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Mazel and Brocha to the gantza mishpocha!
Yita, believe what you want, I won’t lose sleep over it. I only hope that you won’t have to change your mind because it hits close to home.
And your “fulfilling your tafkid” rhetoric holds no water. What if you were a thief and someone was stopping you from stealing, would you say then too that we are stopping you from fulfilling your tafkid?
That is absolutely ridiculous and makes no sense. Stealing is NOT a tafkid that is an aveirah.
Syag, maybe it is the tone you are reading it and not the tone I am writing it. I am giving information and answering questions. If you are reading it defensively then you will be offended and feel I am being short.
Soleik, I do agree, I am just presenting forms of application that the Agudah could have and should have implemented. And my questions still remains WHY hasn’t any progress been made and why haven’t then implemented neither any safeguards nor any change what-so-ever in all the years that they have been discussing this issue? Furthermore, why are the efforts of those who wish to protect children and make their world a safer and kosher place being attacked and thwarted. This is so ridiculous. If those same molesters were to give these children treif lollipops there would be a whole revolution about the nerve of not being careful about handing out treif candy. But on this issue? silence. Lets compare the damage of a treif lollipop versus child rape or molestation, which causes more damage?
msseeker, Yes, very clear and he was NOT a yungerman he was MY age and spoke perfect english. He was also a chevrah man who knew a lot more than me, no question about it. He continued with “do you think it didn’t happen in MY days in yeshiva?”
Yita, I am NOT missing your point at, all it is you who are purposely missing mine. I can’t respect Rabbis who do nothing about this. Do you get it now? They can and should but don’t. They are NOT stopping the molesters or the problem. Should I respect that? They are NOT implementing nor proposing safeguards to make it harder for the molesters. Should I respect that? Do you get that? They are not making it harder for the molesters to harm children? Do you get that? Should I respect that? They are NOT implementing educating children about their own private space and NOT allowing anyone to invade that space even if it is a teacher, rebbe, parent, sibling, relative, friend, etc. or touch them inappropriately, this needs to be taught in school by trained individuals. Should I respect that? They are NOT implementing safeguards in mikvaot, should I respect that? What have they done over the past few years since this issue has been publicized that I can respect? Please tell me, respect needs to be earned once it is lost.
Yita, please don’t tell me what I believe. The Littile I know, I know many victims who have written and called and have been ignored. No one is a malach not even the authorities at the Agudah so they cannot possibly know what a victim wants to say or what their agenda is, so you are very, very wrong in what you are saying. You are just towing the party line. Yes there are many Rabbonim that have met with victims but not as members or representatives of the Agudah. Rabbi Yosef Blau is the most prominent Rabbinical representative who had not only met with but advocates for victim/survivors. Rabbi Yitzchak Eisenmann from Passaic, New Jersey listens to victims and advocates for them. I don’t know too many more, if you do, you should list them so victims who read this can contact them.
My question is why don’t those with authority implement change? What would happen if those who “order” that one cannot go to the police also order that there must be an attendant in the men’s mikva at all times and that men can’t linger in the mikva as if it is a pool or gathering place. Would there be change? Do you think molesters would know they are being watched?
What would happen if the Agudah would announce that doors to all rooms in a yeshiva must have widows and they cannot be covered up with shades or papers but always must be classrooms must always be visible from the hallways and that all yeshivas must have video monitoring in the hallways, kitchens, basements, storerooms, etc. Do you think molesters would get the message that they are being watched?
What would happen if the Agudah announced that all staff members including Rebbeim and Roshei Yeshivas must be fingerprinted and background checked, do you think molesters would stop moving from one yeshiva to another?
What would happen if some of the Rabbinic molesters were quietly retired a few at a time and were given a shomer to make sure they are never alone in the vicinity of children?
Any and all of such things could have been and should have been implemented over the years that this issue has been brought to the attention of the Agudah. What if anything was implemented?
What kind of financial assistance or fund was set up victims to receive therapy to recover from their trauma? Nothing. Why is the financial stability only of the molesters and their families important?
