Forum Replies Created
-
Posts
-
Thank you.
The question is raised by Chazal of whether there is greater reward for one who does something that is commanded, or something meritorious without being commanded. The Bavli in Kiddushin 31a concludes that one who does something commanded is greater than someone who does something voluntary. Commentators point out what the author of this Dvar Torah points out, that the yetzer hara is very powerful and to do something commanded requires overcoming that “Need To Be Free”.
But wait — there is a Yerushalmi that disagrees. In Shevi’it chapter 6, the Yerushalmi discusses the question of whether the oleh Bavil were commanded to keep the Shemittah year. The actual question isn’t really resolved (and in fact it remains a machloket even to this day) but they do say that if they did so without being commanded that was more meritorious than had they been commanded and if they were commanded but observed with joy their merit was increased to what it would have been had they done so without being commanded!
I have a resolution. The mitzvah given as the example in the Bavli is a personal one — honoring father and mother. The mitzvah example in the Yerushalmi is a communal one. When a community takes on a custom voluntarily there can be great merit, as it unifies the community — even though it is not commanded. But any individual mitzvah requires us to conquer our yetzer hara. I write this in memory of my mother o”h whose 28th yahretzeit is today. May I always be able to overcome my yetzer hara to honor this great intelligent woman who gave me so much, and may I always embrace my community’s minhagam.
Cornell University probably has the most famous one. “Far Above Cayuga’s Waters”. The sheet music is actually on the Wikipedia page and is in the public domain.
“Fair Harvard” also has a very popular tune.
Enjoy.
“there you go another example of an evil leftist who wants covid-19 to stay until the election to hurt trump at the expense of people dying”
The Trumpies can’t get a consistent message. On the one hand they agree with his anti-science nonsense and question the efficacy of ALL vaccines. On the other hand they want to believe Vladimir Putin when he says he has a vaccine and want people to take it even though it hasn’t been proven safe, much less efficacious.
“You are in Israel, are you under the healthcare plan?”
There are very few things more hypocritical than Israelis who benefit from their country’s generous welfare state condemning attempts to get the US even one that is a fraction as generous. Just today I had an unpleasant encounter with an Israeli who was blasting the idea of extending unemployment compensation in the US to help people cope with the consequences of the COVID-19 pandemic. I have previously had many such encounters with Israelis who like their own universal health insurance but think that Americans with pre-existing conditions should be left to die.
I wonder whether these hypocrites are actually Jews. They certainly don’t think like Jews. And if we wonder why US support for Israel is declining, maybe we should look at these obnoxious Israelis.
I would take a vaccine that has been proven safe an effective even if the FDA has not approved it. I almost took a non-FDA-approved yellow fever vaccine last year before a trip to Africa but it turned out that the countries I had planned to visit did not have endemic yellow fever. However, I have yet to see any evidence other than Vladimir Putin’s word that the Sars-COV2 vaccine is safe or effective.
“Why does no other democracy have an electoral college?”
Germany sort of does — the “Bundesversammlung”.
There is an orthodox synagogue in Portland — Congregation Shaarey Tphiloh. I don’t know whether or not they are having minyans now, because of the shutdown. But you can contact them. Good luck.
Most yeshivot never teach more than a handful of masechtot. In daf yomi you learn the entire Bavli. Maybe not as in depth, but you can do a good job learning it if you are diligent. It is not clear that Chazal thought that one masechte was more important than any other so they would likely approve. I am now in cycle #3 for me. It gets easier each time through.
“There is no exception in it for war. ”
I don’t know whether I have responded to this or not, but yes, there is indeed an exception for war. Ask Eugene Debs. Or the several Americans convicted of treason for supporting the Axis during WW2.
Try contacting Kesher Israel in Harrisburg, which isn’t far from Hershey. Good luck!
(The founding rabbi of Kesher Israel was Rabbi Eliezer Silver, one of America’s gedolim in the early 20th century!)
