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Joseph,
If it’s physical call the police.
If it’s verbal keep your head low, ignore and move on. Remember you’re in galus.
Agreed, but if the verbal attack felt threatening, for example, if someone were following me or demanding I answer, I’d call the police then too.
(T) is the more generalized form of “by Popa”
The old Gedalia Goomber would’ve dropped the ton of bricks off the building in order to rush home for Shabbos. The new Gedalia Goomber gives himself extra time to get home and prepare, but still drops the bricks for fun. Then he has to find a new job the next week.
zahavasdad,
The problem as I see it , in the general world nothing is sacred and you can pretty much say what you want. You can portray any character any way you want.
That’s true, but not really germane to the discussion of whether The Chosen portrayed chassidic Jewry in a positive light or not. I do think the novel portrayed modern Orthodox Judaism in a very positive light, but not chassidism.
You can also portray people as complex individiduals . for example In the chosen Reb Saunders has a dark side. A frum book would never show a dark side to a Rav (I didnt say a sinning side, just a darker side)
Reb Saunders is not a real person at all. He is a character conceived by Chaim Potok, and as such informs us as to the author’s perceptions of chassidic Jewry, whether or not he is complex.
zahavasdad,
Sorry, I could not find the article you are describing. Can you provide more specific search terms, or post a snippet?
zahavasdad,
Read the Hebrew Mishpacha Magazine Obituary of Rav Elyashiv
Why?
zahavasdad,
is there are secular jewish work you approve of?
Einstein’s special relativity is quite spectacular 🙂
zahavasdad,
Many frum people consider Fiddler on the Roof (Tevye the Milkman) a negative portrayl, however most people think of it as very lovingly
I’m only familiar with the theatrical musical version of Fiddler on the Roof, but I would agree with those who feel that it is a positive portrayal. It’s just not a very knowledgeable portrayal.
zahavasdad,
Like Ive seen, ive read “Frum” Books and you see things like how the father spent all his time learning (and not spend with the son)
I think there’s a difference between a distant father and a neglectful father. A soldier can spend most of his time away from his family, but that isn’t neglectful per se. Reb Saunders made a conscious decision to refuse emotional connection with Danny.
You are also spending all your energy on this one aspect of “The Pain and the widsom of the silence” There is alot more to the book than that.
Silence and pain seem to be primary themes of the novel.
You dont seem to mention how the Rebbe really took a liking to the Less relgious boy and invited him over regulary (Except during the Zionist phase)
I did not perceive Reuven to be “less religious” in the novel – now you’re gonna get the MO posters up in arms 🙂
zahavasdad,
If you are not used to a more general light then the Chosen is not for you.
Aha, so I can’t properly appreciate The Chosen because I’m locked in some kind of sheltered frum box, used to sanitized Artscroll biographies exclusively? Not quite. I read The Chosen before I became frum, and formed my interpretations with that mind set. The author’s polemic against the perceived chassidic “circle the wagons” approach to modernity, and the juxtaposition of Reuven’s saintly father and Reb Saunders is quite unsubtle.
zahavasdad,
Ive read books from frum authors saying similar things.
That doesn’t answer my question. Do you think that the portrayal of a chassidic “rebbe” emotionally neglecting his son in order to teach him compassion is positive, whether or not the author is “frum”?
The problem is it came from a Non-frum author
Why do you assume that? Did I write that anywhere?
zahavasdad,
I think it is, but I am not the last word on this topic.
Do you think that the portrayal of a chassidic “rebbe” emotionally neglecting his son in order to teach him compassion is positive?
I read the book a long time ago.
zahavasdad,
Do you think it’s positive towards the chassidic frum community?
zahavasdad,
Wait, first you write:
(Its actally is quite positive towards the frum community)
And then:
I dont doubt [that those in chassidic frum communities would disagree], which is why I was suprised so many had heard of it.
Which is it? Is it positive towards the frum community, or not?
Lilmod Ulelamaid,
oh my gosh – have you guys noticed the tags showing up on the upper right? And it looks like anyone can add if they choose to do so.
Looks like RebYidd23 noticed.
zahavasdad,
It does shock me the in the frum commnity almost everyone has heard of the Chosen (Its actally is quite positive towards the frum community)
I’m not sure those in chassidic frum communities would agree.