The Agudah is the largest Religious organization that the frum olam has. They are the only one that that can implement change, they are the only ones that can sway the public, and manage the masses. They are the only group that has the power to do anything and yet the keep us powerless and if we are powerless then our children remain kaporos.
So I can either keep trying to explain this to you because this is what I do, I advocate for children and for victims trying to wipe this evilness out in my lifetime. Or I can fail at my tafkid. If I were a Doctor I would keep trying to teach everyone to stay healthy. If I were a dentist I would keep trying to teach everyone to take care of their teeth, if I were a teacher I would try to teach everyone the value of a good education. You can either learn and do something about it, or you can keep drinking the kool-aid. It is so easy to blame the bloggers who are trying to shake everyone up to effect change. You don’t like they go about forcing change? Then find another way to make change happen, but the status quo is totally unacceptable.
yita, the point is that we honor and respect all because form the outside they profess to be so good, and they show themselves to be pillars of the community. But what they don’t show to the public is that dark side of their character and that is that they are molesters. It is only when someone “outs” them that we know they are not who they pretend to be. They are NOT the “tzadik”, the “Choshuva” mentch, the great Rabbi, they are just a molester.
When a victim tell us THIS is the man that molested me such as Joel Engelman who outed a Rebbe from Satmar Yeshiva, then that man should no longer enjoy any kovod at all and should not be trusted with children. He should NOT be protected by the community and no one should send their children into his class. It boggles the mind that he is still teaching. When Kolko was outed and it was known that Margolis covered for him. It boggles the mind that he opened another yeshiva and parents threw their children at him.
Syag Lchochma, most kids don’t just open up to their parents. Parents and teachers have to see the changes in the kids and notice that there is something wrong. It takes a while before the adults in their lives notice and make the effort to investigate why the change has taken place and get the child to speak to them. That is why it takes a professional who knows how to investigate and question a child to get the truth and NOT a Rabbi who does not know anything about such a delicate investigation.
Furthermore, The little I know, the Agudah nor Rabbonim in general have met with Professionals but NOT victims. There are many, many victims who have written with requests to meet with and speak to, but have never been responded to. And NO I will NOT list the names of the Gedolim they have contacted. And yes I admit that the Agudhah has held meetings on this subject for years, and what has been the outcome of those meetings? What have they implemented after all those years of meetings? Have they implemented any safety regulations for Mikvehs? Have they implemented any safety regulations for schools? Have they implemented any rules regarding what will happen to molesters if they are caught? Have they announced any guidelines for children? What have they come up with after all these years of discussions?
Is there reason for the K’lal to be upset, angry and suspicious. On any other given issue or subject the Agudah has much to say. Even on this subject they have what to say about reporting or not reporting the abusers, and yet they have nothing to say about the abusers themselves or what they will do or what should be done if an abuser is caught or what should be implemented to protect children. All these years of meetings with professionals and our Gedolim can not come up with guidelines to implement in Yeshivas, shuls and mikvaot? All these years of meetings and discussions and our Gedolim can not issue letters and announcements about the preciousness of our children and how parents, neighbors, relatives and mechanchim should never forget that Hashem is watching over these neshomas and see everything that is happening to them. That no one should take for granted they are Hashem’s angels and that anyone who takes advantage of them or destroys their innocence will be severely punished both in this world and in the world to come.
There are ways and means that they can make very strong statements and implement changes that can make a huge difference. So where are they? Why haven’t they? This is why they are being attacked and being accused as they are because of their lack of action.
yitayningwut, what makes a person great? Is it what they do in public or what they do in private?
Mods, I believe that when they started protecting the Rabbonim they did not have the knowledge they have today. They honestly did not know what kind of damage it was doing to the children. They probably thought that kids are resilient and they will forget about it and get over it. And they should be more concerned about protecting The Rebbeim and the Yiddishe Image. They were concerned about not making a chilul Hashem and about not letting outsiders see that Jews are also human and have the same problems as everyone else.
