Gadolhadorah

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  • in reply to: free day care for the kollel wife #1289477
    Gadolhadorah
    Participant

    The vast majority of young families in the frum tzibur are very responsible, work incredibly hard and pay their bills on time. However, there are a small number who sustain the stereotype of the irresponsible and bumbling kollel yungerleit who somehow have a sense of entitlement that the tzibur owes them a parnassah and the “stuff” they need (childcare, chinuch, rental payment, groceries etc) should be free or paid by others. If you try to collect an overdue bill its like they say, “the Ebeshter will take care of my obligations since I’m shteiging 24×7) . Again, this is a tiny minority of frum familes but they convey a much large negative image which gets magnified by the retelling of these incidents.

    in reply to: Is it illegal for the president to delete a tweet? #1289363
    Gadolhadorah
    Participant

    No. In the same way that Hillary was required to keep copies of her private emails that had any work-related subject matter, so is Trump. Any Tweets on national policy issues are “work-related”; any tweets regarding his personal social life (assuming he has any) or his views on a movie he saw over the weekend can be deleted.

    in reply to: Reliable Hashgacha? #1289359
    Gadolhadorah
    Participant

    Just go with any reputable chassideshe hashgacha, the gold standard of kashruth. While there are some competent litivsh hashgachos, there are few cases where there have been cases of deceit or outright fraud we have sadly seen over the years where mashgichim are paid to “look the other way” or themselves are part of a conspiracy to offer treifus to unsuspecting yidden.

    in reply to: Anti Zionist demonstration planned in Barclays Center #1288431
    Gadolhadorah
    Participant

    Why not acknowledge that there are a range of views on the issue of draft registration and/or ANY form of cooperation with efforts to recruit frum bochurim to some form of public service. Along with many chashuve rabbonim, I believe there are ways that bochurim coming out of high school can and should be required to participate in some form of alternative service to the tzibur that would not threaten his hashkafah while providing needed service to the tzibur (even filling in for a reservist who is called up for active duty, working in hospitals or other mosdos serving the Chareidi neighborhoods, etc). They could provide such service while continuing to learn several hours a day. Instead, the issue has been framed to make it impossible to find any middle ground and intensify the already enormous gap between segments of Israeli society.

    in reply to: free day care for the kollel wife #1288406
    Gadolhadorah
    Participant

    Drop the yinglach off at Joseph’s house….consistent with his view that all bnos yisroel should “stay at home” and “don’t belong out in the world”, he has graciously offered free day care for all YWN readers who must work for a parnassah so he has the opportunity to provide them musar as to the error of their ways…he will also provide free rent, car insurance and to the first ten women, a free tichel

    in reply to: Anti Zionist demonstration planned in Barclays Center #1288377
    Gadolhadorah
    Participant

    If anyone really believes that these type of “anti-Zionist” demonstrations, kinus, asifahs etc. do not contribute to the global pressures on EY, increased anti-Semitism, J-Street type groups, divestment of holdings in Israeli companies etc. you are sadly mistaken. None of these individually can be traced to a particular event but collectively they weaken EY. Having dozens of black hats by the U.N. screaming anti-Israeli rants or thousands at Barclays defaming the IDF only bring smiles to the white supremacists, racists, and Islamic terrorists. If that is your agenda and you think these demonstrations will bring down the medinah, you will not be successful.

    in reply to: Anti Zionist demonstration planned in Barclays Center #1287939
    Gadolhadorah
    Participant

    Whether this event is held in NYC, Yerushalayim or Bnai Brak, its stated purpose is the issue, NOT the venue. The ability to physically defend against terrorism is an existential issue for EY and those rabbonim and askanim or promote defiance of the draft law or encourage verbal and physical assaults on the brave chayalim of the IDF will hopefully incur the consequences of their actions. For decades, EY had a workable system for providing draft waivers for true learners, not the tens of thousand of bochurim who seemingly have time on their hands for every sort of demonstration rather than shteiging 24×7.

    in reply to: Anti Zionist demonstration planned in Barclays Center #1287528
    Gadolhadorah
    Participant

