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November 14, 2010 6:27 pm at 6:27 pm in reply to: Dose of reality: Kids kicked out of school #709063aries2756Participant
Just so you all know when it comes to the frumest of the frum and the strongest in their beliefs “the Rebbe Meig”. The rules don’t apply to them only to others.
aries2756ParticipantTry to get the bulkhead with the bassinet. Don’t feed the baby till you sit down on the plane so you start soothing her and make her comfortable. Make sure you leave half to give her for take off and landing when the ears get plugged. Bring new interesting toys to keep her occupied. Bring comfortable stretchies not fussy cute clothing. Bring favorite blanket and soft cuddly items. Get a good night sleep so YOU won’t be cranky.
November 14, 2010 6:17 pm at 6:17 pm in reply to: Fathers and brothers dancing with the Kallah #709273aries2756Participantwhatrutalkingabt, No I think you are being naive as are the rest of you always looking for something to kvetch about and point your fingers at. Dancing with your daughter at her wedding is a beautiful thing and for brothers as well. And anyone looking for something licentious about it is just a big yenta always looking for the bad in things instead of the good. Women do not surround the father and daughter, they open up the circle and they don’t stay long it is only for a few minutes usually very close to the mechitza. Everyone has their own minhag and in many cases it is not planned out just spontaneous. And in many cases the choson comes over to dance with his grandmother and mother. That is also a beautiful thing but YOU will all find something wrong with it. Go ahead, in my book and in many others in is a great honor to the grandmother and the mother.
Go pull out your seforim and look it up. It doesn’t hold a candle to the worst offenses like child molestation and abuse. So until you frumer than frum name names and lock them up those Rebbeshe culprits who will stand on top of a mountain and yell gevalt that a father dances with a daughter at her wedding stop picking on the innocent and beautiful family minhagim.
aries2756ParticipantMen who love to cook is great and it could be a great stress buster. My father was a baker but for some reason left the home baking to my mom who was fabulous. But one thing if you are fussing in the kitchen make sure that you clean up as well, unless you have an agreement with your wife that she doesn’t mind cleaning up after you.
aries2756Participantbank of america
aries2756ParticipantI think that when you go to a particular shul you understand that the RAV is the Rosh of the shul and you are obligated to give him kovod. If you do not respect that RAV you should not go to that shul. If you choose to go there it is not up to you to decide if what YOU decide to do is kovodik or not, it is whether others will perceive what you are doing is kovodik to the Rav and that will cause machlokis and loshan horah. It goes beyond the scope of just you, yourself and your own opinion. If the RAV chooses to speak then it is expected that the kehilah listens. Your choice is to stay and listen or to leave and go elsewhere.
aries2756Participantmike, you are fighting a losing battle, I’ve tried and got the same answers. Before I joined here, I thought this was really a Yeshivish type of blog, better than VIN. But I quickly learned differently. You can’t bash Rabbonim here, but you can judge everyone else and put everyone else down. It is a huge double standard.
aries2756ParticipantI take offense to the first line of the post and to the fact that the moderators did not edit it out. Who do you think you are to be so divisive amongst us in this CR. What exactly was this crack about “OUR MO BRETHREN???????? Do you honestly believe you are more Jewish than anyone else?????
November 12, 2010 3:10 am at 3:10 am in reply to: Do You Put Out A Flag On American Holidays? #1023057aries2756ParticipantHave nothing against doing it but NO
aries2756Participantwall of shame
aries2756Participant1987, I’m with you and I’ve said it before as well. It is one thing when you ask a question looking for assistance. It is a whole other ball game when you start a thread looking to stir up controversy by judging what other people do.
November 12, 2010 2:17 am at 2:17 am in reply to: Fathers and brothers dancing with the Kallah #709245aries2756ParticipantSo again it is ridiculous to say a father can’t dance with his daughter. If you look at the Rebbe mitzva tanzen you will see that even the biggest Rebbeim don’t even use a gartel when dancing with their daughters.
And to say that when a father and brothers come to the girls side excitedly to dance with the Kallash they have in mind to look at the other girls is the most outrageous and ridiculous comment in this whole entire thread. Really it not only lacks maturity but seichel. Have you ever been in that position that your own sister got married that you can even remember being so excited for your sister? You are not a parent so you can’t imagine what it feels like for a father to dance with his daughter, or a daughter to dance with her father or her wedding day. And there is nothing assur for a family to dance together which doesn’t ALWAYS happen. In addition, the mechitza does NOT come down, and the other people don’t mingle and go back and forth.
