AviraDeArah

Also, much of the basis of the TE’s psak is from ab achron who says that the doctors in his time say that there’s no fundamental physical difference between the genitalia of men and women – that is no longer supported by science.

The dor tahapuchos paskens that for pikuach nefesh it’s allowed to “transition,” but only if there’s a serious concern of suicide. That’s because the laavin being violated by the operation (seris, lo yilbash, etc..) are not yehereg velo yaavor.

Homosexual relations, however, are yehereg velo yaavor, and cannot be violated even if a person is suicidal. Hence, the marriage is assur, according to the p’sak of pretty much the only posek who has discussed the issue at hand.

The TE does NOT say that such a person can marry a man. There’s no way he or any other person with a mo’ach bekadkado would think of allowing such a public chilul Hashem and sin to happen.

Ask rabbi bender; there’s absolutely no heter for this.

Yserb, medication is very necessary, but speak to anyone who’s gone through a mental health issue and they’ll tell you that it’s just a starting point. Almost no one pops a pill and automatically has a “fulfilling life” nor do they “thrive”, possibly with the exception of ADD kids who take stimulants…a direct, clear response is common, and I’ve seen it in my students.

Also, nowhere does the tzitz eliezer say it’s permitted “if someone feels the need for such a surgery” – thats just what liberal idiots have convinced you to think. He’s talking about genetic conditions, not delusional fantasies and mental health problems where a person thinks that they’re in the wrong body.

“when someone feels they need it,”

It’s a la’av of making oneself unable to have children, in the first place. That’s assur even for goyim.

What if someone “really feels” they need to eat treif? Is that a heter? you start out by saying that the TE says that he can marry if he sinned and did the operation, then you show your true intention by saying that the surgery isnt really all that bad, because “he feels he really needs it”

You’re hiding behind a posek has been exposed as nothing more than leftist garbage.

And for the record, the TE is not a “top notch posek” – he’s a posek, one of hundreds of the last generation, and not by any definition the gadol hador, or anywhere close to it. He was a valid posek, but was outclassed by dozens of gedolei olam. Honestly, if he did come up with this idea (which he didnt) he isn’t the kind of person one can follow blindly and claim to be a “toleh al beis din patur” – we’d just say he’s wrong and end the conversation.

He’s not the baal habayis of torah and we don’t create societal constructs and change marriage norms because of him. If, in the olam hadimyon, rav moshe feinstein, the chazon ish, rav elyashiv, rav shlomo zalman, or the like, would say this, then you’d be looking at the most controversial gadol hador since rav yaakov emden proposed pilagshim, but hundreds of times moreso.

sam, lakewood east has been around for decades.

Damoshe – read it again, and not excerpts quoted by the deranged Mike moskowitz. The surgery was done on a baby with GENETIC ANOMALIES, not people who have mental health delusions about their gender. It never dawned on him, or anyone else in his time, even goyim, to change a biologically normal person into the opposite gender.

Read dor tahapuchos. Please do. You’ve read some truly poisonous garbage online from apikorsim and it’s affected you l.

And please, if you’re anywhere near as comfortable talking about this with rabbi bender as you are online, ask him if there’s an iota of source for such a thing, and if that person can marry a man.

Re, debate – it’s not the job of 16 year olds to deal with Torah issues from a secular perspective in order to do kiruv. Also, the starting point is that such things are possible – wrenching a moral issue out of its morality and talking about it from a sociological standpoint is disgraceful to the Moral Authority who dictates it.

Also, they’re not being given a seminar on how to discuss the issue with non frum people. They’re being told to argue both sides and treat them equally. That’s effectively telling teenagers tbat there is a valid side to breaking the 6th commandment.

Would you be comfortable with teenagers researching the positions of Holocaust deniers, and having one side try to prove the Holocaust was a hoax, in order to prepare them for discussions with confused people?

Aaq, every generation has its nisyonos and resources. Prewar jews had access to tzadikim and talmidei chachamim that were unlike anything we can imagine in our time. They were presented with an opportunity to leave the ghettos and pursue an olam hazeh life. Some chose Torah, and others chose ta’avah. Rav Hirsch championed a non-ghetto Torah life where the Torah Jew spreads Torah around the world and makes a kiddush Hashem by working among goyim, while maintaining impeccable adherence to Torah.