Little Froggie,
I don’t think I ever claimed to be a computer expert or anything of that sort.
Perhaps not, but you’re the one with the thread named for you. Anyway, a computer expert is simply someone who has more complex and intractable computer problems than the next guy 🙂
Once I was a builder, and on the 100th floor,
I was carrying a load of bricks, an easy ton or more!
But now it’s midday Friday, so I take an extra hour,
I got home nice and early, an even had time to shower!
Ohhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh
Guess it doesn’t have the same ring to it 🙂
Joseph,
Whatever happened to him?
He took on bringing in Shabbos early.
Are posts still hidden from public view until moderated, or are they now going up as soon as posted?
Lilmod Ulelamaid,
Maybe someone else can help me.
I’m not sure that my level of help will approach even the knees of a little froggie, but I’ll give it a shot.
First, you didn’t specify, but from your posts, I’m assuming that you are using Microsoft Word. At the top of your document, there should be a row with different tabs (File Home Insert … etc). Click “References” to get the options under that tab. At the bottom of the options you should see the word Footnotes, with a small diagonal or downward arrow on the righthand corner. Click that arrow, and a footnotes dialog box will appear. With this dialog box, you can control how the footnotes are numbered in your document, including changing the starting number. Good luck!
lightbrite,
I thought he was talking about serving kids wine at Purim. My bad.
Ok. But why did you only direct your ire towards WolfishMusings, and not Joseph?
lightbrite,
Wasn’t mention overuse. Mentioned one time use.
Understood, although we don’t know how often RebYidd23 needs a coffee antidote. My “rant” about the Benadryl was more of a rhetorical recapitulation of the wine issue anyway (though everything I said is true).
I did not castigate Jewish parents for allowing older children to sip kiddush wine. They were talking about giving children alcohol on Purim. Close to drunk but not officially drunk.
WolfishMusings stated quite clearly that he does not serve wine at his Purim seuda, and thinks doing so is wrong.
Joseph asked if he served underage guests wine at his Shabbos kiddush (and incorrectly implied that it was illegal). WolfishMusings confirmed that he did.
Enter your flaming response directed solely at WolfishMusings.
I’ll accept your explanation and interpretation at face value, though it’s somewhat undercut by your follow-up post that stated that you don’t advocate anyone drinking any amount alcohol before their mid-20s – which suggested a moral equivalence between Joseph’s stated practice and WolfishMusings.
Anyway. Say what you like. Don’t need to explain when words are twisted.
Thanks for the opportunity still
Just because you don’t like my calling out your response does not mean I twisted anything.
WolfishMusings,
At the risk of invoking Godwin’s Law, then even Hitler had worth.
You already preemptively resolved this question above:
I grant the point that even a rasha gamur can have worth.
To quote Arthur Conan Doyle in The Hound of the Baskervilles:
To all the world he was the man of violence, half animal and half demon; but to her he always remained the little wilful boy of her own girlhood, the child who had clung to her hand. Evil indeed is the man who has not one woman to mourn him.
WolfishMusings,
I’m sure your wife doesn’t agree. Or your kids. Or your friends.
Everyone’s entitled to their opinion.
Their opinions are actually the deciding ones. If I think something has worth, then by definition it has worth, and it doesn’t matter what the thing thinks of itself.
WolfishMusings,
In lightbrite’s world, a father who makes a positive example about sobriety and responsible drinking by never getting drunk giving his adult kids 2 oz. of 5% alcohol is a criminal
I don’t think she actually implied criminal, although what she did say was quite harsh and confusing, and should get a follow-up. Lightbrite seems opposed to alcohol consumption at older than 21, perhaps up to 25, so I don’t think she considers this a legal issue.
while someone who sets a terrible example by getting drunk in front of their kids is fine as long as he doesn’t actually give them any himself (because, as we all know, they won’t touch it if he tells them not to…)
Not sure she stated or implied that either.
What shocked me was the harsh statement she made regarding something that is commonly done in Jewish households and is both halachically and legally permissible (and not even medically harmful), and an implied moral equivalence with the idea of encouraging binge drinking among children who are not your own.
lightbrite,
I would take a Benadryl because it makes you a bit drowsy and is mild. 25mg to start. Maybe 50mg.