    The NK and some of the Satmar zealots are NOT “ultra-orthodox” Jews but a fringe group of Jewish descent who claim to represent the “true” version of their religious faith to the same extent ISIS claims to represent “true Islam”. Bachol dor v’dor we find a small number of disturbed individuals seeking to glorify themselves in the guise of Kiddush hashem but instead put all of Klal Yisroel at risk. Fortunately, in every case, the Ebeshter has squashed these efforts and will do so again here.

    in reply to: Revert Changes To YWN Website! #1287332
    Gadolhadorah
    Participant

    As Gadol Hadorah, I think my opinion should carry much greater weight than those of a poishete “Rabbi”. In this case, I think the new website is much cleaner and easier to navigate. End of discussion.

    in reply to: Anti Zionist demonstration planned in Barclays Center #1287310
    Gadolhadorah
    Participant

    What was originally meant as a limited waiver of the draft for a small number of serious learners has morphed over the years to a sense of entitlement for ANY chareidi bochur to avoid the draft or any form of alternative public service and shift the burden on to others. There are tens of thousands of frum bochurim who have served in the IDF and who gain valuable professional and leadership skills and go on to live a life of torah while contributing the welfare of the medinah. The small number of rabbonim who encourage the Peleg demonstrations that disrupt the evergday lives of hundreds of thousand of yidden in Yerushalayim and who tolerate the vile attacks on the chayalim of the IDF who walk on the streets of yerushalayim are the ones who should be condemned.

    in reply to: Anti Zionist demonstration planned in Barclays Center #1286452
    Gadolhadorah
    Participant

    You miss the point…we need BOTH the IDF and limud torah. At virtually every point in our history, limud torah has not meant turning our backs on self-defense. These rabbonim (and R’ Auerbach and the mindless “Pelegim” in EY) have decided that everyone else except them should leave their families and risk their lives to protect the tzibur.

    in reply to: Anti Zionist demonstration planned in Barclays Center #1286369
    Gadolhadorah
    Participant

    Have the two rabbonim (Shechter and Wachtflacht) who are the featured speakers at this “asifah against the draft” (aka Bash the IDF) offered any intelligent proposals as to how EY should defend itself against terrorists if everyone gets a draft derferral? Have they proposed some form of alternative public service for the yungerleit who they insist not serve in the IDF? I guess they believe that if everyone just sits and shteigs behind a shtender , the terrorists will simply go away and attack Lichtenstein. Its too bad the IDF cannot just selectively protect the rest of EY and leave these idiots to fend for themselves.

    in reply to: Anti Zionist demonstration planned in Barclays Center #1286253
    Gadolhadorah
    Participant

    While everyone is entitled to their (wrong) opinion, its difficult to avoid the most harsh and angry words for the despicable yidden who would create such a high profile event to bash EY and its institutions. Yes, there are some worth Satmar mosdos who do incredible work here in hospitals etc., this chilul hashem trivializes those efforts. One does not explicitly wish bad outcomes for other yidden but in this case, perhaps just for those in the leadership of this event whose theme threatens the legitimacy of EY at a time its very existence is being challenged from anti-semitim on all sides. Their mindless claims that all yidden would be safe and thrive in a Palestinian controlled state until z’man moisiach are evidence of how out of touch with reality they are. Hopefully, they might realize the evil they plan and do tshuvah before this actually moves forward.

    in reply to: Bride's Wedding Vow to Obey Husband #1286271
    Gadolhadorah
    Participant

    As you read through this thread, it seems that many posters are in denial and would like to revert back to a bygone era in the Alte Heim where women stayed at home because it was a social norm for the society they lived-in, goyishe and yiddeshe, and there were very few opportunities for women to pursue their own education and careers. B”YH, that world is GONE FOREVER, and today more than 50 percent of the students pursuing graduate degrees in professions such as medicine, law, social work, education etc. are women. Also, there are an incredible number of frum Jewish women who have found ways to maintain their yiddeshkeit and hashkafah while also pursuing their education. Yes, for those kollel yungerleit who want a “stay-at-home” baas yisroel with a very limited secular education wnd no real job skills, I’m sure the inventory is well-stocked (if one believes the constant drumbeat of “shidduch crisis” stories here) but increasingly, both young men and women are finding their beschert among those who have realized the opportunities the Ebeshter has provided and pursuing them through advanced education. These men and women are more likely to treat one another as “equals” and don’t take seriously the notion of subordination of women to their husbands.