“There was published a Study from a South Michigan Hospital ”
That was a non-randomized study. The randomized study found that it was ineffective. When you have a conclusive well designed randomized clinical trial all the observational studies are ignored.
“they are Just Being PC”
It isn’t about being PC it is about understanding scientific evidence. And it is clear that you do not. Promoting hydroxychloroquine now, when multiple randomized clinical trials have shown that it does not help either prevention or treatment, is promoting medical quackery. Period.
“an Observational study from NYU”
I read the paper describing that study. It was a non-randomized study, one that did not even attempt to properly address the differences in the people who took one treatment regimen vs. a different one. And the senior author himself publicly stated that a randomized study was needed. Oh, and the study has still not actually been published in a peer-reviewed journal, even though it was released to the public three months ago.
“Dr. Fauci said that he cannot rely on it because it was not a randomized study.”
Who cares what he says?!?”
He happens to be right and the fact that you don’t understand the difference between a randomized study and an uncontrolled study shows that you have no business commenting on this issue. You are like a new baal tshuvah questioning a gedol b’torah.
A lot of people like to bash socialists.
I have already pointed out that were it not for socialists, there would not be a State of Israel.
Germany is another interesting case study. Every single non-socialist member of the Reichstag had voted to make Hitler a dictator after the Reichstag fire. Every single socialist member had voted against that. By the end of the summer they were all either dead, incarcerated, in hiding or in exile.
“of course the Gedolim did not object to Socialism per se”
Correct. Because socialism the way it was put into the place in the UK and Israel isn’t really incompatible with Torah. And the socialists supported the efforts to rebuild Torah (partly because most of them thought that religious Judiasm was on its last legs).
One of the authors is a frum doc I know.
YWN doesn’t normally allow outside links but I saw it.
Here it is, if they make an exception.
Sorry. But they can google this and find it
gregggonsalves
Statement from Yale Faculty on Hydroxychloroquine and its Use in COVID-19
“The Chazon Ish was a young man of 39-40 and had not yet attained global recognition. ”
Rabbi Aharon Moshe Kiselev was a huge talmid chacham who had studied in Volozhin. He moved to Harbin, China, in the area then known as Manchuria, in 1913 to be the Chief Rabbi there. (Harbin had a large Jewish community; among the Jews there were the parents of future Israeli Prime Minister Ehud Olmert.) He would later be recognized as the Chief Rabbi of the Far East. On one issue he paskened that all Jews in China, Hong Kong, and Japan observe Shabbat on Friday night and Saturday, according to the conventional location of the International Date Line.
Later he would learn that the Chazon Ish had paskened differently. Rabbi Kiselev had never heard of the Chazon Ish! Upon being informed that the Chazon Ish really was a Gedol, he reconsidered his psak — and after reconsidering it, concluded that he himself had been right all along!
The end of Rabbi Kisilev’s life must not have been happy. While under Chinese warlord rule, Jews were well treated, the Japanese who took over Manchuria were allied with Russian anti-Semitic fascists who dominated much of Harbin and persecuted Jews. The Japanese also conducted medical experiments there similar to those of the Nazis, but the victims were Chinese. Most Jews left during the Japanese occupation, many to Japan or to other cities in China, and many to Israel. (Rabbi Kisilev was a religious Zionist and many of the less religious Jews were Revisionists.) The Soviet Union occupied the city in August 1945 and handed it over to the Chinese Communists the following April; before the Russian communist mass murderers passed on control to the Chinese mass murderers they rounded up Jews for their gulags. Rabbi Kisilev died in Harbin in September 1949 at the age of 82, just a few weeks before the “Peoples Republic of China” was proclaimed. 🙁 The last Jew in Harbin died in 1985.
Incredibly two synagogues still stand in Harbin and there is one Jew who lives in the city. One of the synagogues is a museum and the other is a concert hall.
