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While not being a bokeh in accounting, I agree with Chaim that having an independent profession is valuable, and especially in our time. And so says Gemora requiring teaching umanut. Now, after having a profession, you can always try your hand in business, whether related to your profession or not, but you can always fall down back onto your profession. This will prevent anxiety for your family and yetzer hara to do business in a dishonest way.
on the substance of your argument: > trying to force them out of the Bais Medrash and into a secularizing immoral army
This was discussed already – if younwant to protect learners, you should double down on
(1) sending those in the community who are not in yeshiva to the Army
(2) introducing a transparent verification system about who is actually learning
(3) working with other religious Jews on strengthening religious units in the Armyyou can easily learn this from mussar that tells you to verify that your positions are not caused by your interests. One example, Alter from Slobodka decided not to visit certain dignitary visiting town. To make sure, he is doing it for the right reasons and not out of convenience, he walked to the hotel, stopped there, reviewed his decision, and walked back home. If Alter was not sure about his own motivations, others could try that also.
I know of your no true scotsman gedolim. I am not arguing about their positions, HV. I am just pointing out what the day of tefilah is about, as the post & article were not clear. I thought I am doing a service for the organizers. I don’t think you would want people disagreeing with you joining in this tehilim event. After all, Hashem may decide to listen to their voice rather than yours and this will mess up the whole event.
To support DaMoshe more generally, I heard in the name of R Zelig Epstein – he was asked how Mir Yeshiva was able to leave Vilno despite daas Torah – R Ozer’s psak to the contrary. His response – that was not an issue as it was before daas Torah (implicit as you write – for Litvakim ).
DaMoshe, > old mashgiach, Reb Nosson Wachtfogel, wouldn’t dare wear a black hat
Online pictures show R Wachtfogel in a hat, so he at least owned one for occasions … As to ordinary life, I am trying to recall, I had once an opportunity to go for a walk with him and his grandson. His grandson def was in a hat, but I can’t recall what R Wachtfogel was wearing, as I was listening rather than watching …
PS As we are told to go to shoftim of our times and not to previous times, similarly, “modern” is relative to the science of the time, not of future times.
akuperma > No one was “modern” before “modern” times, almost by definition
This is a superficial view. I think many were modern and many were not. Rabban Gamliel owned some astronomical instruments and had 1000 students trained in modern studies while other 1000 in Torah studies. Rambam was knowledgeable in philosophy and astronomy of his time (maybe coincidental with a brief stay in Fes where the Fes medrasa is considerd by some a first modern university). Others did not like that and banned Rambam. In our days, there are “chareidi” Rabbis who may not have great science education but are happy to discuss implications of modern science and social sciences, ask probing questions, and consider what it means for halakha and Jewish life. As modern science is “closed”, i.e. expert in one area is not an expert in another, such Rabbis are not different from physicists who do not know computer science.
you can start with this equation:
Bina = Chabad – Chochma – Daas.I can’t recall any members of Biden administration with any significant positions. I think there are 2 that rhyme ending with en, but they look the same, hard to tell which one is jewish. Obama had maybe a couple. Most Republicans had lots of colorful figures, including Trump the first. Trump II looks to be interesting
Many girls should not be marrying that early, they can use this time to acquire a profession or do some chesed… but some say that seminary is the most important item on the shidduch resume: some think that lack of it means lack of observance, others simply use type of the seminary to understand the derech and wouldn’t look further without this indicator.
You had to reveal this?@ now some people when they hear someone having a smicha from r Moshe would ask – what year?
She doesn’t need to logout and keep us worrying about her and her family. I’d rather hear what her rebbe and council have to say. Maybe she can help others with this information.
Someone just became a bokeh in Maharal, r Hirsh, r Soloveitchik and r Kook. Nes gadol.
as you perfectly know, there are Talmidei Chachamim with different opinions on the subject. So, you either happened to be born in a shul with a certain opinion or you chose to follow a certain gadol.