Now that WE know what kind of damage this has done, the fact that abused children become adult abusers so abuse breeds abuse, it ruins the lives of the victims, the kids go off the derech, they grow up to never have normal relationships in their adult lives or never marry, or they become homosexual, or they turn to drugs and alcohol to self-medicate and numb the pain, trauma and nightmares, or they overdose or purposely take their own lives…..the situation has spiraled out of control both for the victims and for those who protected the abusers.
What are they supposed to do now after protecting so many, admit that they were wrong and tell people to start turning abusers over to the police? Well what happens if one of those they had protected for so long is turned over to the police? What happens if it comes out that so many Chashuv Rabbonim knew about them for many years? What happens to the reputation of the Yeshiva we spoke about in the other thread when the truth comes out that they harbored a molester for decades? What happens when abusers are turned in and their families come complaining to the Rabbonim that they know they protected so and so, why won’t they help their family member?
IMHO, they should say they were wrong for so long, that they didn’t know what the outcome would be for so many innocent children. What they need to do is hold a conference where they invite victims to come in and speak to them, have a panel of Rabbonim in different rooms and let victims stand up and tell their stories. Let there be many different rooms so that many victims get to speak out and tell their stories and let them name their abusers. Let the Rabbonim listen to their pain, let them see the effects on the once innocent and frum kinderlach. Then they can come together and make a decision. Then they can report back to the olam that after reviewing so many cases from the perspective of the victims, they have come to the conclusion that a molester is a “rodef” and the damage they do is too dangerous to take a chance with, therefore one must turn them over to the police just like any other person that is in the category of “rodef”.
I wonder if you or anyone else has any Idea if any of these Rabbonim have ever invited an abuse victim to come and speak to them and hear their story? Rabbonim do NOT want to speak to victims. They do NOT want to hear their stories. They do not want to dirty their hands, or desensitize their delicate ears with the harshness and filth of the truth these victims carry.
This is the painful truth and this is what hurts the most. This is why the victims of abuse say they have no voice. This is how they were silenced. It is not enough that they were humiliated by the abuse itself, they were shamed into keeping quiet. Do you think it feels good not to trust or look up to Rabbonim or those who are supposed to be our leaders? Do you know what it feels like? It feels like being a Yosom, like you lost your parents and you are alone in the world. That is what it is like to lose your faith and trust in the Gedolim or in what we consider Daas Torah. It feels like you had the rug pulled right out from under your feet. The very same people you would not have considered to make a move without checking with, the very same people you would change your schedule around to have the opportunity to meet and greet, or be privileged to chap a few words of chizuk from, you no longer trust or feel any sense of chizuk from, just hypocrisy. It feels like you were shot in the heart and you are bleeding to death. That is what it feels like to lose your respect and your confidence in the chaburah of Rabbonim you trusted all your life. No it doesn’t feel good, but it is what it is and it is NOT going to change until this issue is resolved.
And by the way, MY Rav said to go to the police.
Two years ago, I met a chasidish couple in Miami. He was running for political office in Brooklyn. I asked him what makes him qualified to hold a political position. So he told me how much he does for the community and how he advocates for the yiddin and so on. So I asked him, oh in that case what does he intend to do about the molestation problem in the yeshivas? He told me, “what problem, it is a part of growing up. Most of my son’s friends were molested”. He said this with a straight face as if it was a right of passage or a fact of life. I just looked at him as if he were a martian and said “You knew that these boys were molested and you did nothing about it, you said nothing about it and you want to represent the community? You claim you advocate for the community? You are worthless!”
MODS, I didn’t say they condone it I say they ignore it and protect the abusers. There is a difference.
edited. Very well. Do you suppose there is some bad faith on their part?
slave-to-g-d, they made that very clear in their previous announcement, there would have been no need to have this private session to reiterate that. It makes no sense. I believe what I was told.