Furthermore, people have different minhagim, and if it is NOT your minhag for the Kallah to go to the chosson’s side or vice a versa you should stop commenting on it, you should just stand behind your own opinions and just leave. You shouldn’t suffer because of other’s minhagim but YOU shouldn’t put them down for it either. I certainly don’t participate in a mixed dancing affair and If it bothers me, I will leave. My job is to be misameach chosson v’kallah and not criticize what others are doing.
Furthermore in my humble opinion, I find a mitzvah tanz where the Kallah dances with ten or even more men that she does not know or have any connections to extremely not tzniusdik even with a gartel. The nicest mitzvah tanz is when only the chosson and kallah’s fathers, uncles and brothers dance with the kallah aside from the chosson himself. I always feel sorry for a kallah when she stands there so awkwardly while both strange men and women stare at her looking at her reaction while these strange men prance around the room. Honestly how tzniusdik is that? And that can go on for hours.
November 11, 2010 5:52 am at 5:52 am in reply to: Dose of reality: Kids kicked out of school #709025aries2756ParticipantI know that MY kids knew right from wrong even when they were 11 and 14. They knew how to choose their friends and which kids to stay away from. They knew what would get them into trouble and what would gain them rewards and mitzvos. If they felt someone was doing something wrong or something that would get them into trouble they came to me to talk about it.
Many of the kids I dealt with told me how they tried to protect other kids from going down their path. But when they find kids in pain they try to help them. WIY, you are never going to convince me that the kids you knew were “bad”. I know from my experience that they only had “bad” problems or bad issues.
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November 11, 2010 5:28 am at 5:28 am in reply to: Fathers and brothers dancing with the Kallah #709151aries2756ParticipantThis usually happens when there is no mitzvah tanz. I think it is a very emotional moment when the Kallah dances with her father and the brothers come in as well to have the honor of dancing with the Kallah. It is family thing and a family choice at a family simcha. Whether other people approve or not should really not be fodder for discussion it will only breed loshan horah.
aries2756Participantwood blocks
aries2756ParticipantI believe that someone was concerned about their community. You are right we need to be concerned about ALL children in ALL communities.
aries2756Participantladder back
November 11, 2010 1:29 am at 1:29 am in reply to: Dose of reality: Kids kicked out of school #709022aries2756ParticipantWIY, so tell me then, how could the children of a Rosh Yeshiva be so shallow that they would watch TV behind their parents back? Where is their shtarkeit and backbone? Something is missing if children from such a temimisdik foundation could allow themselves to be sidetracked or distracted! Shouldn’t they themselves have a hashpoah on the OTD kid?
This is where your theory doesn’t hold water. There is something missing to the story. There has to be something already happening with the child that would weaken his resolve to allow him to be persuaded by the other child. Either to be persuaded to look at improper magazines or TV, or whatever. If he was strong in his beliefs it wouldn’t happen.
aries2756ParticipantBook worm
November 10, 2010 10:48 pm at 10:48 pm in reply to: Dose of reality: Kids kicked out of school #709018aries2756ParticipantTwisted, thank you! I was going to respond but I think you have said enough! I do know what kids are doing since I do have kids of my own and I have mucho experience with at risk kids. And BTW I do know what’s on TV that’s how I have my skills at decorating. So I choose not to watch Family Guy and other things which insult my intelligence. And again I wills say it is not the TV that ruins a kid it is the dysfunction around them that does.
aries2756Participantcurly fries
aries2756ParticipantYour story is so sad because you let other people get in the middle of your relationship with Hashem. Why should you let the hypocrisy and sinners steal your relationship from you. What a pity, what a shanda. Yiddishkeit is not just a community of Jews and not just a society of people it is a one on one relationship with Hakadosh Baruch Hu.
Clever, even though you left them behind, Hashem has never left you, and I am sure you know it. He is always by your side and you should never hesitate to reach out to him. No matter what you have done, no matter what you are still doing, he still loves you and he is still looking out for you. Please don’t keep score on what other people do. Hashem is the ultimate score keeper and he is the only one that needs to keep cheshbon. In the end, when everyone has to give their din v’chesbon as they stand before their maker, everyone will get exactly what he feels they deserve.
aries2756Participantservice area
aries2756Participantcar service
November 10, 2010 3:26 pm at 3:26 pm in reply to: Dose of reality: Kids kicked out of school #709009aries2756ParticipantI just want to make another point very clear. KIDS COUNT! they are not disposable. There is no room for negativity when dealing with children we must surround them with POSITIVE energy! The faster we learn that and understand that the faster we can change things and make a difference!