    in reply to: Mechitza? #1285619
    Gadolhadorah
    Participant

    There is no objective standard as to what is a “chumrah”. If a certain practice goes beyond the plain language and common understanding of the parameters of a halacha and “going the extra mile” makes you feel stronger in your emunah, than to you, its not a “chumrah”, since you’ve already move the baseline (both intellectually and spiritually) to your practice. To you, its “what you do”; to others, “its a chumrah”.

    in reply to: Mechitza? #1285535
    Gadolhadorah
    Participant

    If the internet itself is mamash tameh according to some gadolim, how can a mechitza on the internet even be considered whether per halacha/chumrah or otherwise. We don’t typically debate whether its mutar to use cholov stam or cholov yisroel in a recipe for cooking chazerfleish

    in reply to: calling a gadol hador with a shaila β˜ŽοΈβ” #1285237
    Gadolhadorah
    Participant

    iacisrmma

    Yes, we are fortunate to have many “legitimate” gadolei torah and other chashuva rabbonim who are certainly big tzadikim and talmedei chachamim and are sometimes also referred to as “gadolim” but probably in a second or third tier. Many of their followers may regard them as “gadolim” but the last time I checked, there is no official certifying body for gadolim. There are a small number of gadolim who are so regarded by just about every frum yid, but if you asked the CR readers here to a “top 10” list, I suspect there would only be 4 or 5 names who would be on everyone’s list.

    in reply to: calling a gadol hador with a shaila β˜ŽοΈβ” #1284507
    Gadolhadorah
    Participant

    Too bad most legitimate gadolim assur the internet since the most efficient way to provide the tzibur with objective and valid information on matters of halacha would be for them to schedule one hour a week when they will hold “online office hours”. Those with shailos could post their questions on line (anonymously of course), the questions could be screened by the Rav’s more hip and internet savy gaaboim and they could post his answers on line. This way we wouldn’t have these silly posts which say, I heard from someone in my charusah, who heard in shul that someone said in the name of Rav XYZ, shlita that it is assur for the shaliach tzibur to klop on the bima during SE to shush the daveners”…We constantly hears these “in the name of” psaks or letters attributed to different Gadolim which often sound questionable but there is no way to confirm.

    in reply to: calling a gadol hador with a shaila β˜ŽοΈβ” #1284359
    Gadolhadorah
    Participant

    Have you considered using this forum to “screen” potential shailos for gadolim? Where else would you find such a well-informed focus group willing to offer their opinions on just about any issue of daas torah, halacha or hashkafah with no need to stand on line, exchange multiple emails or voice mail messages with some gaaboim or make a contribution to anyone’s favorite mosdos

    Gadolhadorah
    Participant

    Well, if you want to be creative, you can call breakfast a “late Shabbos dinner” and daven Vasikin. I think in Megilla, 23(a) it ways that we are supposed to come to Shul “early” on Shabbos and one of the maforshim (Rashi?) adds that this means that one should come early enough to daven Vasikin.

    in reply to: calling a gadol hador with a shaila β˜ŽοΈβ” #1284000
    Gadolhadorah
    Participant

    Well, if you willing to submit the question here in the CR to a second tier Gadolhador(ah), I’d be glad to share my thoughts but presumably you are seeking input from a higher level of daas torah. As another noted above, however, why the venue shopping for responses from multiple gadolim? Do you want to be certain you will get the “right answer”? Is your local rav/posek incapable of providing an informed answer

    in reply to: davening in public #1283502
    Gadolhadorah
    Participant

    All these comments about the volumetric levels of asher yatzar etc. presume the individual has a modicum of common sense and situational awareness such that one is not disruptive of others or otherwise draw attention to himself unnecessarily. If you are on an airplane, it would be grossly inappropriate to return to one’s seat from the lav and then perform a very loud rendition of asher yatzar so that all your fellow passengers know you have successfully performed some bodily functions. Likewise, in a nice restaurant, you wouldn’t disrupt the dining of others nearby by being unnecessarily loud in a baracha or birchas ha’mazon (whereas in a Pizza shop you might not be so worried about adding to the already high decibel level).