“Bibi made a public presentation with the evidence of much of the documentation of the activities they continued to carry on secretly”
Bibi lied. Repeatedly. Before the Deal, After the Deal. His lies before Congress were so blatant that the Republicans didn’t even bother to arrange for a vote against the deal. The IAEA weapons inspectors confirmed repeatedly that Iran was in compliance with the nuclear deal. And his description of what was to be in the JCPOA in his speech to Congress was so different from reality as to wonder whether he should be involuntarily committed. (Yes, it was that bad.)
Furthermore, Bibi did not propose any alternative to doing nothing and letting Iran get nuclear weapons — in six months, if you actually believe Bibi. (He had been saying “six months” for years.) The only real “alternative” was World War III.
“Signing this was an unmitigated gall on Obama’s part.”
It wasn’t Obama to “sign”. Kerry signed it. The JCPOA was then approved in a UN Security Council Resolution.
I know that most commenters here hate Obama and love Trump. But Obama and Kerry removed the Iranian nuclear threat and Trump brought it back. Such irrational hatred and stupid love should make any politician think twice before sticking their necks out to help Israel. We need to support those who support us.
Israel was a socialist country — by the accurate definitions Ben Levi gave — for the first three decades of its existence. Even today, most of the land is either owned or controlled by the government. David Ben-Gurion was a socialist, so was Moshe Sharett, so was Levi Eshkol, so was Golda Meir, so was Yitzhak Rabin.
And for the most part the dati and charedi parties had no objection. The dati parties were part of every single government under every Prime Minister I mentioned, and the founder of the main dati party, Rabbi Dr. Yosef Burg, was a huge talmid chacham. The charedi parties were part of the first three governments but stopped being a part of them for reasons other than socialism.
Had Israel been a free market economy in the 1950s it is unlikely that the then desperately poor country would have been able to support the huge number of huge immigrants it welcomed. Command economies work well in crises — the US had command economies for both World War I and World War II.
“I don’t believe it’s possible to get it again.”
We actually don’t know whether that is the case or not. Unfortunately there is evidence that the antibodies to the virus are not long lasting. We might need to be getting vaccinations on a regular basis, at least until we can kill off the virus — and given that we can’t get people to wear masks and maintain social distance, that means we may need to keep getting vaccinations indefinitely.
“He sent billions in cold hard cash secretly to Iran”
It was Iran’s money. They were going to get it eventually. In exchange for the money, they agreed to give up their enriched uranium stockpiles and to stop enriching to weapons grade. And they actually did that. That is MUCH more important than anything else. And there had never been a better arms control agreement, with more safeguards. (I read the ones from the 1970s that we negotiated with the Soviet Union.)
Then comes Trump, who kills the Deal. As a result, Iran still keeps the money, AND gets to enrich uranium to weapons grade. Thanks to Trump, they may already have a nuclear bomb. Which the Deal had pushed off for at least 15 years.
The assumption by the Trumpies is that anything Obama did was bad for Israel and anything Trump does is good for Israel. The opposite is closer to the truth.
“You don’t NEED an Official Courtroom Trial.”
You are making a mockery of the Noachide laws. One of them is to set up a formal legal system. This was an extrajudicial execution. In other words, murder. The officer responsible is now facing homicide charges. He won’t get the death penalty, though, which is good, because as pointed out US courts don’t follow Noachide law. (Minnesota fortunately abolished its death penalty in 1911.) Every execution in the US where there was no eyewitness testimony is homicide and the Governors who sign the death warrants will be called to account.
Essentially, you are supporting murder.
Thank you, Ben Levi, for those clear definitions. A lot of people call themselves socialists who don’t fit that definition. Bernie Sanders is the best example in the US. He is no Norman Thomas or Eugene Debs. (Thomas was a socialist but not a Marxist. There were many Christian socialists in the US and Thomas was one of them. Another was Francis Bellamy, author of the Pledge of Allegiance. Both were Christian ministers.)
And a lot of people are falsely slandered as socialists. Joe Biden is a great example.
Democrats and Republicans support their incumbents for re-election. Republicans were happy to have Ron Paul, who was even worse than Omar, in Congress for 23 years, and they never did anything about him. Pelosi at least has twisted Omar’s arm into a pretzel to get her to vote against anti-Semitism — three times. That said, if you really cared, you would contribute to Omar’s primary opponent, Antone Melton-Meaux. I have. antoneforcongress dot com.
