealots to demonstrate on the public right of way but most normal yidden would strongly object to such a protest at the merchant’s home on Shabbos. Just because something is legal under civil law does not make it “right”.

Hatzola members are trained extensively on how/when to intervene in domestic abuse situations, including when to summon police or other first responders…I don’t think it is possible to generalize since each event will be very fact driven and they will need to rely upon their judgment as to the appropriate action. As someone else noted above, those decisions have to get made in real time and don’t always provide the opportunity to call “time-out” and consult with experts.

Just one question to all those who have posted above….would your answer to the original question have been different if the neighbor were not frum…..perhaps MO, reform or even a goy? For those of us whose view is that one should always err on the side of caution and summon first responders when one had reason to believe it was a case of possible physical abuse, the identify of the possible abuser (or the abused) shouldn’t make any difference whatsoever. Our obligations to protect another person are not a function of their hashkafah.

While its a fun idea for a thread, not every minhag has any rational basis….how many times do we here that we do it because, “thats the way it was done in the alte heim”…maybe 200 hundred years from now people will say simply that the inyan for some practice is because thats the way it the experts in the YWN CR said it should be done

Thanks Winnie….very cogent and thoughtful analysis. However, your takeaway is the key point…today and going forward, more focus should be on the individual and less on the family’s pedigree….it may be relevant for purchasing a racehorse but less for a prospective spouse

What ever happend to the quaint notion of judging a baas yisroel by her own knowledge of daas torah, her own midos and her own attributes rather than focusing on her father, her brothers, or her machatunim? It seems every other week there is another thread on some variation of this theme of shidduchim driven by the yichus of the choson or kallah rather than focusing on the individuals and their own merits.

Is there some special quality to the Litvish yeshivos in Lakewood that attracts frum families from outside the NJ area or is it like all the car dealerships clustering in the same are of a busy highway in terms of yidden simply wanting to reside where there is already a flourishing frum community? For many of these families, living in a diverse community is a negative rather than positive….another question is what this means for the long-term economic and employment growth in Lakewood. Will these new residents, in turn, help generate new jobs and expand the community tax base?