November 10, 2010 3:23 pm at 3:23 pm in reply to: Dose of reality: Kids kicked out of school #709008aries2756Participantmsseeker, who is WE?
November 10, 2010 3:18 pm at 3:18 pm in reply to: Dose of reality: Kids kicked out of school #709007aries2756ParticipantRSRH and Josh and think you both hit the nail on the head!!! So to speak.
November 10, 2010 1:43 pm at 1:43 pm in reply to: Dose of reality: Kids kicked out of school #709003aries2756ParticipantWIY, ok lets start with this, we are of different generations and we have different life experiences so I will tell you off the bat that you have limited experience in what you are talking about.
“If a kid has access to this stuff he wont have any interest in Torah and Torah will not go in.”
Even this statement is false. There are many children from MO homes who have access to TV’s and movies who learn there full share of Torah, Gemorah, Mishanyos, etc. and continue on to yeshivos in E’Y, and guess what even go on to Kolel and become Rebbeim. Are you surprised? Yes even kids who watch TV and movies are Frum card carrying members of Jewish society and are completely shomer Torah and Mitzvos and even midos and maasim tovim. So lets get that straight from the beginning. Even many of today’s top Roshei Yeshivos watched TV as a kid and even dropped whatever they were doing to run home for their favorite shows. Are you shocked, don’t be. It was the way of the world.
In addition, it takes kids various amounts of time to go sour depending on their situations and you are wrong. The yeshiva can catch them if they care to and they can help and stop it in its tracks if they NOTICE and reach out to them. And it is NOT the TV, Movies etc that is ruining the kids, it is the dysfunctional home or the dysfunctional relationship the kid has at school. You have been brainwashed to think otherwise. I am not saying that a complete diet of TV or movies is healthy for anyone, but it is not what turns kids off to Torah. The problem with kids today is that they have not been turned ON to Torah to begin with and that’s where the Rebbe and the Yeshiva comes in. What are THEY doing wrong? or WHY did they not NOTICE that?
Had they chapped the child and TUNED them or TURNED them ON to begin with they would NOT be so interested in TV and MOVIES. Yes TV and movies are a distraction but they are also used because a child is BORED and needs to be entertained. If a child is interested in learning and enjoys it, or is excited by it or loves it, they would not be bored and in need of this distraction. Can you see that? They would be happy to prepare for the next day or even look something up to surprise and impress the Rebbe. Maybe even to chap another shiur in shul or with their father or chavrusa. That is what being TURNED on means. Are you aware that many homes have a TV but kids are so turned on to reading that they would rather read books than watch TV? Yeah, that happens too and that might be because their teachers TURNED them on to the power and the excitement of books! Or they would rather ride their bikes, roller blade, skate board, play basketball, etc.
You show a lit bit of naivity in your posts. And you show a lack of faith in the power of learning and in the strength and fortitude of the Toradik Jew that they can be swayed and persuaded so easily. What does that say about the chinuch that a child receives if it could be wiped out so easily by another child? It can’t be that strong or that great if a child cannot stand firm on that. And as I have said before, kids need to be instructed what to do if they are faced with these kinds of challenges. No they should not masser on a friend, but they should not carry these burdens on their tiny shoulders and they should not have to face such difficult challenges on their own. They should know from the time they are small that they always have someone to turn to whether it is a parent, a Rebbe in yeshiva or the Shul Rav. Why aren’t they taught that? Why weren’t you taught that?
And here is another question for you. Why is everything so black and white for you with no shades of gray? There seems to be something underlying in your conviction to this position.
aries2756Participantalarm box
aries2756ParticipantThere are NO nursing jobs in hospitals, so unless you are willing to do home care or work in an office DONT go into nursing.
aries2756Participantday dream
aries2756ParticipantHonestly I don’t understand what the question is. If YOU live in a Yeshivish community and your husband goes to that Yeshiva aren’t you obligated to ask the Rosh yeshiva and abide by the rules and customs that he sets for his yeshiva olam?
In all honesty if your husband is part of THAT yeshiva, you should keep to the rules of THAT yeshiva. It might be better to meet the other women for lunch or brunch or tea Shabbos afternoon when the men go to Mincha, if the Rosh prefers that couples don’t mingle then that is what you follow. If on the other hand the Rosh encourages hachnasos orchim, then that is what you follow.