All true, and the Agudah and other Jewish Organizations will attack the Homosexuals and the act of Homosexuality but will ignore the fact that most molesters are committing non consensual homosexual acts on minors and yet THEY themselves are not only ignoring it but protecting them. How hypocritical can they be? Seriously!
zahavasdad, restaurants might have more than one hashgacha because not every Rav agrees with or trusts every hashgacha and therefor their kehila does not abide by it and won’t eat in the restaurant. An owner who wants to bring in more business from more customers will try to please more Rabbonim.
On the other hand, there are neighborhoods where the VAAD, does NOT allow any hashgacha but theirs. So if an establishment wants the OU or Kaf K, the Rabbonim tell their kehilas NOT to eat there.
For sure, I would describe myself as a Mama Bear and I don’t limit it to my own cubs.
Goq, I have heard this and also heard that it is NOT true. I am on the fence about this. People say to do this because of the amonia property in urine, but I was told it is not true and one shouldn’t do it.
Health, I will agree with this, if a baby is crowning it is very difficult for a woman to be in a moving vehicle. It is extremely painful and scary. There is a time when one can travel and there is a time when one needs to be still. Even when one is having very painful and close contractions it is extremely painful to be in a moving vehicle especially going over bumps and potholes. During contractions I asked my hubby to pull to the side of the road.
I think the Vaad of Queens has a very good reputation and it is very well respected. It is run very well.
BJJ, is extremely high academically and hashkafa wise. Michlalah is also very tough academically.
OT, be the best Jew you can be. Don’t look at others, look at yourself. Remember that you are always standing before Melech Malchei Hamelochim. Don’t miss the obvious opportunities to do mitzvos. Try NOT to miss the less than obvious opportunities to do mitzvos. Do the best you can, then strive to do better. And…..well….yup…thats about it.
As far as fear of dying is concerned, I used to be terrified. I don’t think about it anymore. Maybe because my parents are gone, and if I died today I feel they would be there waiting for me with open arms to walk into, so it won’t be so scary. I have lost many people that I love, so I guess in my mind it would be a reunion with those who I admire and love. What would I miss in this world? I would miss my family, my kids, my grandkids, etc. But Hashem has been very good to me. I have a lot of nachas from them, and if Hashem decided to take me home, then he wouldn’t decide that I have had enough nachas, he would decide that I have suffered enough pain on this world.
There is a VAAD in every neighborhood and that is what the neighborhood relies on. Usually the Rabbonim in the neighborhood are tied to the Vaad. This is how they operate, they charge both the stores and the kehilah for their services and that is how the Vaad Hamachshir gets paid his big bucks. In some communities the Vaad is run very well, and the monies spent are well worth it, in some not so much.
Unfortunately if you want a hechsher in order to make money, that is the way the game is played. There are no separate plans for New business or small business owners. It is one size fits all and there are no exceptions. This is the way it is done. There is a fee for the Vaad, and the business pays the Mashgiach. I don’t particularly think this is the proper way to go, because the business then takes on the mashgiach as an employee or a consultant however their accountant wants them to do it. This minimizes the employees for the Vaad, so they don’t have to have employee payroll, tax returns, etc. I don’t think this is fair or the right thing to do. They are collecting huge fees, and it should be run like any other business. In addition, in most cases these mashgichim are neither tested nor trained by the Vaad.
Up a baby vista is a very nice option, on sale now at Gilt.com with the cot and it opens and closes easier than the bugaboo and has a few features better than the bugaboo. I also find that you have to be an engineer to open and close the bugaboo.
What is wrong with asking her father? Why is everyone assuming that her father doesn’t count here?
I had very long labors and very short deliveries and to tell you the truth, by the time I was ready to deliver I didn’t care if the Janitor delivered my baby, I just wanted that baby out safely and healthy. That is the most important thing. It would be great if everyone can follow their “Birth Plan” but when things get to an emergency level the birth plan is thrown out the window and one should be grateful to have any EMT or qualified person there to deliver a healthy baby into the world. Life is complicated enough and a delivery can be dangerous and complicated. Anyone with any knowledge of birth and delivery is a brocha to have close by. Yes it would be ideal to have a midwife, doula, or female Hatzola member come to one’s rescue but there is no guarantee of that even if women do join Hatzola. And of course when you get to the hospital there is no guarantee that you will have a female doctor deliver your baby either. Even women who choose to have a female OB, there is no guarantee that she will be the one to deliver your baby. She could be in with another patient, she could be in the office, she could be on vacation, she could be stuck in traffic. There are no guarantees.