I have no problem with different shitos, and I was just highlighting that the kol koreh was not described clearly in the article, when saying ” have issued a call for Klal Yisroel in the Diaspora to unite with our brethren in Eretz Yisroel” . Some people may think that this is in support of whole brethren in EY, while in fact it is in support of brethren who refuse to go to Tzahal. So, I just wanted to make sure readers understand the context and join or not accordingly.
I don’t think you would like people to join a kol koreh without understand what it stands for, do you?
Teaching Torah without pay seems to be the best way of teaching. As you already show great level of bitachon, being in kollel and such – why do you find this a problem. And I do not understand why you got offended by the student who offered you shekalim. You could have simply showed him to the pushka or suggest to give it someone who needs it, giving him one more lesson in Torah-appropriate behavior.
eshis, you seem to be coming with the same question annually. It strongly suggest that your methods, following your mother’s methods, may be bordering on abuse. Please find the nicest Rabbi in your community and consult him. I do not understand why you didn’t seek advice earlier.
Obviously, Jews, like everyone else, lived in close proximity with animals, from dogs to cows to donkeys to goats and chickens … As long as you follow relevant halochos, you can have an animal. So, the only question is whether the current use as a pet justifies the effort as much as owning a donkey to carry things justified it in previous centuries.
> come from an “Orthodox Shul”
Pre WW2, some American Jews considered European Torahs to be inferior quality. Why was that? Because Europeans would sell good Torahs locally and send worse ones to the Americans … Not sure what the status is now, but I would not be surprised that quality (including of checking) would be lower for customers who are not as good in understanding the quality.
fakenews, thanks for the explanation. Still hard to understand why people would want to exclude other Yidden from a minyan.
Maybe, if there are financial implications – say, visitors use too much heat, break furniture, and overuse parking lot.
If they feel it is a “factory”, they can run the davening itself as they see proper – slower davening, extra piyutim.
first, lockdown policies were mostly run by states – as they should be.
2nd – your views on lockdowns and similar measures are purely emotional, as overall deaths in USA, where lockdowns were not severe, were higher than in high-income countries with stricter policies.
3rd – public positions of T and others were in some part political – to account for all the emotional responses we all had.The main role for the feds turned out to be vaccine development and delivery, with T succeeded spectacularly, and then B having mixed record delivering and updating vaccines to new variants. T could not run on this success, of course, because a sizeable portion of his voters are against vaccines …
They are in honor of the Tzahal Beltzer navy seal unit.
Please read carefully and join according to your view – this kol is a mixed message, both asking Hashem to protect Yidden in EY and also asking him to exempt the community from taking part in that defense.
> main thing is that you shouldn’t talk during leining.
Obviously, Wolf is trying to fulfil this by buying his sefer Torah and leining it. Do you think he will be talking between the pesukim?
PS Even AAQ does not talk when called to the Torah, the time I am walking past others to the Torah is usually enough to exchange all the jokes I have for the day.
ok, sounds like all here fulfilled the mitzva of helping goyim to establish justice by voting (and said shehyanu for the first vote), now no need to get yourself into a pretzel trying to guess what T will do. He does not know it, CNN does not know it, and thus Xi and Putin do not know it.
You can daven tefila that Hashem gives wisdom to the rules with extra intensity.yes, unless the bochur is taller. If he is not looking at all, he will end up bumping into the player, showing both disrespect to umos haoilam and endangering his own health. Of course, walking outside during learning hours was his first problem.
Neville, you seem to be separating two trends:
1) chassidim directly changing ashkenazi mesora based on sefardi, etc
ok, so we all agree on these
2) differences between central/southern european minhagim with Litvishe.
maybe. why these became the issue? it is either increased contact (Austro-Hungarian empire?) or, maybe more likely, chassidic influence in previously litvishe areas bringing those minhagim in.to illuminate the discussion above:
Rabbi Avi Shafran wrote an article in Jewish Observer about Mendelssohn where he says, exactly as above,> fact that many [frum] people have a visceral, automatic reaction to the name Mendelssohn – for whatever reason.
