CS

“But the Rebbe also “saw” that Moshiach was coming miyad mamash…”

That was the Rebbe’s fervent wish. By every farbrengen. And he did say we are the generation of the Geula. And the world is ready for it etc. As stated above and why he still isn’t hear *repeat*

In any case Im not looking to prove how great the Rebbe is our the nevuos he said that came true – and story after story of that, and Rebbe stories of today, because it seems people are touchy about it. So if you don’t like it don’t make me go there. This thread was just to discuss the state of the world especially in light of the amazing recent developments of just this year, but even the past few decades… That should be pareve and touch off few nerves so let’s just stick to that

“We don’t demand things from Hashem.”

The mitzvah of pesach sheni disproves that. They were rewarded for demanding lama nigara?

DY it wasn’t a nice thought. Tzaddikim can see things in the spiritual realms as clearly as we can see things here, if not clearer…

Rso
“The only fault I find in your most recent post is that “moshiach has to come”. It’s true of course that he has to come because Hashem has promised as much, but he doesn’t “have” to come because people have decided that he does, which I believe is what you and other lubavitchers believe.”

Hashem wants us to cry out for the Geula. It’s not a great thing were in golus – not at all!! We’re exiled from Hashem’s Presence, the world doesn’t recognise Hashem to the extent it could, and when moshiach comes the world will function at its very best as everything will be used to serve Hashem. We just want the Geula already. Chazal established that we should ask for the Geula many times in every tefilla, not only once a day. Not only should we ask for whenever Hashem wants but we should ask Hashem to speed it up – meheira satzmiach….

The Rebbeim were just telling us where the world is holding as far as being ready for the Geula goes… But the Frierdiker Rebbe, he said if we immediately do teshuva then Geula will come immediately… And that we have the buttons to polish (like the last task in the army when getting ready for the generals inspection) ie a little bit of avoda was left on the world scale.

By the 90s, the Rebbe told us the world is all ready for the Geula, everything that was needed has been accomplished, and the only thing he could think of why were still in golus is because it has to come from us! The normal regular people have to want moshiach and get the Shechina out of golus. So it’s up to us. Not the tzaddikim.they did their part.

Just to comment this thread was not about Chabad meshichists – that’s already a thread. This one was about how the world is ready for the Geula – and all input is welcome, not just Chabad. There are also amazing technological advancements that make the seemingly crazy Geula prophesies now look natural and normal – we haven’t even touched that yet.

Regarding dy and rso I’ll just leave it at that as I don’t want to really give any answers how it could make sense. Id rather just say this is not an ok situation and moshiach has to come and when he does we can ask him out Eliyahu hanavi all the questions. Then we’ll get real answers with the benefit of hindsight, and we’ll know they’re the real answers and not just some chassidims speculation.

@rso

I apologise it seems I overlooked your post.

“Over 25 years is a long time to wait for the “immediate redemption” as the Lubavitcher Rebbe used to say “now”! How much Yiddishe suffering has there been in those years?”

Agreed. No one is happy about it. The Rebbe told us in 1992 that he’s done all he can and now it’s up to us, the regular people, to bring moshiach by learning about it so we truly yearn for it on our own and not just to make the Rebbe happy. Apparently this temporary descent was in order to make this possible as people weren’t willing to think and make it their own when they could just look to the Rebbe the whole time…

“That is not only poppycock but it is a terrible thing to say! Chazal tell us that HKBH “planted” tsaddikim in each generation. To make that generalisation because you are a lubavitcher and you haven’t been clever enough to appoint a successor insults the entire Torah world, its Rabbonim and its tsaddikim
I am mocheh, and I would expect others to be mocheh
too!”

No offence meant. We haven’t appointed another Rebbe because we still have our work cut out for us from the current Rebbe, and we still connect and get guidance, difficult as it may be.

There is a general lack of the kind of leadership and tzaddikim of yore- even during the Rebbe’s days there was a lack of tzaddikim with no yetzer hara. The focus now is on the regular people to do the right thing. I don’t think there is a big uproar because you find the comment made many times on this forum that our leadership isn’t what it used to be, and I was just repeating this sentiment.

Yeah Joseph and they think it’s located near kashgar in China near the town on nisa according to the information they’ve gathered from the sefarim and their travels… It was fascinating reading up on them.

@joseph Yeah that’s a whole other topic. But apparently the bnei Moshe have kept the mesora all the way back to Moshe rabbeinu with smicha etc. and they will only be discovered in ikvasa dimeshicha

@avik ok I stand corrected. I should have elaborated one of the main reasons the US has not wanted to touch jerusalem was so that it wouldn’t lead to any rebuilding of the BHMK… Also the reason the tunnels thought to lead to the Aron are closed off… So it’s really a bigger deal than simply recognising EY

@DY I guess I’ll try one more time. The good and bad is polarised. At the same time the bad is surface level and weak with no legitimate justification. And it’s being defeated.