November 10, 2010 3:38 am at 3:38 am in reply to: Dose of reality: Kids kicked out of school #709000aries2756ParticipantWIY, don’t you admit that the Yeshiva has an achrius in his upbringing and they should have noticed the signs on this kid that he was going sour and that there was something up with him? Why does the Yeshiva have to wait until he is in trouble and making trouble so they must kick him out, and not have caught him when they could have helped him and avoided the whole issue to begin with?
November 9, 2010 11:10 pm at 11:10 pm in reply to: Teenagers Hanging Around With A Bad Crowd #708101aries2756ParticipantWhen one is married they have a sounding board in their wives. They have someone to talk things over with and they don’t become overly involved. They can’t devote too much time to the cause they have other responsibilities so they don’t get in over their heads and their wives can point those things out to them.
November 9, 2010 10:52 pm at 10:52 pm in reply to: Dose of reality: Kids kicked out of school #708996aries2756ParticipantHB, I believe you!!!
November 9, 2010 10:12 pm at 10:12 pm in reply to: Dose of reality: Kids kicked out of school #708993aries2756Participantmseeker, BTW, the school stopped sending spies out on the avenue after this incident.
November 9, 2010 10:06 pm at 10:06 pm in reply to: Teenagers Hanging Around With A Bad Crowd #708099aries2756ParticipantIn some cases kids are very naive and they TRY to help OTD but they are too young and inexperienced and they should really not get involved until they are married and have more training and knowledge under their belts. Even if they are been their done that kids. If that is the case they should be working under the supervision of trained professionals.
aries2756ParticipantWolf, I love your story the best.
aries2756ParticipantIt is always important to keep the lines of communication open. Sometimes kids will open up to a neighbor or a friends parent before they open up to their own. Kids tend to think their parents are “nuts” while their friend’s parents are cool and genius. That’s normal too.
Never be afraid to say “I love you” to your child. Even if they make fun or throw their hands up that their too old, they need to hear it and they need your hugs. They take it with them and tuck them into their heart. They pull it out and envelope themselves in it whenever they feel insecure or are on shakey footing.
Ask them about their day, ask them about their friends, don’t push just ask. Ask if they would like to invite their friends over or have a friend for Shabbos or dinner. Make sure you don’t JUDGE their friend, neither their appearance or their attitude. Especially if you don’t like their friend, ask if he would like to have that friend over again. You know the quote “keep your friends close and your enemies closer”. Get to know them, you will be surprised as to how much of an influence you can be on that child as well just by being polite and caring.
That doesn’t mean that you have to break your rules for anyone. You can say “if you don’t mind please wash up before dinner”, or “Avi would be happy to lend you a kippah if you didn’t come with one”. If they give you an argument don’t push it too far. Just ask politely if they would do it out of respect for you. If they say they would rather not, you can say “I won’t push it, but please consider it.”
aries2756Participantfloat above the clouds
aries2756ParticipantIf he is not usually there put it in writing and give him a written notice of resigntation and in it explain that you would have told him in person but his schedule is irradic. If he doesn’t call you in or acknowledge your letter within a week, then email him a copy of the letter and ask for an acknowldegement. Thank him for the opporltunity of working for him, etc., etc, etc, and ask for a letter of recommendation.
aries2756ParticipantWhy is it stealing if you copy off of a Jewish CD which specifically states that you are not allowed to, or if you copy off a goyish CD or internet or IPOD.
If you don’t pay for it, you are stealing it. It is only meant for the use of the buyer! That is how the artist and producer makes their parnassah.
November 9, 2010 9:38 pm at 9:38 pm in reply to: Why we must support Torah financially to the best of our ability #707835aries2756ParticipantWIY, it is not so simple. Sometimes you start out on the same page and the same footing as the school, or there are only two schools in your neighborhood to choose from and this is the best fit for your child and family. Then out of nowhere, the rules start to shift and the school starts to compete with the school one town over or in the next city and the rules become more and more stringent. YES WIY, this happens all the time.
For instance, my daughter was in a mainstream BY type school in Flatbush. My daughter is now 33, so we are going back some time. In the summer the sock man came to all the bungalow colonies and I stocked up on knee hi’s for the year. In maroon and navy as I always did. Now I get home and get a package from the school the first week in September stating that they changed the rules and now they would only allow WHITE knee hi’s. I called them up and told them “Sorry, it is too late to change this rule. Everyone buys and stocks up in the summer and no one starts to shop in Semptember. If you wanted to change this rule you should have done it in June at the end of the last term not after all the parents have already done their shopping. I am sending my daughter in the colored socks I have already spent MY budget on and YOU had better not say anything to her.” My friends all did the same.
