Always_Ask_Questions

People get addicted to 24-hour delivery of everything. Some things are hard, you can show respect and add those who are risking their lives in your davening.

The problem might be that these minhagim might need to change quickly with technology and social changes – sometimes l’kula, sometimes l’humra.
For example, nobody was saying hamotzi on pizza 100 years ago – as it was a treat. Now people do because it became, lo aleinu, a full lunch.
Processsed food became more uniform and with different ingredients. Humriche food became more accessible in many places.

> it would be best not to name the town

indeed, it is even worse in less densely Jewish towns. When you see a clearly observant person misbehaving on the road, you likely know the person and it is also weighs more into people’s perception.

rescue> Put all the stress in your in laws. That sound very biblical.
Or the govement =usury

Of course you can support yourself and learn. Not a new idea. But as long as it is private and volunteer, there should not be a problem. Rambam learned while his brother supported him, and worked after that (and supported his brother’s family). I would have no problem supporting a Talmid Chochom as a S-I-L. It is just most of current learning is not at the level but it is “Torah as medicine” (idea endorsed by gemorah) – to prevent people going off the derech. For example, when I had please discussing various bochurim with their rebbes, they would say “he is learning”. What? How? “like everyone else. great”…

Maybe, things will look better if we honestly requalify expense from “learning” to saving lives of people who will drown in modern society without being locked in yeshivos. Then, this expense becomes more justified. And then we sould remember that the best tzedokah is helping people to leave the tzedokah rolls – help them acquire work skills and social skills to live in the world without going OTD.

Chaim, I think you are doing the right thing, you are just complaining about it.
“choosing” not to work and rely on others paying for you is not an erliche option.
If you think working in business is better … Not exact match, but there was shochet who told R Salanter that he doesn’t want to be responsible for aveiros in shechita, so he is going into business! R Salanter was horrified that he is not afraid of aveiros in business .. accounting is not shechita, but the business alternative is still the same. Not randomly, you bring the “nursing home” example – a business rife with people being in trouble with medicaid, hiring illegals, profits balancing how much you spend on feeding elderly … I would rather be an accountant for Enron that face this yetzer hara.
So, just stop thinking that the grass is greener somewhere else, you are doing well.

I would look at adjustments – 401k, vacations, camps – really, train your kids and learn yourself to enjoy interacting with them. If the choice is not being to pay for school, camp should go first (my school has question “which camp you go to” in there where they are trying to figure out how rich you are).

If kids are too young for kiruv camps, they can help out in a local summer day camp with little kids. Mine started doing it, I think, when they were 12.
Maybe assist at a local chabad house, if you have one or maybe your place is too frum.

In terms of school costs, I am big proponent of doing general subjects in online schools from about 7-8th grades – you can then have all kids together in Jewish classes, and everyone can go there own way in general studies – some might want Yinglish only, some might want AP and SAT. And this cuts cost at school. If you are really pressed – experiment with 1-2 (better 2 close in age) kids in fully online Jewish schools for a year.

You know, medical pain is an indicator that something is wrong with the body … the pain itself is not the important thing but it point to where the problem is. This statement that camp is a necessity may be such a sign – are your kids capable of doing something positive when they are not watched by a teacher? Do they take a sefer during the vacation? Do they have friends with whom they can spend quality time? Hobbies? Would they mind preparing for SAT or play basketball or piano? If there are many “no” answers here, then see how to change that and help them grow into healthy adults.

misnagid, not arguing with you, but you need to look at the sources: many early opinions about various electric devices were just that … uninformed opinions. And then some are still propagated from the previous ones. So, you need to look at the issue and possibly by a rav who either knows the swcience or is known to consult those who know the science. R Auerbach, for example.

Chaim, here you go.

Either a parent could work in a camp, if he is underemployed, or better kids could work or volunteer in a regular or kiruv camp, or just spend the summer leisurely between a library and visiting grandparents. Seminary? Some of our daughters hold a grudge that they were not sent there – but they can’t point to anything their peers who went there acquired in ruchniyus that they don’t. Most kids can get a substantial number of clothes from older sisters if ou teach them how to take care of clothes. As our baby says : this is dress is “new to me”.

BTW, for a wedding, you can borrow from your 401k 50K after you got your match, or I heard you can even borrow against the 401k as an asset.

Anyway, given that you are listing camps and such as your spending problems, you are really not stressed at all.