So although both sides have good points, pros and cons, no matter what decisions are made, there are no guarantees that those who want a female responder will get what they want. And to be stubborn and hold out for one, will only result in dangerous situations and antagonism among Hatzolah members.
Firstly, let me say that you are right, and parents have been right about this for a long time. Having said that, there is not much we can do about it because many kids need it and many parents want it so the system is NOT going to change.
Please understand that YOU should NOT be doing the homework and you SHOULD encourage the kids to do it on their own. Try to separate them as much as possible and allow them to work separately in a quiet environment. Tell them to do whatever they can on their own, skip what they need your help with, and you will help each of them once they have finished what they can on their own. Set a clock for each. In other words, take a post it, and mark the time each one starts. Do this for at least two weeks, so you have an idea of how long it takes each kid (each grade) to do their homework. Then you can discuss with the other parents in each class how long it takes their kids to do homework. If it takes the same amount of time and you all agree that it is too much then as a group of parents you can approach the teacher and say that she/he is assigning too much homework and that she/he has to cover more work in class and not leave it to the parents to teach it to the kids at home. If it is just your child that is taking too long, then you might have to consider getting some help at home to get your child more focused and up to speed.
By timing the kids, and allowing them to do their work on their own and only watching over them when they come to you after trying on their own, you have a better picture of what they learned in school, what they are capable of figuring out on their own, and what you need to reinforce or teach on your own. You have a better understanding of whether the teacher is giving too much or whether your child needs extra help. In this way, you have a better understanding of where the problem lies.
Many, many moons ago, when my kids were young, I complained to the teacher that she was giving ME too much homework. She laughed at me and said why? I said because I had to sit with my daughter and answer all her questions and help her. The teacher told me “I didn’t ask you to, your daughter was supposed to learn to come to school and ask ME what she didn’t understand!”.
If you had an endoscopy, couldn’t you just send the study to another doctor for review?
I know because some of the Rabbonim have started to advocate for the victims and are no longer towing the Augdah line, they have reported back to the victims and advocates. They are quite appalled by what they were told.
It seems like not all the Rabbonim are happy with the way things are going and they are NOT keeping quiet. They are speaking about the closed door session and they are letting it be known what was said there. Lets think about this for a minute. If Rabbonim were told to go to the police or to tell their kehillos to go to the police as the Agudah had announced previously, why would they need a “quiet” behind the scenes, closed door conference by invitation only, with a guard at the door with a “guest list” checking ID’s so no one that was not invited could not enter.
It is really hard to inform people of the truth when many of you don’t want to hear it. It really puts me in a difficult position. I am an advocate for children and an advocate for victims. I am told things. People pass along important information to me. Many of you want to know and be informed and many of you wish to continue to keep your heads in the sand. I decided that I would offer the information and if the moderators felt it was appropriate to post, they would post it. If they felt it was inappropriate they would NOT post it. It is important to stop sweeping all this under the rug. It is important to start taking some of the responsibility into our own hands and stop accepting unacceptable behavior.
WE have to take some responsibility as well for allowing it to continue decade after decade and not joining together as a K’lal and saying NO MORE, we will NOT allow it to continue any longer. Can you imagine how many children could have been saved had people such as ourselves taken a stand one decade ago or even two or three? Thousands upon thousands of yiddishe neshomas could have been saved from this evil, disgusting, humiliating, degrading and traumatizing life altering abuse. So do we continue to play the “hear no evil, see no evil, speak no evil” game or do we take a stand and put an end to this monstrous practice and to those who choose to cover it up.