In 2010 interview, he describes negative reaction from multiple members of Moetses, such as
> In the Novominsker’s response, he wrote that the thing that the article may have accidentally obfuscated was that Mendelssohn’s philosophy is a synthesis, and a synthesis is bad. We can’t have a synthesis, it’s evil, it’s a total perversion of Torah… .. of Torah and secular studies. He then notes that Rav Hirsch’s philosophy is not a synthesis, and that’s why Rav Hirsch is differentR Shafran then explains, in a view similar to mine, that he is not holding Mendelssohn as a halachik authority, but as a Jew who help certain opinions:
> I think that Mendelssohn definitely embraced secular culture more, but he wasn’t a rabbi. In other words, I wasn’t extolling him as a Torah authority. I don’t think the Novominsker Rebbe was really addressing what I was addressing. I wasn’t putting Mendelssohn up as someone to emulate. I made very clear, he wasn’t a rabbi at all, he was a philosopher. He was, you know, his life was in the salons, not in the Beis Midrash. He made no claim otherwise! I was simply saying that as a Jew, we have a totally warped picture of who he was. He wasn’t a freethinking rejector of halacha, who ate treife meat privately. In Boro Park, if you ask them to act out Mendelssohn’s life in private, you know, they’d say: You take a piece of pork, be mechalel shabbos. He was meticulously observant! But [in my view,] he had some hashkafic fine points that didn’t click.
pure > Hopefully it would be the same reversed, as we are Jews, driven by the Torah Hakdosha, not just empty politics…
You can look at CR posts in 2020 and 2012 and maybe even 1976 and see what was said then.
besalel, good questions on your list are:
> What if your dog scares others? Its a problem in Halocho.
of course, you should not have a dog that scares
> What about castrating the dog? Not really allowed
There are 50% of dogs
> What about tzaar baalei chayim?
hopefully, you train your kids to be nice to the dogs. Hopefully, they’ll transfer this skill to humans
> feed your dog before you eat. For the busy frum yid, its not so pashut.
well, feeding kids for a busy yid is also not pashut.it is a legit question. There is a halakha that a man should not marry during chol hamoed, as not to mix two simchos, but is allowed to re-marry a wife he had previously divorced.
Tosfos explain: only “isha hadasha” is a real simcha …
So, a President re-elect will not have same celebration as the new one …
Also, note that Pres Putin was able to interpret “not more than two presidency” into “no more than two consecutive terms”.
So, why would not T-appointed supreme court interpret constitution the same way and let T run again?> can you imagine some Jewish person thinking an election outcome is something they should consider important?
Can you imagine gemoras discussing how someone became a king or an emperor?
I’d rather be in this thread than in the one about presidential candidates.
my wish list is short:
1) do not do anything crazy
2) reduce the power of the presidency
Not that I do not have any wishes, I am just confident Pres T will pursue them.I think many people here would agree with (1). But let me expound on (2):
All the heat coming from Presidential elections is due to the fact that Presidents became responsible for everything – both things that used to belong to the states as federal government became more powerful; and also for policies that used to be done into laws by Congress that is lately stuck at neutral.This is unhealthy. As I heard from one Rav: it is not healthy to be “a Jew in heart”. You want to distribute your mitzvos to all part of the body – hand tefilin, mouth kosher, etc. Keeping all “in heart” may lead to a heart attack, H’V. Same for Presidency – if we let states collect taxes, do roads, medical insurance and student loans, then the presidential elections will be about wars, tariffs, and supreme courts – and most people do not even care about these things. States and towns will compete with each other on other issues and people who don’t like their local government can just move to another one.
Beautiful.
> Bash? No.
Are we going to have linux flavor wars now!?
Gadol > How many hundreds of years does it take to officially “have a real Mesorah” ?