And let’s not forget what the subject was – you are saying that because of some optional spending, you recommend changing ehrliche nice life as a professional, who has time to learn and have time with his family and turn into business where you are risking both money and olam haboh if you succumb to yetzer hora? I mean if you wan to risk it, at least have a high-tech startup with some possible upside.

Chaim,
I’ve been to lakewood and know people there, maybe not to degree you are. And I even know people who respond “I am not from Lakewood, I am from TOMS RIVER”.

As I said, I agree with you that doing parnosa in Jewish community is often better than in a general one. Although, not always – if you are an only smart Yid in an Alabama village, you can have great business going. But, comparing apples-to-apples. You compare with big corporate world. You can also work for a smaller well-run company or have your own high-tech business (like I do). The focus is on difference in professional level:

compare being a corporate accountant v. being a salesman in a corporation
and compare running your own accounting shop with running your own candy store

and as you are saying – some trends hit low-educated (or generally, business) harder. I have a lakewood friend who was verry successful in RE untill it all got destroyed. But we are both just repeating gemora in kiddushin about trade v business. Old news.

So, family of 6 in NJm with $200K in W2, and $1mln home gets $2K/month after mortgage/transportation/utilities/food/etc, thanks chatgpt. That is enough to have 2-3 kids in private school or all 4 with some squeeze. Maybe suspend 401k or have wife or kids work a little and you are all set.

DaMoshe, what was wrong with Uganda plan, especially for those non-zionist shevuos guys? Would it have been wrong to evacuate Jews from the upcoming murder by Nazis and Commies in Europe?

I think some posters, whether Iranian or otherwise, were so frustrated that their posts were moderated out that they decided to take over the moderation.
BUT as Aristotle and Rambam taught us: “everything is better in moderation”.

Happy new year to our Iranian readers and wishing you more freedom in Nissan.

ujm > Herzl and Zionism were just as okay to have Uganda

just can’t make you happy. When Zs push for everyone to go to EY – shvuos, idol worship .. when Herzl suggested Uganda – you are not happy again. And his idea was rejected. I think this only proves that he tried his best to save Jews, despite his limited knowledge. And, again, explain to me why so many learned people did not see the dangers that he saw, and acted upon.

Flatbush, these are good ideas about takonos – what did your rav say about it?

But there is another way out of this vicious circle – become self-sufficient financially by working. Not only, this increases ability to pay, but also, ironically, decreases a desire for crazy spending. Let me explain: if the person depends on community support – reduced tuition, school principal paying your salary, etc, then there is an obvious desire to show oneself a loyal member of the community. This has good sides, keeping people conforming to religious norms, but it also generates the impulse to show off your dedication, including by creating such simchos. After all, if you don’t do that and don’t invite hoshuve people, then you will not be invited …

my kids brought the idea from school that they need to have special sholoch monos for their school teachers, including a good bottle of wine. Not because they love every teacher, but because “everyone shows kavod”. I suggested that they send to their friends and those kids that may not have many friends. We compromised on the teachers they like and even .. took several of their friends to … math teacher that nobody was planning to visit.

rescue, I gave you a reference to one paper, and now we are discussing whether papers are worth reading in general. Maybe give us feedback on this or related papers, and then we will learn more about this interesting subject.

n0> This rational was used for Jews in America to work on Shabbos until 95 years ago.

I heard the following story from Canada. The person who told the story said that he saw a person who was always coming to shul on shabbos, sat in his coat in the back of the room, did not talk to anyone, and left at the end of davening. His story: he lost his job during great depression and only found one that required working on shabbos and he had a family to support. He minimized what he could: walked to the job pretty far away, at the end stayed until shkiya to return, etc. After he eventually found another job, he came back to shul, but put cherem on himself for being mechalel shabbos and sat in that corner for a couple of decades already, despite pleading from the kahal and the rav.

AviraDeArah> Rav moshe allowed a hearing aid to be worn on shabbos because it isn’t noticeably zilzul shabbos, which he held was a problem. He held that the other issurim involved weren’t clear, and that while they’re enough to asser in general, for a choleh we can be lenient.

