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CS,
Chabad has every right to think that the departed Rebbe, zt”l is Mashiach and the rest of Jewry has every right to think that Chabad is beyond the pale because of it.
Menachem,
How are Chabad chassidim who attend college nowadays viewed, especially if they come from geza families?
Menachem,
Isn’t it ironic that the Rebbe had an advanced secular education but his chassidim are forbidden from doing the same?
CS,
I most certainly do want a clear answer, “yes” or “no”. Do you consider it within the realm of possibility that someone besides any of the seven Lubavitcher Rebbeim, zt”l will be Mashiach?
Joseph,
OTD has many causes, such as dysfunctional families, learning issues, abuse, emotional problems, alcohol, drugs and poverty. One factor is the feeling of being trapped with a lack of options in life and a limited secular education is part of that. While there are unfortunately a growing number of OTD girls many experts believe they are still outnumbered by boys. Or has your “first hand community work on the issue in multiple municipalities” informed you otherwise?
N0,
Get real. Almost thirty years after his passing, even “normal” Chabad people can’t conceive of anyone aside from the Rebbe, zt”l being Mashiach. As a result, many Jews don’t trust their Geirus, Kashrus, and communal organizations. The entire yeshiva world has nothing but disdain for them, the Chassidic world has rejected them and MO leaders have compared their bizarre convictions to early Christian doctrine.
As the decades pass, the number of Chabad houses may increase but they have morphed into a personality cult built around a long departed leader. What a waste.
CS,
So the only person you would consider to be Mashiach is someone who was niftar almost three decades ago? And you wonder why everyone thinks Chabad has gone off the reservation?
Joseph,
No, it doesn’t. From what I’m told, the secular education for Lakewood High Schools girls is generally pretty good. The girls have no problem finding decent paying jobs since employers know they acclimate very quickly.
CS,
Please confirm whether you consider it within the realm of possibility that someone besides any of the seven Lubavitcher Rebbeim, zt”l will be Mashiach.
Menachem,
Once again, please confirm whether you, an apparently knowledgeable Chabad chasid considers it within the realm of possibility that someone besides any of the seven Lubavitcher Rebbeim, zt”l will be Mashiach.
A one word answer will suffice without need of further explanation or going in circles. Why are you so afraid to answer this simple question?
Menachem,
It will simply confirm whether an apparently knowledgeable Chabad chasid considers it within the realm of possibility that someone besides any of the seven Lubavitcher Rebbeim, zt”l will be Mashiach.
A one word answer will suffice without need of further explanation or going in circles. Why are you afraid to answer the question?
Menachem,
Your answer to this vital question is not pointless and I don’t need to understand your reasoning, so with a “yes” or “no”:
Do you consider it within the realm of possibility that someone besides any of the seven Lubavitcher Rebbeim, zt”l will be Mashiach and would you accept this person as your King?
Menachem,
Do you consider it within the realm of possibility that someone besides any of the seven Lubavitcher Rebbeim, zt”l will be Mashiach and would you accept this person as your King?
Aveira,
The Gemara and Medrash tell us that of course it was intended to be permanent, just as Chizkiyahu was intended to be Mashiach and just as the Divine plan has been for us to be redeemed in every generation. When we aren’t worthy, it’s delayed until the next generation. That is why every generation that isn’t redeemed is considered to have had the Beis Hamikdash destroyed in their time.
Aveira,
I’m quite aware that they had nevi’im and we don’t. I was responding to your post on another thread where you claimed that “everyone knew bayis sheni was temporary” and that the state “holds back the true geulah”.
Your “halacha” of not going up en masse is the opinion of a daas yachid and not so “simple”. Which of the seven million Jews currently in Eretz Yisrael are violating it and where do you suggest they go?
Aveira,
We know from the Gemara in Yoma and Medrash Shir Hashirim that those who ignored the Nevi’im and stayed in Bavel during Bayis Sheni prevented it from becoming the final Beis Hamikdash.
Our redemption is held back by frum Jews who should know better constantly spewing criticism and hatred against other Jews and even worse, entire groups of Jews.
AAQ,
Please stop sidetracking common with any facts or questions. He’s busy watching YouTube videos on legal strategy to assist the chasid with a lawsuit that won’t happen.
Pekak,
I wrote “chasid”, which has other meanings and uses besides “chassidish”. You may want to read the entire thread from the beginning.
Pekak,
Who used the term “chassidish”?
Yay.
Hopefully, the chasid has learned the very important lesson of not touching other people’s children for any reason.
Joseph,
So this is your dissertation? Are you pursuing a degree with Cracker Jack U?
It does make a very strong argument in favor of formal High School secular education for boys.
Joseph,
The immodesty issues are probably much worse on an ocean liner than an airplane. Do you embark and disembark with blinders on, and stay in your cabin the entire time? Do you travel with a minyan and a Sefer Torah or do you forgo those for several weeks?
AAQ,
So Rabbeim should be happy with low salaries or even work for free? Do you?
Joseph,
What was the topic of and degree for which you wrote your dissertation?
Joseph,
How do you usually travel to Israel?
Joseph,
As usual, you have no grounds at all for your silly boich svara. The thousands of Kollel wives supporting husbands in learning by working at secular gentile culture workplaces Manhattan, Tel Aviv, etc., prove otherwise.