I am sitting here crying. Not knowing what to do anymore. Do I walk away from here? Do I stay and keep trying? I don’t know. I am no longer sure of what my tafkid is.
slave-to-g-d, yes I also heard about this closed door meeting by invitation only, but that is NOT what I heard it was about or how it went. What I was informed is that the Rabbonim were instructed that nothing had changed and they were told to keep “informers” silenced and that they should handle cases themselves according to what they deem is raglayim l’davar or not. If they feel it is raglayim l’davar they themselves should report it straight to the DA’s office and skip going to the police because in Brooklyn, they have a deal with the DA’s office and they will handle things on the QT. They were also told NOT to get the family of the victim involved with the DA but to handle it themselves and keep the victim and the family quiet.
I believe it is for these reasons the Rabbonim want to get rid of computers and internet in the home. It is because information is shared very accurately and very quickly among the K’lal.
What does your father think?
Teshuva doesn’t work without real therapy with professionals. “I’m sorry” is worthless and should never be trusted.
There is always a margin of error but we have learned after so many years of doing it wrong, that it is better to err on the side of safety for the children, since the margin of error is so much smaller and the danger to the children is so much greater. From statistics we have learned that there is less than 4% false allegations made, and there are no statistics garnered at all from Jewish victims.
The Crime is the abuse, and more so the abuse that has been happening for so many decades. So many children needlessly being led like sheep to the slaughter because of the convoluted notion that the honor of the molester is more important than the lives of the children. Enough is enough!! As parents and grandparents, as victims and survivors WE have to speak out and not follow blindly as was done in the past and keep feeding our innocent neshomas to these monsters and give kovod to their protectors.
On THIS issue we have to stand firm and strong and say AD KAN and no more. Absolutely NOT!!! WE have to be very clear “This situation is unacceptable! The way it has been handled in the past is unacceptable! AND it stops here and now!” Whether the molester, predator, pedophile or however you want to label or describe him is a laymen, teacher, or choshov Rav, they all boil down to one category “dangerous and detrimental to our innocent children” and they all fall into another similar category “they are all criminals and belong in jail”. There are no ifs, ands or buts.
We can’t look at a molester as a “chashuv person” because anyone who can forget that Hashem is watching him, and Hashem knows what he is doing while he is molesting a child, is not choshuv in Hashem’s eyes and cannot be considered “choshuv” or respectable in our eyes either.
This story is a follow up to the story in the Forward who actually go the information from the DA’s office. Please read the article in the Forward for more detailed information.
It is not up to you to have this discussion with him. It is up to your husband to tell him. Obviously, since he is NOT married he lacks the social skills he would have gained had he been. Your husband has to politely tell him that the two of you really enjoy his company but the two of you need alone time as well, so he should pick a night that he would like to share your company and that will be his night to join the two of you. And when it is time for him to leave, your husband needs to say, “we had a great time and we look forward to your next visit but right now we have to start settling down for the night, so we can wake up with the kids, or be up in time to start our morning routine.” or whatever you think is appropriate.
Unfortunately some people wait to long to make the call and ask for help. If you think there is abuse in the relationship and the other party refuses to go for counseling pick up the phone and make the call. They will ask the appropriate questions. Better to make the call too soon than too late. They will ask you if you have seen a counselor, if your spouse has seen a counselor, if you want to see a counselor, etc. They are not looking to split up couples if it is not necessary.
I agree, it is nice to take a moment to thank you for giving us a place in which we can come for help or be of help to others.
moi aussi, I was agreeing with you. I didn’t mean “your” as a personal “you”. I meant it as a general “your, mine, his, her”. I’m sorry if I wasn’t clear.
As a citizen it is your duty to serve on a jury if called. It is because Jews think they should get out of jury duty that people like Lemrick Nelson got away with murdering Yankel Rosenbaum, and O.J. got away with murder as well. Religious people with their feet frimly planted in an understanding of right and wrong should use the common sense Hashem gave them to put criminals behind bars and allow innocent people to go free.
There must be a number to call on the notice. Call and find out what you need to submit if you can’t do it at this time.