The entire year and years to follow my daughter kept coming home with NEW RULES. It drove the kids nuts. So you see WIY it is not a matter of choosing a school with rules and then following them. It is a matter of a school deciding on the rules and then sticking to them!
I agree that when a family chooses a school they are obligated to follow their rules. But I don’t agree that when schools keep making up new silly rules that it applies as well especially when it is midstream.
aries2756ParticipantWhat we can learn from ALL these posts is that we can’t make blanket statements and that ALL cases need to be dealt with on an individual basis. Even though there are rules and even though the rules were put there for a reason.
WIY, as a kid, you should not have shouldered the responsibility of such a situation, however YOU should have been taught WHAT to do in such a situation and NO maybe it was not YOUR responsibility to go to the hanhalah but maybe it was YOUR responsibility to discuss this with your shul RAV and ask a hypothetical question such as “Rebbe, what should a bochur do if they are worried about their friend who is displaying inapproriate behavior like showing other kids inapproriate magazines?” That RAV should have guided you. Maybe he would have spoken to your friend. Maybe he could have reached out to him and helped him. Maybe he could have advised him that he would be kicked out of school if he continued doing what he was doing or that he himself would speak to his parents and menahel without ratting you out. That is what kids are supposed to do, hand over their issues to an adult and obviously the boy in question also did not know how to do that.
So this is one thing we need to understand KIDS do not get involved in dark issues for no reason. They don’t change from innocents into know it alls without cause. The schools have a responsibility to NOTICE this.
In answer to msseeker, no she did not hide her pain nor was she a baalas gaivah, and she didn’t want to burden her family with more pain because she felt they were already carrying more than their fair share. She innocently (truly) just vented to kids who cared enough to listen and that was both boys and girls who meant no harm, they just cared.
B”H to the Monsey BY principal and all those like her who understand that a yiddish neshoma is just that no matter what they are doing, they are Hashem’s children and they are worth the effort!
I am in no way saying to allow any child to do whatever they want and to hurt another child whether emotionally, physically or academically. But accomodations can be made without throwing a child out. Schools can ask for volunteers in the community to come and help out with kids at risk. You would be surprised at the many volunteers, parents, mechanchim, and social workers, etc. who have experience in the field either because of work experience or because they have already been there done that and weathered the storm. There are many people who are willing to save another yiddishe neshoma and see them succeed.
There are many mechanchim in one’s own yeshiva who are better suited to speak to and deal with kids in pain. Kids don’t necessarily open up to just anyone, but kids will open up to those they feel truly care and they feel they can trust. And if all else fails, then and only then should other accomodations be made for them. But Yeshivas cannot say THEY have no achrius to these kids that they helped to raise.
aries2756ParticipantThere is always a reason why teenagers move in that direction and it is usually because THAT crowd accepts them while the crowd their parents want them to be with for some reason is not as accepting or understanding. The crowd they are moving towards is offering them something they are in need of at the moment. So there is something going on with them right now.
Ask your friend what changes she has seen in her son lately. Ask her what is going on with him lately. Tell her to find out from his teachers, friends and Rebbeim quietly if they noticed any changes or if there is something she should know.
November 9, 2010 3:56 pm at 3:56 pm in reply to: Parental Resposibility for Damage by Minor Child #708081aries2756ParticipantFeif un, we are not talking asur here. We are talking obligation. It is not assur to pay a minor’s obligation.
November 9, 2010 3:55 pm at 3:55 pm in reply to: Parental Resposibility for Damage by Minor Child #708080aries2756ParticipantBezalel, that’s not true. If a minor child let’s say breaks a neigbhor’s window playing baseball, the parent is responsible to replace that window.
aries2756Participantsac, babies…..ah……………….
aries2756ParticipantI of course wasn’t involved, seriously I didn’t think it was a very nice thing to do. It was in elementary school and the kids wanted a day off, so they stuffed paper towels in the bathroom sinks on the second floor and turn them on full blast. So as they started to run over they started to flood the floors and then the floors started to flood the hallways and run down the stairs to the first floor and the younger grades….
They didn’t know what was going on and they started calling the parents and the school busses and sent everyone home.
aries2756ParticipantFirst on the list is my grandkids, they always make me happy.
Second would be helping people.
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