They obviously didn’t consult with you first on the halacha hotline you claim to answer. Why might that be?
Joseph,
The Gedolim felt otherwise when they began advocating for widespread Kollel learning after the Holocaust. They understood quite well that women would have to go out into the workplace and felt it was worth any drawbacks. They haven’t reversed that decision in the past eighty years.
Aveira,
This obviously triggers your insecurities but there are countless charedi women in the working world who’ve gotten a solid Bais Yaakov education, including a great deal of Halachic knowledge and Yiras Shamayim. They have then attained professional careers since this allows them to support husbands in Kollel for the long-term. The fact is most of them have opted not to get jobs in Jewish organizations or schools because the pay and benefits there are lousy.
I understand you can’t process this reality but they’re not spending hours every day bashing entire groups of Jews who are different from them. So their ruchnius is just fine; its yours that’s broken beyond repair.
Aveira,
Growing up MO and becoming a flip-out obviously gave you zero insight into the charedi world. There are countless women, both in this country and in Eretz Yisrael who successfully navigate frum and secular workplaces with strong foundations in Halacha and Yiras Shamayim. They do so together with their husbands, whom they often support in Kollel and based on the advice of their Poskim, with whom they frequently consult. Perhaps it doesn’t fit your small-minded worldview but it’s a daily reality.
Why don’t you worry about your own ruchnius and let them worry about theirs. They’re probably doing much better than you are.
yeshivaguy,
Due to Joseph’s “first hand community work on the issue in multiple municipalities”, Philly, Scranton, Long Beach, Denver and the other Lakewood-founded Mesivtas will be cancelling secular studies immediately; Not.
N0,
Are you actually accusing those who disagree with you of being untruthful?
N0,
Troubled children can result from lack of direction as well as learning disorders, emotional difficulties, dysfunctional families, poverty, abuse and other issues.
The yeshiva system exists to address the educational needs of all boys to prepare them for life, regardless of their challenges. The same is true of the educational system for girls. When the system cares more about promoting itself by being elitist, exclusionary and leaving children out, they are abrogating their mission. Unfortunately, too many parents blindly trust the system to raise the next generation and are unavailable when their children need guidance.
N0,
Once again, name the Mesivtas in Lakewood proper that currently offer High School secular studies with a full diploma. Also, boys are pushed to become white collar bachurim, not the blue collar teens whom the system could care less about.
N0,
It is very relevant. A struggling thirteen year old who knows there’s only one seemingly unachievable option in life is going to become hopeless, angry and quite possibly violent.
Joseph,
How enlightening. The persona you constantly display of never having stepped out of a very small area of Brooklyn must be due to your deep feelings of modesty and humility.
You have three wives, eighteen children, you’re a nuclear engineer and a chip designer, plus you give shiurim and answer halachic queries over the phone. How do you find the time to be so active as a volunteer in multiple communities?
Joseph,
Better look up that word in a dictionary. You once again proved by example that High School secular studies is a vital component of being a well-adjusted frum Jew in this country.
N0,
So giving struggling boys zero options in life aside from learning full time has nothing to do with their hopelessness, anger and violence?
N0,
Once again, which Mesivtas in Lakewood proper still offer High School secular studies?
N0,
Not true. There are plenty of Lakewood parents who independently educate their sons in High School secular studies or send them out of town to Philly, Long Beach, Scranton, etc.
Whether it was formally banned or all the Mesivtas decided together to stop offering them is just semantics.
N0,
Which Mesivtas in Lakewood proper still offer High School secular studies?
Joseph,
Yet, for more than fifty years after he was niftar Lakewood did have High School secular studies. Until the “experts” decided to forbid it but to continue allowing restaurants. They probably realized the now bored and even violent teens would need places to hang out and cause trouble.
guteyid,
Harav Aharon Kotler, zt”l, was niftar over half a century before High School secular studies became forbidden. He also didn’t want any restaurants in Lakewood but the “experts” don’t seem to care about that one, do they?
chaim_baruch,
You’re right, but the experts running Lakewood who forbade High School secular studies also don’t believe in any of those options and are now reaping the results of their myopia.
N0,
Great news! It’s been obvious for many months that the Rabbonim of Lakewood have no control over the violent teens in their community. Any friendly gestures have been met with mockery and scorn. Maybe these animals will get scared straight when the police crack down on them.
Joseph,
How did it taste?
AAQ,
Kol Torah in Bayit Vegan is indeed a beautiful yeshiva but the story with R. Yaakov, zt”l actually took place during his visit to Kol Yaakov in Bayit Vegan, the yeshiva founded by R. Adess.
Dorah,
Your persistent defense of Brainless Brandon by comparing him to someone no longer in office is growing more lame than he is. Your hypocrisy really shows when you cast your “boomerang curse” on Jews for wishing ill on politicians while you do the same thing yourself.
Do you get paid by the word or are you just wasting your life for nothing?
Dorah,
I’m surprised that your belief in what goes around comes around still allows you to freely wish harm on others with impunity, as you posted several weeks ago. Are you so blind to your own hypocrisy?
Dorah,
I’m familiar with the classic horror film and understood it was a political analogy. Given the death wish you issued several weeks ago and the “boomerang curse” you have threatened others with, you should be more careful with your own choice of words.
Dorah,
First you wish death upon someone and now you call people “the living dead”? right back at ya!