@NC you’re right. When you write short you risk being misunderstood. Especially when its controversial. When you write long people will skim…what’s better?

Yes it’s both. Better in a deeper sense while the garbage today is surface level.

Actually that’s one of the reasons moshiach is called a metzora. If I remember correctly, its because the skin disease of tzaraas is external and reflects that the evil of the world that moshiach comes to will be surface level only.

We see this clearly. All the evil today is very weak. Two examples: liberals resort to labeling and name calling because they have no coherent arguments that can withstand challenge in an honest intellectual discussion.

Anti Israel claims are not even based on truth (where it could look valid) but on twisted facts and outright lies.

cont’

“This is very reassuring to British Jews whose chinuch is threatened by the new liberal norms, by the sweeping moral change in the western countries where wrong has become right, and right is vilified as wrong.
Where anything goes, and those who protest the change in long-accepted status quos are considered evil. if anything, one can argue that we are getting farther from that ideal, and that is davka a sign of mashiach, when the world and its values turn upside-down.”

Valid point, and 2 points in return:

1) The night is darkest before dawn. Spiritually, the forces of evil give their last ditch attempt and get most desperate when they see their time is up. Looking back at the world the past twenty years this is clearly apparent.

There were tremendous downfalls of evil in inexplicable miraculous yet natural ways that definitely pointed to the fact that we are entering a Geula reality.

Examples include the downfall of the Iron Curtain (which as you know was a major force against Yiddishkeit) in 1991, so quickly and unexpectedly, and without any blood spilled. That is really crazy when you think about it.

Also the Gulf War where Sadaam Hussein rained missiles down on Israel and miraculously, no one died from being hit by a missile. Then one missile hit a US army base, and 40-60 soldiers died (forget the exact number). So they were no toys.

The commitment of the US and Russia to stop producing nuclear weapons, and that nations should divert the extra money spent on producing these weapons to fund aid and food for poorer nations. This fulfilled the ideal of the nevuah of the nations turning their swords to plowshares…

All the above took place in 1991-1992, and the Rebbe pointed out all these as signs of the coming of the geula.

Then the world seemed to be plunged into darkness. The darkness before dawn.

From the euphoria of expecting the Geula at any moment, Chabad was greeted with gimmel Tammuz. It seems in general there is a lack of the kind of Torah leadership that existed all the years, although we have Rabbanim today, its not the same…

On a world level, the Oslo Accords took place, intifadas, Gush Katif… and finally 8 years of Obama who pushed the opposite of Kedusha in moral values, against Israel, and pushed for the liberals to control everything.

But now, things are swinging back in an extraordinary way speedy way, ever since Trump’s election. One klipa after another is being demolished- from the #metoo movement which shows that the destruction of modesty and family values has failed to protect women,

The moving of the embassy to Jerusalem- the start of the nations recognizing EY belongs to us.

The Iran deal being torn up.

The gains for abortion and toeiva are being reversed.

North Korea is coming around.

And all within a single year and a half.

So yes, there was a last desperate push for darkness, but it seems its time is up. And it’s interesting to see the changes being led by Edom themselves- ie the world is being cleansed.

The situation in the UK is a result of the push from the last 8 years. America is already swinging in another direction. I’m sure the UK will come around too. Until then we daven and work with askanim, but the world is coming around.

Point two in next post:)

Mulling it further, it seems to me based on what I’ve learned that there is the basic level of Kedusha and then the higher level. The basic level is pure separation. The higher level is where the separation creates unity, and the fusing of G-dliness with the world. Most or all of the original examples are based on these lines. Sometimes it is necessary to start with the basic level, or even keeping it as a base when moving on to the higher level, but it is good to be aware that the ultimate is when the separation of kedusha leads to unity, peace and pleasantness, as it says about Torah, “Diracheha darchei noam vchol nisivoseha shalom.”

It’s nice to see the feedback and interesting points brought up! Thanks everyone:) To respond:

@DovidBT: Yes we should live with this reality, and that is one way of living with it. For me, I take it slightly different. For me, the mindset is that once Moshiach comes, free choice will be gone as we will all see Hashem and the game of struggle to choose the good will be over. So today may be the last chance I have to make a positive difference in this world that helps it it a more Geula’dike kind of place. In fact, this is one of the reasons that I chose to go on shlichus: I wasn’t sure how I would cope far away from my family and friends, in a different country and culture. But then I reminded myself that Moshiach will definitely be here soon, and maybe even before I leave on shlichus, and I can get the credit for being willing to go and spend my life there, even though it won’t be necessary…

I also learned that when the Geula finally comes, Moshiach himself will thank every Yid personally for their part in helping transform the world into a G-dly place. So my mentality is that today could be my last day to make a difference and what am I doing to change the world in my own surroundings?

