emes nisht sheker

At this point after all the attacks Trump has made on American Democracy if you are still pro-Trump you either don’t care about American Democracy or you are in the cult and believe whatever he does is automatically the best.

Thanks ubiq. Beyond odd that people are having trouble with this. Did I suggest that Obama’s book was not a memoir? It is really odd and feels like I am dealing with people unhinged from reality. My point, which you elaborated on nicely, was clear enough. I guess when a cult is having a crisis of belief it is expected that the disconnect from reality grows.

Trump wrote 19 books before being President. Obama and Bush are at four or five. Trump could have invested Daddy’s money and been just as well off (Fred was a good businessman). Instead he scammed people and did not pay his bills (he took advantage of the bankruptcy laws if you recall his brag from his 2016 campaign).

Oh, and you had to look to 2012 to find something Biden said you don’t like.

Yeah. And these guys are the supreme narcissists and I am the hypocrite.

Seriously, are you even being serious or are you just being a troll. As they say, don’t feed the trolls, so I am out of this.

Did I say Trump was an antisemite?

But glad you agree with my point that antisemites can employ Jews in high positions.

The implications are that your examples of elevating women or black people to various positions are not necessarily by themselves refutation of claims that he is misogynist or racist.

Not even saying he is misogynist or racist, rather I think mainly he is a supreme narcissist and thinks everyone not a member of his cult of personality is a traitor. And, he will use any and all language no matter how despicable to refer to those he disagrees with. If on the other hand your are a member of his cult, he would be hard pressed to find anything you do wrong (so long as you don’t challenge him). Even going so far as to seemingly praising white supremacists.

Health – Thanks for clarifying that you have no idea what practices are considered idolatry or to what extent it occurs in the US. Because, that is the only way you can suggest this country does not have a problem with idolatry. Statistics of people that follow various religions that are in halacha clearly considered idolatry are not hard to find. People also do this openly and proudly. This is far more egregious than abortion. But then again, when your politics are based in something other than the Torah guess it is easy to pick and choose your issues and say that you are representing God. Far harder to actually study what God wants from you and to represent that.

RatingStheRumpus – Wow, a reasonable conservative here. You can see from my own posts that I don’t agree with all your points, but nice to see someone actually who a debate can be had with. With the others here it is like, if you don’t agree with me then God hates you and you are a sinner and you hate America. While they happened before I was born, I recently listened to an old debate between Nixon and JFK. Disregarding any issues with Nixon later on, the tone of the debate was we both want what is best for this country but we disagree on how you get there. Not this sick, depraved view that the Trump cult espouses that Democrats hate this country.

Health – I get it. You are anti-abortion but pro-idolatry. Totally politics based in religion. Not sure why abortion occupies you so much but not idolatry. I know when it is convenient easy to pick and choose. Does not sound like anything based in the Torah rather just some cult-like mentality.

Btw, love how you simply ignore that you are all over the place. One comment you are talking about American History and the next you forgot all about it. It almost seems you just spout whatever thought comes to mind in the hope that something sticks.

Wow Health lots of anger in that post. You help show that the point of this post in the first place was to heap your righteous indignation on the Libs. What I appreciate that you have clearly shown is the ideological nature of whatever it is that you consider your political ideology is. Definitely it is not based in religion as you would be very opposed to freedom of religion which allows people to worship idols which is an affront to God. It is simply ridiculous how you decide that being anti-abortion is your religious calling and eradicating idolatry is not important. Clearly your politics are not based in Judaism. Maybe they are based in Limbaughism which has morphed into Trumpism.