    in reply to: davening in public #1283159
    Gadolhadorah
    Participant

    There are several hotel restaurants in EY with hashgacha where one can order an off-menu fleishig dish for breakfast that is served from the regular (dinner) kitchen with all the proper precautions; the general preference NOT to serve fleishig is simply the logistics of offering both milchig and fleishig meals concurrently and the likelihood that the wait staff mixing up dishes, utensils, etc. obviously, if one is grabbing his/her own breakfast at home, these are not concerns as would be the case in a commercial setting.

    Edited

    in reply to: Can You Imagine the Uproar if Obama had… #1282923
    Gadolhadorah
    Participant

    In general, Americans don’t like foreign leaders criticizing our own leaders, whatever their own political preferences. I recall how Obama was trashed by Trump for disparaging Lefarge and the Brexit leadership before the vote. I suspect Netanyahu did himself no favors today with American public opinion by his backhanded comments about Obama. Many recall that Obama used “Bush’s recession” to excuse the dismal performance of our economy for the 4 years of his first term. We don’t need Trump using Obama as a piΓ±ata for the next 4 years to divert attention from his own non-stop and generally self-inflicted screw-ups.

    in reply to: davening in public #1282922
    Gadolhadorah
    Participant

    Have we now invented some chumrah against eating fleishig for breakfast….leftover Chulent on Sunday morning…yummm

    in reply to: Losing the battle against technology? βš”οΈ πŸ“΅ #1282920
    Gadolhadorah
    Participant

    There have been many movements since the industrial revolution in the past 200-250 years to push back against technology and its social, cultural and economic consequences. In other words, and to coin a phrase, ba’chol dor v’dor there are Luddites who have tried to put their finger in the dike to fend off sometimes intimidating changes in the way technology changes our day to day lives. In virtually all cases, these efforts have not succeeded. Perhaps the only exception are those religious groups, including some of our own, who have the discipline to refuse change and find ways to continue life as it was in the Alte Heim in our case. When the motivation is deeply held emunah (as in your case) rather than a vague political philosophy, there are always ways to manage. Over time, its possible that a younger generation of rabbonim may “move the goalposts” as to what is acceptable based on having a better understanding of how technology works rather than redefining Halacha. Much hatzlacha to you in wherever you come out in resolving your own individual conflicts.

    in reply to: davening in public #1281951
    Gadolhadorah
    Participant

    As a matter of tzinius, we don’t seek to call attention to ourselves in a public venue in any aspect of our haskafah. At the same time, we don’t need to “hide” either if the occasion arises for making a baracha or any other mitzvah. The point is to use common sense and “modesty” in all aspects of our lives. B’H, we live today, for the most part, where we have nothing to fear from the free and open exercise of our religion.

    in reply to: davening in public #1281404
    Gadolhadorah
    Participant

    Most of us manage to find a “private” place, even when in “public” to say barachos. I don’t know many frum yidden who would march out of a public bathroom at any airport or shopping mall and start shuttling back and forth with kavanah and do a loud, vocal rendition of “asher yatzar” using a nigun attributed to his rebbe. Its almost always possible, even in public, to find a corner spot or behind a column etc. to make a baracha, whatever the circumstances, without calling a lot of attention to oneself.

    in reply to: Why the husband is in the driver’s seat πŸ€΅πŸš— #1281406
    Gadolhadorah
    Participant

    I see lots of women drivers in the frum neighborhoods in the city and fewer on the occasions wt drive through Monsey or in Lakewood…that’s my experience…you have yours. Perhaps you have done a traffic survey so share your sources.