” It is said that there was never a terrorist he failed to support and fund. ”
And that is a lie. He never supported for funded Hamas or Hezbollah.
Trump, OTOH, gave Lebanon’s armed forces $100 million, even though it has been controlled by a Hezbollah ally since December 2016.
Typical Trumpie double standard.
“Would you vote for Hitlers grandson?”
מִבְּנֵי בָּנָיו שֶׁל הָמָן לָמְדוּ תּוֹרָה בִּבְנֵי בְּרַק
בָּנָיו שֶׁל סִיסְרָא לִמְּדוּ תִּינוֹקוֹת בִּירוּשָׁלַיִם
מִבְּנֵי בָּנָיו שֶׁל סַנְחֵרִיב לִמְּדוּ תּוֹרָה בָּרַבִּים
I read that every Tisha B’Av.
“Pelosi just endorsed Rep Omar”
Trump endorsed Paul Nehlen, an actual Nazi, in a congressional primary in 2016.
I look forward to all those who consider endorsements to be disqualifying to be endorsing Joe Biden rather than Donald Trump.
“something can be worked out so that frum students can attend public schools ”
I don’t understand why nobody has jumped on my suggestion that we just lobby the legislature for the tax increases needed to give real government support for private schools. Connecticut, Vermont, and Maine have been having the government pay for private schools from time immemorial. (One of the schools receiving support was founded in 1801!) The Supreme Court just ruled that if the government pays for non-religious private schools it has to pay for religious private schools by the same rules. (A few states such as Virginia strictly prohibit ANY government funding of ANY private schools.) And CT, VT, and ME require that a private school that accepts the tuition vouchers cannot charge students any tuition. This could work in NY as well, if we can just get over our allergy to supporting politicians who are willing to raise taxes.
“It is sad that yeshivos don’t all pay well or on time”
Not paying wages on time is explicitly forbidden by the Torah.
“My local school district spends $22,000 per child. ”
I could only find two districts in NYC, Westchester, Nassau, or Suffolk Counties that had such low per pupil expenditures: Franklin Square and Floral Park, both in Nassau.
“NYC spent $25,199 which was twice the national average . ”
I just looked up some numbers. 27 districts in Westchester County (of 48) spend more than the $28,808 NYC spent last year. I also found 43 (of 56) in Nassau County, and 50 (of 69) in Suffolk County, that spend more. One district in Suffolk spends over $100K.
Sparsely populated rural districts are often even bigger spenders. All six districts in Hamilton Country spend at least $32K per student. Their total enrollment is 415 students.
NYC is a bargain by comparison.
“We’re obligated to observe the “law of the land”, regardless of whether it’s consistent with Talmudic law.”
Actually we are often obligated to give up our lives rather than commit a transgression.
“what stupidity he pleaded guilty”
Uh, no he didn’t. He was not given a trial.
“the Judge Cop gave him the Correct Torah Punishment!”
Ah, so if I see you shoplifting I can shoot you. No trial. Got it.
“Why would counterfeit money be forbidden, without the added isssur of oinaah? ”
The Rema wrote that non-Jews are obligated in pretty much everything in Chosen Mishpat.
“Why are you defending a Russah, like Floyd?!?”
Who is defending him? YOU are defending murderous police. They summarily executed him with no trial. Now while it is true that a Non-Jewish court can execute someone for petty theft, it is only after a trial before a judge with an eyewitness testifying. That didn’t happen. You are defending a halachic violation as well as a violation of secular law.
“Why would counterfeit money be forbidden”
Interesting question. First, I noted the opinion of Rema. But on the other hand, money did not exist at the time of matan Torah, so all references to it have to be later. Paper money did not exist in the western world until modern times so we don’t even have rishonim on that issue. However, as Chazal were pretty aggressive in their support for a workable economic system (banning the use of unminted slugs, banning the use of Jewish coins) so it is hard to imagine that they would have permitted anyone to print fake paper money.