You want to know what political viewpoints Democrats have or you want to heap on viewpoints you disagree with.
How about what political viewpoints you hold other than admiring Trump:

Lack of education opportunities for many thereby resulting in a dumber workforce and falling behind in the advances America makes?
Less taxes and a bigger deficit then Trump’s tax cuts already caused? Or tax policies that correlate with increasing economic inequity and the societal unrest that economic inequity is associated with (I know… Those jealous people are wrong… But they are still there)… Myself I do just fine economically and would most likely pay more tax under liberal policies, so not my direct personal financial interest here… Well, other than I think too much economic inequity can also be bad for the economy, whereas reducing it can be beneficial for the economy, so that would be good for me.
Less regulations thereby allowing companies to pollute dangerously and not be responsible for their actions causing society to suffer higher medical costs and dealing with the negative consequences.
No immigration thereby preventing employers from getting necessary workers (and justifying FDR’s actions in sending Jews to their deaths by closing borders)?
Not recognizing racism and allowing schisms in society to fester and grow causing untold harm to current and future generations?
Not recognizing issues with police and making sure they understand they need to respect the rights of those they police. How long did it take in Germany for a wonderful police force to be a participant in the most horrific crimes?
Anti-abortion and having the government intrude in private lives in a way the vast majority in this country don’t want (you want freedom of religion including ability for people to bow down to idols a serious sin, yet you want the Government to intrude in private lives with issues such as abortion… seems hypocritical… For the record I am very much pro freedom of religion and think the government should not get involved in abortion as most people in this country prefer)?
Blindly, pro the 2nd amendment, without any sensible limitations, and having a country with one of the worst gun related casualty rates (crime and otherwise).
Iran Deal??? – Does anyone here actually have the necessary info other than limited info that has been fed to them to even access whether this is good or bad? I definitely don’t. Not even sure why this is a political issue, rather it should be a question whether it is effective or not. Trump decided it was a political issue because before he was in office and had access to the necessary classified info he was decrying it. I have zero confidence that Trump’s actions in regard to it were based on actual intelligence and rather they were based on a campaign promise and his despise of Obama. All you need to think this way is to listen to pretty much everyone that worked with Trump and what they say about him afterwards.
Etc?

Lin Wood and Sydney Powell have been given the chance to present evidence and have not presented anything that holds up. Why anyone should believe them now is ridiculous. How many times do you get to lie and get tossed out of court before people call you a liar?

The explanation for why…

Cults have a way of making people do crazy things that don’t make sense otherwise. It destroys who you are as a person. Not unlike how so many fine Jews have become purveyors of lying because of their desire to be part of the Trump cult. If you would leave the Trump cult you would be able to regain your humanity and be a better person.

Calling the YWN liberal is a surely a joke. I guess since Trump decided that Fox News is not enough of a sycophant the so-called conservatives here (really they are Trump cultists) are all on OANN and Brietbart and now think that even generic right-wing stuff is liberal.

OD… Health has been ranting since the election about fraud (and his friend Syag has also asked why are folks not concerned about fraud)… The thing is, despite the microscope Trump has taken to this election and their desperate attempts to find fraud, all they have come up with are a few affidavits that when you examine them don’t say much. If anything, this election has shown how little fraud there was and that we can safely use mail-in ballots. If anything, Trump’s crack legal team has shown that this election was very secure and worked right. I know they set out to prove fraud, but instead they have had to go super crackpot and ignore reality to make their fraud claims, because they just did not exist otherwise.

In any case, there is no arguing rationally with these people, because despite all the evidence (or lack thereof) they persist in fantasy.

You want to discuss policies or what is good for America or even for Jews? They are so deep in a cult of Trumpism, which really, just brings out the worst in people. I mean, Yidden embracing lying and disgusting behavior is just so ridiculous. I seriously hope these people realize that Trump and the movement around him is a terrible thing and they are able to get out of it. As much as politics prior to Trump got people riled up, I never recall it reaching the level of hatred that has been espoused by those supporting Trump. We were all better people before Trump. He made his supporters worse people, with worse middos. It is time for people to realize that and leave behind their support for Trump.

Rudy – Hand recounts will not change anything

Powell – The computer system counting the votes changed the numbers

Explain how these two positions are consistent.

Daas Yachad – I took a look back at her comments and it seem pretty clear that her implications is that Biden supporters are mean. Maybe she can clarify that she only meant Biden supporters who are upset or concerned at Trump’s attempt to overturn and steal an election and in general undermine democracy are mean.

@Syag – you want an adult conversation then stop with the implied insults.

Take your last comment, in response to se2015. se2015 said not all Trump supporters support his wild conspiracy theories, to which you respond, in effect, that you have been saying that over and over, but “others” (presumably those who dislike Trump here) are too dense to parse this.