    in reply to: dating YOUNGER #1281367
    Gadolhadorah
    Participant

    Just about every medical professional would advise against marrying a first cousin; yes, there are many thingks that are allowed under daas torah but that doesn’t mean you are obligated to do them. The torah allows a number of punishments including stoning for a variety of “crimes’ (putting aside whether or not we have a Sanhedrim), allows for taking multiple wives (putting aside Rav Gershhon’s thoughts on the issue), etc. etc. Just because something is allowed by either Torah or civil law doesn’t mean its a good idea in the context of modern society and norms. I’m sure Joseph may feel its a great idea (and he can find a rav to give him a heter) to marry his 15 YO first cousin but that doesn’t mean 99.9 percent of yidden today would do so.

    in reply to: Why the husband is in the driver’s seat πŸ€΅πŸš— #1281361
    Gadolhadorah
    Participant

    If you travel anywhere near Willy or BP, you will frequently see the woman in the driver’s seat dropping off her husband at the shul or subway station with the kids in the back; I’m sure its different in Lakewood and Monsey but in the City, there are fewer frum families with their own cars, and among those probably a greater percentage of women dirvers.

    Gadolhadorah
    Participant

    The reality is that many frum parents show up at yeshivot with a mindset that the posted tuition is a “starting point for negotiation” and that its up to the yeshiva to figure out how to accommodate their kids within the budgets they have allocated. They view a yeshiva education as more of an entitlement (just like a public school education) than a obligation on their own parts to secure and pay for. While most frum parents of lesser economic means are greatly appreciative of the scholarships and grants they receive and allow their kids to be admitted, most schools administrators will tell you that a small handful of frum parentsroutinely take up the percentage of their time and are the loudest and most-confrontational on tuition-related issues.

    in reply to: dating YOUNGER #1281080
    Gadolhadorah
    Participant

    There will always be some who try to rationalize children marrying children so they can rush to have more children. If thats there hashkafah, thats fine but as CT Lawyer and others have noted, all the empirical studies that have been done, including those of the heimish tzibur here in the U.S. and Chareidi tzibur in EY, the divorce rates are materially higher for those who marry in the 16-19 age bracket versus those who waited a few years. Yes, its legal, but so is marrying your first cousin in 7 states and it doesn’t make it “right”.

    in reply to: dating YOUNGER #1281043
    Gadolhadorah
    Participant

    There is no “appropriate” age…its whatever the young man and woman decide its right for them. As more of our young men and women realize the need to obtain the needed education and job skills to earn a parnassah its inevitable that the age of kiddushin will move into the early 20s or later. Some may want to learn and go to college part-time so it will take several years longer to graduate college and finish an advanced degree.

    in reply to: I Hope Trump Gets Impeached πŸŽΊπŸ‘ #1280795
    Gadolhadorah
    Participant

    To RebYid23
    Chazal (along with Reb Avraham Lincoln) bring down that under certain circumstances a tail can be considered a leg for purposes of extending the length of t’chum Shabbos. Having said that, its not clear if having Hillary instead of Mike Pence as our Supreme Leader will make a tail’s worth of difference in the lives of 99% of Americans.

    in reply to: Heartzig Shavuos davening #1280616
    Gadolhadorah
    Participant

    As noted above, you are unlikely to find many β€œleibidik” shachris minyanim on Shavuos…most of the potential “celebrants” are barely awake and feel fortunate they can daven with a modicum of kavanah.

    in reply to: I Hope Trump Gets Impeached πŸŽΊπŸ‘ #1280576
    Gadolhadorah
    Participant

    The best oddsmakers are the bookies in London who are now showing a 38% likelihood that Trump will not complete his 4 year term…problem is that would cover either an impeachment vote (and Senate conviction), invocation of the 25th Amendment following a coup de’ tat by Pence and the cabinet, OR the Trumpkopf simply getting bored and Tweeting one morning that he has sucessfully drained the Swamp, made America great again and is resigning from office so he can go back to NYC and chase chipmonks in Central Park.

    in reply to: Age differences in shidduchim πŸ‘΅πŸ‘¨ #1280207
    Gadolhadorah
    Participant

    To Joseph….its mamash child abuse to push them into marriage at 13-16, and probably a bad idea before 18 or 19. If you want to troll on this issue, I’m sure you’ll find other to take the bait but unless your having substantial issues of your own, please don’t suggest kiddushin for children

    in reply to: Trump Eating in Israel #1277862
    Gadolhadorah
    Participant

    Personal opinions with a bit of humor/sarcasm/parody/satire….plenty of opportunity for “serious” news on the regular news threads.