I wonder if you every kept a food diary? It might help to see what is triggering your problem.
moi aussi, I agree. Men should lsten to the R”Y they are close to and trust. But that doesn’t mean that everyone has to listen to YOUR or HIS R”Y. Obviously many Roshei Yeshivas as well as many Rabbonim in general have varied opinions on various issues.
oomis, they now come in 10oz bottles not cans, something new, so straight off the bottle:
180 calories
calories from fat 80
total fat 9g
saturated fat 1.5g
Trans fat 0g
Cholestrol 15 mg
Sodium 260 mg
Potassium 550mg
Total Carbs 4g
Dietary Fiber 2g
Sugars 2g
Sugar Alcohol 0g
Other Carbohydrates 0g
Protein 20 g
Teaching young women how to sew is an excellent idea. It should be a required subject in every girl’s school especially when we realize how the economy has taken such a nose dive. It is important for young women and future mothers to know how to create their own clothing and that of their children or to know how to take an article of clothing and make the appropriate changes to make it useful and either tznius, age appropriate or wearable whatever the case may be. Why pay for designer clothes at ridiculous prices? Why wear what everyone else is wearing just to conform when you have the freedom to create what YOU like with your own twist, or buy something at a ridiculously low price and turn it into something fabulous? Why not take an amazing sweater and add a contrast fabric to turn it into a maternity top, or take a great skirt and add a panel to use it for maternity? When you know how to sew you can make magic. You can buy an inexpensive piece of fabric and turn it into the most adorable matching outfits for your kids without breaking the bank.
Do you know that you can buy a dress that is a bit short cut it by the thigh, add a contrasting fabric panel and add six inches to it, meanwhile you just made a striped dress that looks like it was the style to begin with. Many dressmakers come up with great ideas like adding a beaded sleeve and belt to make a jumper into a dress, or adding another layer under a dress to add length, or making a dress a little shorter and adding a layer under or adding appliques or flowers to cover up a rip, a tear or an untzniusdik opening if you don’t want to use a shell underneath. If you know how to sew you can do magic to any garment. Why should you spend and invest huge amounts of money for maternity clothes you don’t even like and are not flattering just because you don’t want to walk out in a garbage bag or you don’t want people to speak about you like those women that are being spoken about here? Every single high school girl, even middle school girl should learn how to sew. By the time a girl is 16 she should be able to sew her own clothes.
DY, I take offense to your prodding me into an argument.
The NASI project was an ad in the paper that was brought into this forum for discussion pros and cons. I participated in that discussion. It was NOT a venting of how disgusting a certain group of women were. As far as your other issues, please tell me when I started a thread to bash or speak L”H on your other subjects. YOU owe me an apology DY. I’m waiting.
As far as the remark “From what I’m led to believe, the lack of tznius in these women doesn’t begin with maternity.” pure Loshon Horah. Is this the way we are supposed to behave while our Tzaddikim and tinokim are dying? This is what we have taken upon ourselves?????? It doesn’t matter that we are all anonymous here, Hashem knows who we are!
Everyday I look at the misaskim list, everyday I look at the News right here on YWN and see more and more tragedies and instead of writing about things that show “mi k’amcha yisroel” this is what YOU choose to speak about. Shame on all of you.
PBA, really? Where did I criticize YOU and YOUR tznius standards? Please show me. I don’t want to go through another round with you as in the past. You asked me a question and I responded. If you take offense, sorry, but I did NOT respond to you, your Rosh Yeshiva or anything personally having to do with you.
You chose a whole group of women to specify and yenta about. if there is a purpose in this it would not be. If this was about helping someone or starting a line of cute and youthful maternity clothes that didn’t look frumpy and baggy, but actually was meant for young 20 somethings and not 40 somethings so that they wouldn’t wear spandex and way too revealing clothes then that would be a whole different discussion. But this is a thread about how disgusting these young women are for doing what they are doing. So yes, that’s loshon horah.
PBA, Hashem blessed families with both genders for a very good reason. There is nothing wrong for families to have a Shabbos meal together and I will follow that with it is no one else’s business. It would be up to the individual parents to decide whether or not all their children should join or not. In many cases these families were raised together and the girls are friends and the boys are friends or they are as close as family.