Maskilim, reform, and what would later become MO all gave into their ta’avos and embraced modernity not leshem shomayim.

Aaq, see above

Did you ever read the tzitz eliezer ‘s teshuvah? He does not say that an adult can change their sex and marry the same gender. He is talking about freak incidents where a person loses or gains an organ min hashomayim, or babies who have genetic issues. What they’re saying never dawned on the tzitz eliezer or any other person before 10 years ago, when this abomination became popular.

The sefer dor tahapuchos was written about this issue, and he discusses the TE – the sefer used to be a secret among rabbonim who had to deal with otd and BT trans people, but now it’s readily available in seforim stores.

If you’ve bought into the idea that their marriage is acceptable according to anyone, you’ve become the exact people who are on what you describe as open orthodoxy. Go ask rabbi bender if a transgender person can marry a man – if you have the nerve to ask a rosh Yeshiva such a question. I guarantee he will be flabbergasted at the thought of it and will not look at you the same afterwards. It’s disgusting, and that couple is oseh aveiros beyad ramah.

What’s worse is that they are claiming to be frum, and as you’ve demonstrated, they’re able to infect those who are susceptible with their poison.

It’s not limited to open orthodoxy. Already in 2007, when i was in high school and was captain of the debate team, my school pulled out of the entirely MO school league because the finals were a debate about polyamory, stipulating that no religious arguments can be made. They already took toeva marriage as a given.

This league included the best and brightest of the mainstream MO schools in NYC. All of them. Shown to be rotten to the core.

This was 15 years ago. It’s only gotten worse.

MO is fake judaism. I’ve been there, i escaped its horrors. Don’t let anyone, even talmidei chachamim, have you believe what can be demonstrably false.

YO – we don’t owe anyone halachik solutions to problems that they dream up or copy from goyim, that would be ziyuf Hatorah. Also, they weren’t pushed away at first – many in the frum world thought that they were not so bad. Mendelssohn’s books were in the homes of many frum people, as were other maskilim. There were rabbonim…. I’d rather not say their names, who shared and learned with maskilim, even taking some ideas from them.

Reform were more open about their intentions than the quasi frum maskilim. It didn’t take long at all for them to throw out halacha and encourage intermarriage in Germany.

We cannot change or water down yiddishkeit to accommodate people whose stated agenda was to lower yiddishkeit; it’s self destructive.

Damoshe, where is there hatred and why is it baseless to decry people who wear hats and jackets but promote LGBT, such as the abomination couple who came into the news a few months ago because the “wife” got fired from teaching in a yeshiva? How is that baseless? They’re trying to ruin judaism with their apikorsus. M not referring to rabbi yoshe ber soloveitchik or the like; today’s MO young people are either talmidim of rabbi shechter, and relatively normal, or crazed leftists bent on feminism, LGBT, and more.

YO, i just explained why. See above; influence is a very big issue. That’s why European jewry fell prey to maskilim; they didn’t want to dissociate themselves from the outsiders. Yekkies under rav hirsch were successful, as were chasidim, chasam sofer yiden, and hard yeshivish people, but the rest fell aside eventually. It’s one of many lessons to learn from the Holocaust.

Aaq, because Torah isn’t hefker. When people do things in the name of my religion that are misguided, I feel a need to speak out. When frei people think that yiddishkeit is leather boxes and shabbos candles(I’ve heard this before) there is a problem.

Damoshe, there is value in assessing who is loyal to Torah and who isn’t, because of the influence they have on us and our community. When MO people don hats and jackets, and promote LGBT, they are an insidious danger that can wreak havoc on basic yiddishkeit.

Also lakewhut, there can’t be a mitzvah without a metzaveh – it’s not my torah, this is rishonim who say that a kofer’s mitzvos aren’t mitzvos, we don’t answer amen to his bracha, etc..