    P.S. I’m not a big Tumpkopf cheerleader but always willing to share some thoughts on POTUS’ responsibilities with respect to fine dining and healthy eating.

    in reply to: Trump Eating in Israel #1277704
    Gadolhadorah
    Participant

    To Yosef: He is NOT a chossid of any particular rebbe but has historically been a good friend and supporter of the Chabad shaliach in 5T who, in turn, recruited the mashgichim to fly over with him to EY to kasher the ambassador’s residence. In fairness, Ambassador Friedman has been a great supporter of many worthy mosdos as well as some settlement groups in Yehuda and Shomron, which were noted at his confirmation hearings.

    in reply to: Age differences in shidduchim πŸ‘΅πŸ‘¨ #1277665
    Gadolhadorah
    Participant

    You don’t need to remind me that some provisions of state law remain in place from common law predicates from an agrarian society in the 1600s and our politically impotent legislators don’t want to rewrite legal concepts which trigger extreme passions on moral and religious holdings so they leave the status quo. As to our “zaidas and bubbes” marrying as children, not sure if you truly believe that’s a good idea in contemporary society or your just trolling us…either way, its a really stupid idea. Our children should be getting the best possible education in both limudei kodesh and whatever level of secular studies their parents’ haskahfah will allow. They should be allowed to work for a while to accumulate at least a minimal level of savings to support themselves in the event their parents lack the resources to support them. Most importantly, they should be allowed to mature naturally rather than being subject to these bizarre pressures in some circles to marry asap, lest they (especially the girls) be deemed “damaged goods”. One can not hope for good outcomes for anyone who creates such pressures or engages in the lashon haroh about boys and girls in their 20s and 30s who have chosen to defer kiddushin.

    in reply to: Age differences in shidduchim πŸ‘΅πŸ‘¨ #1277589
    Gadolhadorah
    Participant

    To Joseph:
    So if we hold by your standards, the parents of an unmarried baas yisroel at the age of 15 should be in full scale panic, have every shadchan in willy and BP on retainer and be flying over to EY for a segulah or tefillah for a shidduch through some rav who charges top dollar but who guarantees 100 percent success …Its scary that some actually think in terms of children of 13 years (aka “adults”)are ready for marriage and making babies…no wonder there is such hysteria in the frum tzibur about a so called “shiduch crisis”

    in reply to: Trump Eating in Israel #1277587
    Gadolhadorah
    Participant

    To Lowertuition: Its way too soon to focus on either impeachment or invocation of the 25th Amendment…..In the interim, the President should be allowed to enjoy his first (and perhaps only) visit to EY. His first meal should be the official residence of the U.S. Ambassador whose kitchen has just been koshered by a Rav from 5T who flew over to EY with a team of the finest Chassidish mashgichim since there were apparently no competent mashgichim available in EY who could guarantee that the mehadrim standards of our Ambassador Reb Friedman would be met. Since the WH announced today that they’ve cancelled the campaign rally reportedly to be held at Massadah, the President will have sufficient time to dine in style at one of the 40+ McDonalds in EY, many of which also have chassideshe hashgacha, albeit not with McNuggets from chickens with a 5T vaad plumba.

    in reply to: Age differences in shidduchim πŸ‘΅πŸ‘¨ #1277298
    Gadolhadorah
    Participant

    To ema2five:
    Mazel tov on making it through 27 years and may you have at least 27 more….
    Its unclear why there is so much focus on the possible risks of delaying marriage “C’V” to your late 20s and early 30s rather than openly discussing the real issue of pushing down the age of kiddushin to the teens and then expecting children having children to behave like adults.