So, am I to understand on Nov 13 when you posted these two brief paragraphs (see below), you did not mean the second sentence?! I mean, if you are actually willing to say what Trump is saying is wild conspiracy theories, then you would seem to agree that if a Judge said stop the certification because Trump said this or that, that is a problem. Or is it, that you simply adjust every comment you make to insult the other side? When you stop with your implied insults, couched in holier than thou language, I perhaps might find your comments a bit more tolerable. Until then, I will feel free to call you out for your constant insults.

““If the election officials say there was little or no fraud – as they have all done – then the election officials are deemed corrupt. If the Judges reject the ‘evidence’, then the Judges are corrupt. ”

Yes, and if the judgesaccept than they are trump’s puppets. At least be honest and acknowledge that it goes both ways.”

@syag “ummm, no. not even for pretend”

Denial is the first of five stages of grief. Hope you don’t spend the next 4 years stuck there.

@Syag – Congrats on another insult post insinuating that everyone that supports Biden is somehow mean. As they say, if you live in a glass house don’t throw stones. Still waiting to see a comment from you on substance, rather than your consistent implications that those who supported Biden in this election are just somehow bad people. At least be honest with what you are doing and stop playing victim. Probably asking too much.

@Honest to follow-up to my prior comment (not published yet) on Nov 13 the court addressed the Jesse Jones affidavit and explains why the allegations are garbage. In that case the request for injunctive relief was tossed out. So go on, keep on posting nonsense, it is reflecting poorly on you at this point.

When you study WWII history there is this remarkable change after the Nazis were defeated where just about everyone was in-fact opposed to Hitler. Makes it hard to figure who supported him in the first place.

Now, I am not saying Trump is anything like Hitler in his objectives, however in terms of trying to gain power there are many similarities. Much like the people of Germany turned away from one populist demagogue after he lost, I suspect in 4 years many of you deny ever having liked Trump in the first place.

@turahvaluesoverparty – well then you just made a great argument for why Trump was guilty of all the crimes he has been accused of. He obstructed and the GOP did their best to stop investigations into him. That shows anyone that he must be guilty. Also he refused to show his tax return, which further shows he is guilty.

Btw, in Georgia they are doing a full hand count of the vote, and guess what… That’s right, Trump realized the audit there was not going his way, so now on to the next reason why elections that he loses should not count.

@Syag – In all this talk about Biden and Trump, never once do I recall you ever contributing with a substantive argument. Instead it is all holier than thou, statements that are intended to insult the person you direct it against. I welcome you actually joining the conversation and adding something of substance, but I suspect that when you get beneath the fragile exterior there is little holding up the insides and not much to offer. Maybe tone done the gaivah a bit and actually discuss issues and dare I say, accept the possibility you may very well be wrong.

@Health – read the Jesse Jacobs affidavit and it does not make the claims you claim it makes.

You said the worker was told to backdate ballots that came in late. This is a very specific claim that if true would be troubling.

What the affidavit says (easy to find online), and all it says about this, is that on Nov 4 she (he?) was told to input Nov 3 as the receive date for ballots that were not in the QVF.

This is important, because testimony has to be very specific as otherwise you can say one thing and imply something else. Note, Jesse does not say that ballots that came in late were backdated, what Jesses says is that ballots not in the QVF were dated to Nov 3.

Nowhere in the affidavit does it state that those ballots came in after Nov 3. Seems to me, someone created an affidavit that attempted to stick to factual statements (because it is a crime to lie in an affidavit) but it was done in an way to imply something illegal happened when in fact the affidavit never makes such a claim.

Like has been said, easy to make claims on social media another to swear before a judge and make those claims.

Let us know when you find your evidence or come up with valid legal arguments. Until then Joe Biden is president-elect.

I was already tired of your lies and conspiracy, and you have not made a better case yet.

@Ben Levi – let me reiterate… Joe Biden is the President-Elect. Simple as that.

You don’t like it, please let us know what legal arguments or evidence you have so that we should consider otherwise. So far, there has not been a single legal argument or any evidence presented that could possibly change this result. How difficult is this to understand? Have you ever learned a blatt Gemara? How difficult is it to realize that there is nothing of substance that has been presented here.