Baltimore, this refers to someone who puts on tefillin and believes in the mitzvah – if someone doesn’t believe – and isn’t even aware – of the mitzvah, it’s a maysoh kof b’alma, a meaningless act. It’s true that if a renegade Jew puts on tefillin once, while shirking his obligation every other day, he has a zchus, but that’s only if he did it with a minimum awareness – I’m not referring to the machlokes if mitzvos require kavanah or not; everyone agrees that you need to accept the reality of a mitzvah for it to count, because if there’s no metzaveh, commander, how can there be a commandment?

YO, I’ve taught sefardi boys for several years. Do you know how many children think that the Jewish world consists of kew gardens hills, and that everyone else is a small fringe? Then when they get older they see what the greater world is about. Mdd did the same thing; there’s a very, very large Torah world, and not just America and Israel, there are kollelim in Europe, South Africa, everywhere.

YO, there’s merit in that idea, because there’s a halacha of inui hadin, that we don’t push off a punishment, not even a little. Once someone is convicted, they’re killed or lashed immediately. So i hear you that prison is cruel, but it’s not barbaric. I don’t believe goyim are obligated in inui hadin, however, so the current system of appeals and death row isn’t the worst thing, because their system of evidence isn’t that great either, so innocent people will be spared

That was an entire city/state.

B’avod reshoim rina; Hashem doesn’t want to punish people, but it’s a kiddush Hashem and justice is necessary.

“Halitayhu lerasha v’yamus”

Do you have a way of reconciling these ideas, as I did, or do you prefer to prattle Bible stories which when cherry picked, suit whatever narrative you’ve picked up from social media?

Not everyone who reads the Babylonian talmud is a Yeshiva person.

People who learn torah without goyishe preconceived notions or haskalah influence, who don’t inject nationalism into gemara, who revere every word of chazal as dvar Hashem, are the Yeshiva world.

I can’t believe the mods allowed that post to go through

It’s a huge chilul Hashem. Please take it down.

I don’t think it’s taking the high road to absolve from guilt people who were clearly unqualified to run a country dictating how we ran our lives during the pandemic. the same big names who let HIV become nationally endemic mismanaged covid – the year HIV became widespread when it could have very easily been stopped should have been the end of fauci’s career.

There is a silver lining in that some of the most endangered groups voted for hochul. So she won’t be entirely noteir venokem on the frum world who by and large came out for zeldin – my rosh yeshiva said that askonim should have told people quietly to vote got zeldin, because he seems to want to help the yeshivos, but not publicly, because any pleas we can make of hochul will fall on deaf ears if we as a community openly fought her election.

Of course they’re part of the torah world if they keep the mitzvos without compromise, goyishe influence, and consider torah study to be the central, most important part of their lives – a jew who is ignorant but supports Torah can be considered a Torah jew, but he needs to address his ignorance; there are easily available English translationa of almost everything nowadays.

It’s not limited to Lakewood/bnei brak/Brooklyn/yerushalayim but those are the centers from which everyone else benefits.

I haven’t seen a single point to ponder. What I’ve seen is 3rd grade insults of “you’re a girl,” historical nonsense about shas not being sefardi because some of its members dress like the bnei torah in their area, claims that rav ovadia, an extremely maikil posek, was influenced by supposed ashkenazi chumros, without a single example, and claims that kollel is ashkenaz, which is demonstrably false.

Then i made the mistake of stooping to your level about the hangup with the colors of how bnei torah dress; it’s not that big of a deal, it’s just the current way bnei torah chose to dress, and it represents the humility and diginity of that station, but of course to you it’s arbitrary and European influence – i wouldn’t care if bnei torah chose to wear blue, brown, or other dark colors which can show humility, but jeans and t-shirts are not the way a ben torah of any world would dress, they’re just not.

either way, dress is a very important issue to you, but it has nothing to do with the claim that shas is influenced by ashkenazim. They built up the sefardi world and taught exclusively sefardi torah, from the beis yosef to the ben ish chai and rav ovadia himself. It’s kol kulo sefardi, and only a stubborn delusion obsessed with outward appearance can look at a sefardi ben torah living a torah life according to the halachos of rav ovadia and say that he’s not sefardi because he happens to dress like the bnei torah in his time and place.

What have i not “pondered”?

Yabia…the way people dress in the yeshiva world. Black and white, with a fedora.