    in reply to: Frum Jews in Meron for Lag B’Omer #1277263
    Gadolhadorah
    Participant

    Its hard for those not similarly motivated why yidden feel a compulsion to daven at the kevorim of certain tzadikim without regard to the logistics of getting there and the potential consequences. I’ve never been a fan of the annual rush to Uman for Rosh Hashanah at a cost of thousands of NIS and indirect support for the world’s biggest anti-semitim. Does anyone really believe either Rav SBY, Z’TL or Rav Nachman, Z”TL would intercede with the Ebeshter on their behalf to a lesser degree if a yid davened with kavanah from a different location or on any other day of the year??

    in reply to: Age differences in shidduchim πŸ‘΅πŸ‘¨ #1277111
    Gadolhadorah
    Participant

    This happens all the time….both should have the independent judgment and maturity to make it work; certainly more so than two teenagers being pushed into a shiduch by their families. While there is no guarantee in shiduchim at any age, there are many reasons why one or both may have deferred marriage while pursuing graduate school, professional training etc.

    Gadolhadorah
    Participant

    We frequently hear that the importance of having the necessary education and skills to earn a parnassah is overstated and there are “many” successful chareidim that have achieved financial success without even having gone to college, much less earning an advanced degree. Yes, I’m sure there are natural, self-taught entrepreneurs who have made millions but I suspect that is a very small percentage of the Chareidi tzibur. Sadly, the poverty and welfare dependency statistics for many chareidi neighborhoods and communities tells a very different story. Likewise, its true we have always had full time learners, but again, as a percentage of the total, the numbers were much lower in the pre-war alte Heim and in post-War EY and the United State than they are today. While some girls may be fortunate enough to come from affluent families who have the resources to support them, in most cases, the families are already living on the economic margin and the absurdly high costs of a chassanah and then weekly checks to to support a new son-in-law who wants to shteig 24×7 puts them over the breaking point. We need to encourage more girls to get the secular education and job skills so they can be economically self-reliant and revisit the quaint notion of finding some balance where after a few years, a kollel yungerleit will work part time to help support the family while still finding many hours a day to learn as well. That has been our historic tradition and we need to move back towards economic self-reliance across all yideshe families. There is no imperative to marry in your late teens versus early 20s so you’ve had the opportunity to get at least 2 years of college with a focus on employment skills for available jobs that can be done from home (aka computer skills for tele-working).

    Gadolhadorah
    Participant

    Every society and religious group has their own “Luddites” who have spiritual and moral concerns with innovations and new technology. While many of us disagree with the decision of the Rosh Yeshiva, I doubt this policy will result in empty seats in the beis medrash since there are more bochurim seeking admission than can possibly be accommodated. Putting aside the obvious issue that those coming out of this yeshiva will lack basic skills for a parnassah,, many of the most exciting and original thoughts in the world of torah learning are only available on the internet so they are denying their students access to daas torah from the next generation of more computer friendly talmedei chachamim.

    Gadolhadorah
    Participant

    “The kallah’s family giving the chasan a dowry is an age old Jewish minhag’

    The concept of a dowry is NOT uniquely a yiddeshe minhag and many traditional and tribal societies arrange for the girl’s family to initially provide some gift, whether a sum of money, a few goats and cows, or whatever the local minhag. However, once they are married, why is there any rational basis for the girl’s family to continue supporting them, if the boy is a full time learner? The girl may decide to work but the girl’s family may have other children at home to support (both boys and girls) so it makes no sense to have such a unilateral funding obligation. Again, its what people willingly agree to and such practices may be the local minhag but we should be moving towards the next generation where there are opportunities for bochurim to work part-time so as to provide at least minimal support for their families and also provide better education and job skills to girls so they can support their husbands if they don’t want to work even a few hours a week.

    Gadolhadorah
    Participant

    To Winnie: Why do you say its the minhag for the wife and/or her family tsupport a full time kollel yungerman? I would assume that he would first seek support from his own family first before asking his wife’s to support them and turn to his the machatonim only if his own parents are unable to help.

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