The grandfather was indeed a terrorist. The grandson is not. In fact, the grandson, Ammar Campa-Najjar, is a Christian (the terrorist grandfather was Muslim), and the grandson had denounced his father’s actions.
The following quote is from Campa-Naijar’s campaign web site:
“America must always be protected, its values and citizens defended. We must uphold human rights globally and remain a vigilant force against terrorism. To do this we must enable and ensure our military is strong, resilient, properly funded and fully supported.
I believe that our military should prioritize the use of force whenever our national security is at stake. The world has become increasingly dangerous and complex. We should use all the tools of American power, beginning with diplomacy and economic development, to confront global threats and always ensure war is the last resort.”
This is Campa-Naijar’s second try for this congressional seat. In 2018, he unfortunately lost to a Republican crook, Duncan Hunter, who has been sentenced to 11 months in prison for illegally using campaign funds to finance affairs with five different women. (I am not making this up.) The start of his prison term has been delayed because of coronavirus.
Grandsons often fail to follow their evil ancestors. For example, Henry Ford was one of the worst anti-Semites in American history but his grandsons became great supporters of the Jewish community, contributing to Jewish charities and sponsoring “Schindler’s List” on television.
“You don’t need a Positive ID to find s/o Guilty of a Crime.”
The Talmud says you do. Our judicial system does not meet even the minimal standards demanded by the Torah for Noachide courts.
“Convicted on Home Invasion with Armed Robbery.”
Which is not a death penalty offense in the US. The police executed him without trial, without due process.
“Charlie thinks that the behavior of people rioting when there is a perceived violation of their rights is the correct way. Us Jews should learn to be the same way!”
I do not believe that nor did I say that, but I see that lying during the week of Tisha B’Av about what someone said seems to be acceptable practice here. While US Jews don’t usually riot, charedi Jews in Israel riot on a regular basis, and are treated gingerly by the police, at least compared to Arab rioters in Israel.
” the risks were rare (though real) and it is worth a shot”
And I agreed with that. And the shot failed. Those who continue to promote it are promoting medicine that is opposed by the science.
The truth is that there never was any real evidence in its favor; anecdotes without comparison populations aren’t evidence and neither are studies so flawed as to be useless. It was the flawed French study that got Donald Trump (no epidemiology training), Peter Navarro (an arrogant epidemiologist who falsely claimed he understood how to read medical journal articles), and Rudy Giuliani (an arrogant lawyer whom I actually use as an example in my classes of someone who misunderstands epidemiology from the time when he falsely claimed that you have a better chance of surviving prostate cancer in the US than in the UK).
“ignore studies that show vastly reduced rates of morbidity among hcq takers this is not science”
There are no such studies, at least any such studies without flaws. Well, correct that. There might be one — the Henry Ford Health System study. But all other studies that are of good enough quality to matter show otherwise. More importantly, now that we have data from clinical trials, the observational studies don’t matter.
What YOU claim is not science.
” i don’t know if i believe rhey can have ahonest view of hqc, but i also know thst there has never been any reason to question their integrity as doctors or their intelligence regarding their area of expertice.”
You just attacked my integrity on Tisah B’Av. I am one of the few folks here who posts under my real name. I have a professional reputation.
The doctors such as Dr. Zelenko who have been promoting HCQ do NOT have expertise in epidemiologic research and have refused to subject their protocols to the rigors of a clinical trial. Promoting unproven treatment is pure medical quackery, especially when the treatments have been shown NOT to be effective in the most rigorous research.
Is there anyone else in this chat room who actually does epidemiologic research for a living?
“NYC spends the highest per student than any other district”
Not even close to the highest. #1 by far is Kiryas Joel. The other top ones are either suburban districts or small rural upstate districts.
“Hundreds of thousands (if not millions) already got the virus and have immunity”
This is laughable. For seven weeks, only 2% of tests in NY have been positive — or less. That isn’t herd immunity. It does show however that after the lockdowns the virus spread was stopped in its tracks.