On the other hand, there are many families who invite bochurim from their local yeshiva dorms for Shabbos meals as well. Many Rebbeim invite bochurim home for meals. I have never heard that Rebbeim that ONLY have boys invite bochurim home for shabbos meals or Oneg Shabbos. I have never heard that Rebbeim lock their daughters in the Attic when their bochurim visit either. It is very difficult for families to have so many guests and for Rebbeim to do this if they don’t have daughters at home to help their wives.
I live in a community where Hochnosos Orchim is a huge part of our community. I find this a little over the top.
DY, it is loshon horah because you are picking on women who dress in a manner that they choose to dress instead of just role modeling and asking your own kids NOT to dress that way. Or asking your own wives NOT to dress that way. What is the point of speaking badly about these women? Why be so judgmental? It is NOT nice seriously. You won’t solve the problem here and you are just venting pure loshon horah here.
Here is another perspective. Men want to marry size 2 women. Yes only skinny, skinny women and then they get pregnant and they feel fat. The maternity clothes are huge and ugly, not stylish and not pretty at all. Here you have tiny women who now can no longer fit into their tiny clothes and now look like their fat counterparts who their husbands would never have dated in the first place. They don’t want to feel fat. They just want to look pregnant. How do they do that? They still want to be attractive to their husbands and they still want to dress as they dressed when they were a size 2. They are brainwashed from the time they were teenagers to be skinny, skinny, skinny. Who did this to them????? So no they don’t want to wear ugly maternity clothes. They want to wear clothes that make them feel thin and cute just like before. Maybe that is the problem.
So stop looking for reasons to judge others. It is pure loshon horah. And to the men, stop looking at women!
Hitting children teaches them that it is OK to hit and be violent. Hitting/violence is never the answer and a parent needs to role model how to use words in any given situation to work things through and to find solutions to difficult situations. Hitting in anger is YOUR problem not the children’s. It shows that YOU are out of control NOT the children and it is you that have the problem not the children. It seems that YOU have coping issues and you have to work on that. When the children feel that you are IN CONTROL they will feel more settled and trusting of you. Right now they know they can push your buttons and send you out of control. Why would they respect your for that?
Don’t let the situation build up to where YOU feel out of control.
If YOU feel you are losing your patience, remove yourself from the situation. Give yourself a time out before you deal with it.
Separate the kids or remove the item of contention.
Give each child an opportunity to tell their side of the story before judging the situation. Then you can say, you are all “right” and you are all “wrong” because you should have figured out a way to avoid a fight so you each have to apologize. Validating their feelings is the key to calming them down.
Set the house rules with your spouse when things are calm and happy and let the kids know what the rewards and consequences are. Teach them about time outs and how that works and how it is a mitzva to listen the first time. And how they will lose a privilege if you or your spouse have to repeat yourselves over and over.
For instance. If you have to tell them ten times to get ready for bed, the next night you will send them to bed 10 minutes earlier. Each night that they don’t listen, you will have to start bed time earlier and earlier, until they listen the first time. When they listen the first time for a whole week, you will all go out for ice cream on Sunday, or the one who listened the first time a whole week will go out with you for Ice Cream on Sunday. Or if they listen the first time there will be time for a story. If they waste time, there is no time for a story.
If you have trouble in the beginning, keep your hands behind your back or in your pockets. Never raise your voice. If you find that you are raising your voice take two deep breathes before you continue. Each time you find that you are raising your voice stop and breathe.
If you have to pick a child up and carry them to time out or to their room, then do so but don’t hit and don’t say angry words. Just say “you just earned a time out do you know why?” if they say no. Just say “you can think about it while you are having your time out and we will talk about it when I come to get you”. Then when the time is over you ask again, why did you earn a time out? Discuss what happened and then let the child apologize to whomever he needs to. If they leave their room or the designated time out chair, put them back and start the timer again.
This is a learning process for both you and your kids.