As to the lawsuits… the lawsuits… the ones that keep on getting tossed out of court… Those? Yeah, until Trump can provide the evidence or legal arguments those lawsuits are irrelevant and probably should be considered frivolous.

Face it, Joe Biden won the election.

Oh, if it makes it easier for you, in some of these states at issue, the legislatures have said they have no plans to break state law by certifying a slate of electors who will vote for Trump, so that avenue is pretty much shut (assuming it was not a dead-end to begin with).

@Syag – wow! another insult from you, this time directed towards me, where you offer nothing of substance beyond your insult. Seems like a middah of Trump. Just insult, lie, and slander and when the basis for everything he says is examined it is false.

Congrats. You showed me.

@ujm – So to be clear when you say “eat what you sow”, you mean you don’t care about Democracy. Because not sure how else that is intended.

Also I have to wonder…. The Republican led Senate issued a massive report that concluded that Russia interfered in the 2016 election. Trump said he did not read the report (not surprising). That report and the FBI investigation into Russian interference led to actions to reduce Russian interference in the 2020 election. So rather than undermine democracy it helped make it stronger.

So the Republicans concluded that Russia was a threat to independent US elections and yet you, say this is a Democrat claim as if to suggest this is one-sided.

Maybe actually go get facts rather than repeating whatever Donald Trump, Hannity, or Carlson told you.

@Syag – You are wrong.

At this point anyone supporting Trump here hates Democracy.

Trump is making claims of widescale fraud without evidence. If he did that against you that would be called libel and slander. Instead he is doing this against voting, which is one of the most fundamental aspects of democracy. As president he is sworn to defend our democracy.

In simple words, Trump is committing Treason.

Not conceding the election, going to court is all fine, but to cast allegations, because Trump feels this way, without any firsthand knowledge or evidence is simply committing libel and slander against Democracy itself. Trump is a Traitor. You are supporting a Traitor. You must hate Democracy.

At least be honest and acknowledge that you want an authoritarian regime.

@ujm – I don’t think the GSA should consider this disputed, because one side who has not presented evidence nor made valid legal arguments says it is in dispute. It is pretty clear Trump lost.

@Old Crown Heights – listened to a bunch of that interview and the bottom line is the guy heard a blurb and assumed a lot of things. He did change his affidavit and clarified what was assumption vs what he heard. As to what he heard it is nothing near as damning as what the original affidavit suggested.

@ujm – Can you not spread fake news about what Bill Barr did. He did not start an investigation, rather he changed department policy, with no reason other than Trump is upset, to allow certain investigations to proceed. Note, it was policy that was changed, not that there are actual investigations ongoing.

@rightwriter – Hillary never said it the way you suggested. She just said if the election is close Biden should not concede as Trump will try to interfere with the absentee ballots. In any case, Hillary was not running for election, and her one comment about not conceding is a ridiculous basis for Trump’s deplorable actions alleging fraud when he has not presented evidence of such widescale fraud.

@Health – you are just lying about what the postal worker was told. Hopkins never claimed being told to backdate things (he does not even know how to do postmarks) rather he said that some people backdated things. What he recanted was that he only heard a snippet of conversation and he assumed it meant they backdated things. The conversation he heard is not even clear that it was discussing backdating and would not go anyplace in court without other evidence. His affidavit is just hearsay.

Finally, rather than spreading fake news and just lying about things, why not go look at the facts. In PA only about 10,000 ballots were received after the close of the polls. If all those ballots were tossed out, Biden still wins. So these allegations about backdating and whatnot are simply irrelevant if you want to say the election was affected by voter fraud. Provide the evidence or you are just a liar who is in denial about reality.

I know I said I will step out of this conversation before but felt a need to respond to some of these comments. I assume you, if you want to continue with lies, can come up with more and more irrelevant points and lies to continue this. I think for anyone thinking who looks at all this, it is clear who is making up lies and who is trying to stick to the truth. I think it is safe to say any responses from the side that has been lying consistently here will just be more lies and there is no further need to respond to them.