Currently, Florida has about an 18% positive test rate, Arizona 21%, and Texas 12%. It ended lockdowns and the virus spread.
Try learning some basic epidemiology.
There was a relatively recent “suicide by cop” attempt in the Bronx. The man survived being shot, but died a few days later from COVID-19. Very sad. 🙁
Arizona actually does not pay tuition for private schools with the exception of a small program targeted towards special education students that includes about 8,200 students out of about 60,000 private school students; what it really has in the way of a broad program is is tax credits for contributions to private schools. New York has over 9x the private school enrollment of AZ — well over half a million students — with less than 3x the population. Arizona also has low property taxes and the programs are funded with state funds, not local.
The Yale Professor has been proven wrong. Three large randomized studies were stopped early, two because they had progressed to the point where we knew that they could not show that hydroxychloroquine does not help treat COVID-19, the other because they could not get enough people to participate in the study. Furthermore, even the decent observational studies, with only one exception, showed that hydroxychloroquine was not helpful.
The lockdowns have led to a spectacular drop in cases, hospitalizations, and deaths in New York. Ending lockdowns in Florida, Texas, and Arizona led to increases in all three.
There really isn’t anything to discuss here.
Just look at the upset when Cuomo cancelled sleepaway camps, most of which are multi-week. How many European Gedolim went to multi-week sleepaway camp? Sleepaway camp is NOT essential to Judaism; it isn’t even mentioned in the Torah or in Chazal!
“yeshivas would then be required to open their books to the public , and for the first time, give a line by line accounting of their spending.”
I don’t see the problem with that.
” In addition, their budgets would also have to be public and subject to approval by voters in the district”
Of course! Massive tax increases would be required, and in most of NY State that requires a referendum. (The largest cities are exceptions.) And the school boards are also elected by voters (New York City and Yonkers are exceptions.)
Now that the Supreme Court has overturned most of the Blaine Amendments (a few are still in effect, such as in Virginia), we CAN get tuition relief from the government. But we need to vote for politicians who will support the large tax increases required. That usually does not mean Republicans.
“Why kind of Americans were your great grandparents?”
All eight were born in the US. They came when the US had open borders!
Nobody has been able to identify a single atheist in Congress, in either party, for years. One member, Sen, Kyrsten Sinema, refuses to identify with any religion; she is a very conservative Democrat and a huge supporter of Israel.
“I define what is moral based upon the teachings of the Torah”
If you support Trump, that statement is a lie. There has not been a more licentious President since Kennedy (Harding was even worse), and there has never been a President who cheated in business more or lied more.
Unless you think paying hush money to mistresses and cheating customers, employees, suppliers, contractors, creditors, business partners, and everyone else in your business career is Torah morality. The Torah I have says NO!
“people asking to send people back to their own country unless they undergo a citizenship process with mass murder, starvation, shooting people on the edge of mass graves”
That is exactly what has happened in several Central American countries and Trump is sending them back anyway. And they are trying to come here LEGALLY.
Had Geroge Floyd been a Jew, WE would be the ones rioting.
It was the Chinese who attacked first. The Uighurs are not Chinese and the area was never Chinese, but the Chinese Empire conquered it in the 18th century, committing genocide against another people in the region, the Dzungars. The Chinese then committed atrocities against the Uighurs, including mass rape of Uighur women (similar to what the Serbs did to the Bosniaks). Uighurs have wanted to be independent again pretty much ever since. A 19th century revolt, joined by a large part of the other large Muslim population in China, the Hui, succeeded for a few years, but was brutally crushed, with many of the survivors fleeing to Russia. (The Hui actually ARE Chinese and have played a major role in Chinese history; many Chinese military leaders have been Hui, and the founder of the Red Guards who played such a destructive role in the Cultural Revolution was Hui.)
And now the Uighurs are targets of genocide. John Bolton claims that Trump supported China rounding up the Uighurs into concentration camps. What would you do were you a Uighur?