TO Sam2

It is Rashi Kesubos 8a(close) S.V. Rei’im Ha’ahuvim

not falling in love does not mean not loving the other as explained to yitayningwut

TO Csar Most people say that they love the other`s middos ehrlichkeit etc… and at the end of the day they have still fallen in love without realising it.

What can one do about that?

TO computer777: Correct no one gets all their needs met from their parents.

The problem starts when one is not consciously aware of exactly what needs were not met and then mistakenly, since one remains “needy”,(feeling something is lacking.I don`t mean a nebech) one imagines that ones spouse is the one that is meant to satisfy it(falling in love).

A spouse can always help out as a favour, but will only be willing to do so if the spouse is made to feel “not responsible” for what I am lacking.

So says Harville Hendrix in his book “Getting the love you want”

which was recommended to me by a frum psychotherapist who is also a “Rabbi”.I believe there are many Torahdicker Haskofos in it.

Re: to extreme givers : There are 3 types of people in connection with needs not being satisfied in childhood.

1 Someone who will unconsciously seek out to satisfy their need, even at the expense of others(b/c he is unaware that he is doing that)

2 Someone who will consciously attempt to deny they have needs and become an extreme giver in order to suppress their needs.

3 Someone who will learn to become consciously aware(know and feel)that certain needs were not met as a child.

He will not blame his parents for this b/c he realises that they,in turn,did not get their needs met by their parents.

He will then take full responsibility for that and attempt to satisfy them by himself, if thats possible,or request, as a favour,from his spouse to help him get his needs met.

I hope I have answered your queries.

TO yungerman1: As you say, the love for a child is not man made so the interaction between parent and child is different.

TO yungerman1 “I disagree with your fundamental basis that people do not have self awareness of their own needs.”

Self awareness does not mean just “knowing” ones needs.Its also “feeling”it.

For example. I want/need to go for a walk but I do`nt like going on my own so I want to ask a friend to join me.

Before I approach him I am aware that I am liable to put pressure on him to join me b/c I want/need to go but I know it`s wrong to do so. Accordingly, I say to myself that if he says that he is tired ,I wont respond that the fresh air will wake you up.

I realise that he may not be in the mood for a walk now(just like I myself am not always in the mood for it)

or something else is going on in his life that he does not want to share with me and therefore this is “his way” of getting out of going(just like I myself respond in a similar fashion to others when I am in a similar situation).

Accordingly,I am prepared to hear a “no” and then decide if I should ask someone else or go it on my own.

When will a person act in such a way?

When he`s aware that he needs not to pressured to do things for others on other occasions.

When hes aware that he needs to be given “space” when requests are made by others.

This kind of behaviour is referred to as “Giving”.(Changing oneself in order to give)

This is the meaning of “Love your neighbour like you love Yourself”

This kind of self awareness one does not posses naturally.

TO BaalHabooze A non-violent statement I am wondering why you ask me a new question before you have responded to the comments I made to you in”Marriage in Crises”

P.S. For a more comprehensive explanation of “GIVING AND RECEIVING”

look at

http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/topic/love-in-crisis

TO yungerman1 I am referring to an emotional bond of ” wanting to give”. Your example of a toy is one of “receiving”

Secondly, the feeling they have after a weeks vacationing are real but could very well be about “receiving”

To computer777 “always given whatever they wanted” is not synonymous to ” always given whatever they needed”

Do you differentiate between desires and needs?

There exists a need not to get all that one desires!

yungerman1:

“According to your logic, this emotional detachment should start immediately. If “GIVING is the foundation of a marriage” -which I happen not to agree with- and “its impossible to give my spouse their needs since I am not in touch with the concept of NEEDS!!!!!!!!” then actually, the emotional bond should never have been created to begin with!”

You are a 100% correct.The emotional bond of “Loving other” has never been created. check out “Love in crisis” http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/topic/love-in-crisis

Think first. Sorry.Change the word “most” to “many”

yossi z. Thanks for your support

I believe that most people will be unable to admit to what I am saying since they will then need to reassess their marriage which understandably is extremely difficult.

You being a life coach have had personal first hand experience with people in such situations.

A friend told me what he has learnt about marriage from his experience with others and believes,is the correct way how to live

He says when a couple start their married life ,of course they are together.As life expands it is accepted that each spouse goes in their separate ways.

I was shocked to hear this.

In my view, this is exactly what I am talking about.

He is telling me that

EMOTIONAL DIVORCE IS PART OF MARRIAGE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I understand that this view is as a result of being in a very difficult situation. On one hand, experiencing that they are unable to be emotionally involved with each other and on the other hand they NEED to remain living together for various reasons which one could well understand.

Unfortunately ,THIS SITUATION,has created a false philosophy that emotional bonding is not an essential element of marriage.This is not an intellectual motivated idea.