True my personal examples or the way the world has changed today are not in the sources, although I would like to think they are examples of the sources. I would be curious to hear which examples you think are not in line? The sources definitely do discuss a shift towards femininity in the era of Moshiach, and The Rebbe worked hard to help that happen within the frum world even before the feminist movement took place.

In some ways, halacha does reflect that shift in reality as well. For example, in the times of the Rambam, in certain Arab countries, if the husband beat his wife to try to bring her into line as a last resort, so they wouldn’t have to resort to divorce, under certain conditions, he could have been justified. Today, if a husband would beat his wife in a world which has progressed to the point where even goyim see the use of force in general as undesirable, and wife beating as an absolute evil, the wife would immediately be supported by Rabbanim to get a divorce, no matter what his excuse, as today, husbands are expected to lead the home by earning it, not forcing it.

I can give another halachic kind of example if desired but I don’t want to go on unnecessarily.

No its not though. See the source printed above, and the Lubavitcher Rebbe pushed for true feminine expression in many ways. I could share stories.

Granted since we’re still in golus, the feminine movement has allot of garbage mixed in, such as suggesting women should act like men, or women should embarrass/ dominate men. But that’s not real femininity. That’s women acting like men have been.

However there definitely has also been a positive shift for appreciating feminine qualities in the world.

and that’s how the world ran- on a paradigm of domination. Doing Torah and Mitzvos wasn’t natural to the worldly environment- it imposed G-dliness on a seemingly unG-dly world.

Nationalism meant who was going to conquer and subjugate the most nations. etc.

The world is different today. It is much closer to the Geula paradigm than the golus one. Of course one can still choose to live in a golus mentality, but that is simply unfortunate.

The question now changes to instead of who should dominate? to which the answer is the man, to Why do we need to dominate?

I can respect the fact that my husband is better at decision making, and leave that up to him, and my husband can want to term me as a co director in our shlichus, because he recognizes that my role in the marriage and raising the children, (in addition to the few programs I run) bring as many people closer to Yiddishkeit, as the communal and shul events.

Ie we can respect the different gender roles without one dominating the other.

Of course this is still a very delicate balance today and we can’t live this reality fully until Moshiach comes-
for example, women can’t sing in public because men still have a yetzer hara, until Hashem removes it by the Geula,

but allot of progress can be made towards living in a Geula mindframe. And its a different life.

For example it used to be because of golus reality that everyone wanted to have boys more than girls because they were celebrated and appreciated more and their qualities were needed more, both physically and spiritually, in a golus world. So there are special tefillos the mothers would say to daven they should have a ben zachar.

Now that feminine qualities are appreciated and needed more both physically and spiritually, many couples want a girl just as much as a boy. Some even more. Yet we still say more brachos when we have a boy because that’s the established minhag and we can’t just change it because we feel different.

Now what about feminine qualities?

So it used to be feminine qualities were appreciated within the home – and not celebrated in the world at meagre large whereas today, the world really appreciates feminine qualities.

For example the quality of competition vs cooperation. In the past women were valued for their quality of cooperation because it allowed their husbands to dominate at home and thus there was peace in the home and less conflict.

Today the world at large – even the business world appreciates cooperation. Everything is about teammanship. The boss now tries to build a pleasant work environment where everyone is esteemed for the role they play, instead of intimidating everyone and showing who’s boss.

Even cooking is very popular.

Anyhow that’s my thoughts for now. I think I’ve gone on long enough 🙂

2 brochos we make by the wedding reflect the shift that is to occur (and is already occurring):

In meheira yishoma we say that hopefully, with the coming of moshiach, we will soon hear in the streets, the voice of the chosson and the voice of the kalla!! In golus the kalla, woman, Malchus doesn’t have a voice she just receives. We see this by the chuppa where the husband says harei at, and the kalla is silent. But by moshiachs times the feminine will have their own voice.

Another example in the wedding brochos is that in one we say mesameach chosson vkalla. Who causes the groom and bride to rejoice. This refers to golus where the husband is happy and then makes his wife happy. She receives the happiness from him.

But another brocho says mesameach chosson im hakalla. Where they are both put on the same plane. There will be a feminine happiness that isn’t dependent on the masculine. This will be by Geula.