Hmm. In another thread you castigated WolfishMusings, and by extension the majority of Jewish parents, for allowing his older children to have a sip of kiddush wine, using brain health as your reason. Yet here you suggest using a drug that has substantial brain impacts for purposes other than for what it was intended?
Benadryl should not be used as a sedative. Potential side effects of Benadryl include short term memory loss, confusion, drowsiness, etc., all brain impacts. Overuse of it has even been linked to dementia.
The best wines are the Wines that are Sulfite Free.
Anyone know of good ones that fit this bill?
I walked in and yelled “HI, COMLINK-X!” to the first person I saw with a laptop facing the entrance. Got punched in the face. Must have been you.
lightbrite,
Avram in MD: Wolf who had just said this to Joseph…
“If you can’t make that distinction, then I feel sorry for you.”
Do you honestly intend to castigate every Jewish parent who allows their adult children to have a sip of kiddush wine as unfit to be a proper role model? And you see no moral difference between that and encouraging binge drinking among young teenagers?
RebYidd23,
What do U.S. residents have against tomatillos?
Unfamiliar and unwanted are not the same thing.
President Obama’s first address to a joint session of Congress in February 2009 was also not called a “State of the Union.” Neither was President Bush’s in February 2001. Perhaps it’s minhag 🙂
lightbrite,
Someone does not need to be visibly drunk to be impaired and have brain damage from consuming alcohol… especially a teenage or young adult whose brain is still developing until mid-20’s.
I don’t think anyone in the medical field (at least that I’ve heard) worries about a bit of kiddush wine at a Shabbos meal. Regular consumption or binge drinking are the bigger concerns.
If you cannot understand that, then I feel sorry for those who look up to you as you serve them alcohol.
To whom is this comment addressed?
RebYidd23,
I want to grow them in my garden, but I’ve never heard of anyone else doing that. Why?
Because most hobbyist gardeners plant things that they eat, and tomatillos are not typically eaten or found in grocery stores in most of the U.S.
So it was Friday and we hadn’t made any challos yet, so I sent my kid to the bakery with some money to get challos for us. A little while later, the phone rings, and it’s the bakery. They say my kid cut to the front of the line, pushing an old lady in the process, was loud, and treated the cashier disrespectfully. I lectured them about how important the mitzva of kibbud av v’eim was, and how much merit my dear darling got for going out and bringing challos home to his family.
Now, everything I said in my lecture was true, but did I still miss the point?
bmyer,
Boys will be boys.
Indeed. Which is why, despite the fact that making an effort to collect tzedaka for someone needy is a tremendously meritorious act (and despite the straw man you and Joseph are putting forth, I doubt The little I know, Syag Lchochma, et al. disagree with that at all), it’s probably not a good idea to have unsupervised boys go into a shul or beis medrash during davening. And to be very clear: I’m not even implying that any organization is encouraging boys to go into shuls. But if it’s a known problem, the organizations leading the tzedaka fund have an obligation to properly instruct the boys where not to go.
The fact that they act a certain way does not mean their rabbeim / yeshivos told them to do so (this may come as a shock to you…).
Certainly not, but fairly or unfairly so, the behavior of children while “on duty” for an institution can result in a favorable or unfavorable impression of the institution. Therefore, the boys should be instructed and supervised.
And why the parenthetical snark?
Maybe yeshivos should REITERATE to be more respectful
It seems like you agree with the OP here.
but we’re talking about children they’re not mechuyav in mitzvos for a reason.
That does not mean we turn the other way if a child does something wrong.
apushatayid,
Google – “The Tefillin Jacket”
LOL, I can’t tell if that’s a joke or not, but it’s definitely a solution. Does anyone sell these?
Lilmod Ulelamaid,
Avrum – what do you see most people in your shul doing? What did most of the other guys do when you were in Yeshiva?
The majority of jacket-wearers in my shul leave the arm out of the sleeve. I never went to Yeshiva.
Lilmod Ulelamaid,
According to what Avrum wrote, it sounds like it’s almost impossible to do so halachically
I haven’t figured out a way… but a way must exist. DaasYochid knows his way, though I couldn’t figure out from his description how to make it work for me. Also, some people, e.g., Chabad, Sefardim, wrap their tefillin differently than I do (I wrap towards my body when the strap is over the arm), which may make it easier to keep the knot and box together while shoving the arm into the sleeve.