From R Lichtestein’s hesped for R Auerbach, this seems to be more about kavod than just shabbos halochos:
Once I asked him about hearing aids on Shabbat. He permitted them. But he told me:
“Someone wrote to me from America saying that Rabbi Aharon Kotler was careful not to speak to someone wearing a hearing aid on Shabbat, lest he activate the device.”
Rabbi Shlomo Zalman said he could not believe such a thing. “Imagine — it is not enough that Heaven punished him with deafness… the Gemara says if
someone makes another person deaf he must pay the value of the entire person — as if he were dead. And that is not enough punishment?”
“And now when you meet him on the street, instead of saying hello, you speak like this… m…m…m…?”
To him the idea was absurd from the outset.
Some people almost seem to enjoy suffering on Shabbat. He saw this not merely as misplaced stringency but as a harm to Shabbat and to the human being. Life on Shabbat should not be misery compared to weekday life.

chaim> Rabbi Shlomo Zalman Auerbach: “In the time of Rabbi Kook, the majority of Torah giants were ‘all as if nothing’ compared to him.

Here is second-hand info, but still interesting and going beyond nice statements that can be made just out of politeness or political necessity:
from R Lichtenstein’s hesped for R Auerbach:
Someone once told me that Rabbi Shlomo Zalman served as honorary president of the Jerusalem Institute. They once wanted to add a certain distinguished figure to the board, but he vetoed it. Why? Because he heard that this person referred to Rabbi Kook simply as “Kook,” without honor. A person who spoke like that could not serve. He would not yield until the rumor was proven false.

See gemorah drash about what word “es” means, and that “yire as haElokim” es possibly can not mean “something else”, but Rabbi Akiva says – it can mean that also “talmidei chachamim”. from this. yireh means something that when applied to Hashem can not be comparable to most other situationms. That, it i surely not general “fear” – it is either extreme fear or awe …

PS Presenting one witness is a chapter in hilchos loshon horo. If you don’t have two witnesses – do not present info, go home.

Rocky> I don’t really understand what a discussion on College has to Bnos Penina

retracing the steps:
my conjecture was that the root problem is parents’ inability to pay for school because the community is lacking good jobs; and a college is a way for having good erliche jobs for a wide swath of population. The other opinion is that people get by pretty well without college and .. hm. then I don’t know why they still can’t pay tuition … So, I am also lost by the claim that is not supported by facts!

rescue > Look around you? Do the liberals look like they have a high IQ no they don’t.

Not everyone with college degree is liberal, or have high IQ… It is hard for me to judge, indeed – I do not know many people with bachelor degrees, so what I observe personally may not generalize to overall population – that is why I am reading studies.

In my observation, highly educated people have a large subset of very smart people. It is true many exhibit signs of “schooling” – they are way more reasonable when they talk about their profession but less in others. Still, many who are teaching or doing research full-time can have interesting Torah discussions, comparable to Talmidei Chachomim, but much smaller number of non-college educated non-T Ch can do the same,

yankel> , rescue is influenced by his surroundings to arbitrarily proclaim his own ‘common sense’

R Daniel Feldman mentions “bias bias” – everyone is aware that people have biases. Therefore, when evaluate someone’s position, you correct it for their bias. Now, when you are evaluating your own position, you should also correct for bias – but you usually don’t.

Why? Because you experience your own thought process differently from others. With others, you only see the final output – writing, speech, maybe sometimes you hear them talking out load. You then reconstruct their thinking process and correct for biases. With your own thinking, you have access to all details of your thinking. So, you “clearly see” that everything you think is logical and unbiased. No need to go through evaluation!

Maybe a good example is voice. Do you know that you are thinking that your pitch is higher than what you think it is? You get sound from other people through air – while you hear your own sound through your head, which makes those waves lower frequency. Try recording yourself and listening.

rescue > College isn’t knowledge it’s propaganda

we are talking generalities here. Fill me in some details – how much propaganda is there in the 2nd year of calculus or organic chemistry?

in most technical undergrad programs, they mark up the propaganda – you need to take 2 classes in “cultural awareness” and 3 in “global culture” or something like that. Well-taught kids know what it is – and current administration works on having less of that. It is a waste of time & money, but it is what it is. You can try taking them in a cheap online college or even pull in some Jewish classes to qualify as “diversity”.

phil> it is an all-out war over “maybe and probably ” that is what I am against.

current technology is such that waiting for someone to obtain dangerous technology and to get a 100% proof of that may be too late.

it is enough if someone shows bad intent to act.

See example of Avraham – when Avimelech starts conversation with “who is this woman”, Avraham immediately activates his defensive psyops. He did not wait until Avimelech kills him and takes his wife.

Rambam puts out criteria for a Navi that includes everything positive being fulfilled up to a minute detail. So, if someone claimed to have access to Hashem’s proprietary information and then failed, he has bigger problems with beis din than monetary payments.