Is it the bottom of your heel that hurts? Is it worst in the morning, with the first steps you take after getting out of bed?
lightbrite,
DY: So the tefillin goes over the jacket cover? Like if a guy is wearing a white shirt under a black jacket, the tefillin is wrapped around the outside of the jacket?
So confused. I thought that tefillin goes on a bare arm. Like a blood pressure monitor.
The tefillin is placed directly on the bare arm, and then the sleeve(s) are pulled over the tefillin, covering them from view. The tefillin shel yad (I belive) are actually supposed to be covered from view, and they come with a black cover that slips over the bayis to fulfill this for those who don’t cover the arm with a sleeve.
The problem I had with my jacket personally when I tried putting my arm in the sleeve is that the tefillin shifted on my arm due to the effort of sticking the arm into the jacket sleeve. When I removed the jacket after davening, I saw that the knot and bayis were not touching (they are supposed to). DaasYochid was bentched with a third arm that he uses to hold the tefillin in place while he slips his jacket on and off.
Avi K,
A non-Jewish supervisor e-mailed a Jewish employee that he was working like a Hebrew slave. The employee filed a religious harassment claim and recovered $10K in damages plus $10,980 in attorney’s fees. How would you feel if you were the employee?
I have no idea. Context matters.
Joseph,
Bad comparison. Refusing to bow down to a getchke, even if that brings the spotlight, is the correct thing to do.
Absolutely, I certainly would never think that that was the issue. I was talking about the fact that Mordechai spent a lot of time near the king’s gates, which increased the potential for publicity and a negative reaction. He could have stayed home and not bowed to the getchke.
WolfishMusings,
I don’t know why you have such a burning desire to host a pity party for yourself at the expense of the honor of your parents, but please try and be sensitive to the feelings of other posters in the CR. You are not the only BT or child of a BT in the universe, and your publicly aired extrapolations of the words of the Chofetz Chaim to your personal situation can be hurtful to other BTs who have equivalent situations.
If you are truly worried about your spiritual standing, pour out your feelings and specific case to a trusted rav. Don’t ask him generalized, obfuscated questions and then extrapolate the answers to your specific case. That’s not fair to him, or to you. You wouldn’t handle a medical, plumbing, or electrical question that way, how much more so a spiritual question? Yes, we have the mishna, gemara, rishonim, and achronim, and those words are true, but Torah is best found in the mouth of a living and breathing rav. That is the proper way for the wisdom compiled over generations to be applied to you personally.
zahavasdad,
Someone explained it to me as this.
Alot of people are blaming Trump for increasing Anti-Semitism , which Turx did not know. When Turx asked the question, Trump took it differnetly thinking Turx was blaming him for Anti-Semitism, which is not what Turx meant
I think Turx knew very well that “people” were blaming Trump for an increase in anti-Semitism, and purposely tried to assure the President that he did not agree with the accusation. I think his question was an attempt to give the President an opportunity to undercut those accusations. Rather than taking the opportunity, the President poured gasoline on the issue and lit a match.
Joseph and FuturePOTUS,
I understand the concept you describe. My problem, however, is in defining “taking the spotlight” by the response rather than the act. If the CR was around 2500 years ago, would you be castigating Mordechai for arousing the wrath of Haman against the Jews? What business did he have hanging around the palace “taking the spotlight” anyway? And in this case, had the President responded magnanimously and rationally to the question, would this thread exist?
BigGolem,
Shame.
How elitist and insulting to the rest of us.
Lol, are we going to have to define an extension to Poe’s Law, where, instead of being unable to distinguish between sincere extreme opinions and parody of those opinions, we’re unable to distinguish between true outrage and a parody of outrage to those opinions?
misteryudi,
Third – The moon’s gravity does indeed protect the Earth from incoming space debris, including asteroids. Just look at how many impact craters it has.
The moon has so many impact craters because it is much less dynamic than the Earth, with no atmosphere/ocean system to burn up smaller incoming debris and cause erosion of impact craters that do occur, less volcanic activity, etc.
Joseph,
He probably shouldn’t have been there asking questions. And the same would apply to the previous (or any previous) President.
Ok. So “lechatchila” you think that a frum reporter should not attend a press conference held by the President. But, “bedieved”, what should a frum reporter do if called upon by the President?