A good question. 3 generations? We have examples when innovations were introduced openly – writing down Torah she b’alpe, beis knesses after beis hamikdash, and it has to be acknowledged as such.
Reminds of a story of a teenager in Ashdod who left his kibutznik father and stayed in a yeshiva. When the father accused the Rav that he encourages the son not to follow customs of his father, the Rav responded: the son is changing the ways of the father, same way the father changed the way of the grandfather – so he is following his father’s custom.
Gadol > We should greet them with open arms and encourage them to return.
Indeed, and tzadikim do that. I once stayed for shabbos with a talmid of Bobover Rebbe on the way to a math conference. Bobover Rebbe was met by a line of chassidim in shtreimels, but he quickly made a detour to shake my hand despite, or because of, my modernishe garb.
> Lakewood yeshiva is modeled after yeshivos from 200 years ago.
You are falling for a marketing plot. Just because they are also called “yeshivos”, does not mean that hashkofos are the same, forget about the hats. I posted how students in Mir looked above.
> Artscroll is by frum yidden, not by the founder of Reform Judaism.
This seems to be a uniquely American slant on Mendehlson, both by O- and R-. He was not Reform, and I don’t think even his children and students were – they simply baptized, like multitudes of others who were not his students. He happened to live at the time when modernity was a new subject and he looked for a response. Others disagreed. Looking back – were his opponents right? I am not sure. We can, as well, “blame” mass conversions and apikorusus of that generation on the Rabbis of that generation who were not able to properly engage with the times. See threat on Chassidus as one possible response. I put blame in quotes, because those were extra-ordinary times and we are still looking for right responses.
Neville > What I don’t understand is the outright opposition to doing our own thing–the insistence that we MUST base ourselves off the goyim in some capacity. Where does that come from?
that’s a good question and an answer may depend on circumstances. When we are under pressure, we surely to resist in all matters. Dressing in togas while Roman army is occupying EY was probably frowned upon. When we are in a benevolent society, as multiple teshuvot talk in regards to voting, we are still concerned about assimilation, but we also have more opportunities to engage constructively with the world. As R Soloveichik is writing: if we hold that we are representatives of Hashem’s truth in the World – should we hiding in caves from the world, or should we try to engage with it. My clarification: when you learn about Tannaim interacting with Romans, you are not emulating them – they dealt with current (for them) events, and we learn it as history. We emulate them when we deal with current events.
Neville > You didn’t have to go to the top 1% back 100 years ago–or even 50 years ago–to find respectably dressed goyim.
Well, sort of. This is along the lines of R Avigdor Miller that old books had more morals. I am not sure this applies to lower classes. Many were totally ignorant and drunk, depends on the country somewhat. They may have had bulkier dresses but they also had houses to raise children of unmarried low classes. Not sure whether this matters, we agree that the standard needs to be higher than “average”, proper to someone meeting a King. Surely, a peasant is not at that level in the old society, whether he wore a hat and socks or not.
as I mentioned, this is because of a biased correction. If they would have simply missed some groups, then all polls would be off by 2% but there would be variation between polls and for same poll over time. As some analysts noticed, the polls stayed suspiciously synchronized and stable over time.
What can we learn from this? Sometimes, we can apply good thinking but be burdened by unjustified assumptions that bias us towards certain opinion that we hold historically, or because we were raised in a certain hashkofa, or because it is comfortable … We need to always analyze our intellectual biases. It is often hard to do on your own. A lot of analysis in Bavli is about that type of discussion. And, hopefully, discussions here, when done in a right way, help us to see issues from different perspectives.
Students from the Mir Yeshiva, 1938
ttps://encyclopedia.yivo.org/media/963Iraqi Jews early 20th century
https://breakingmatzo.com/wp-content/uploads/Iraqi_Jews.jpgThere might be over-estimation of Ds, BUT the data is corrected after that – and this year they are correcting using more factors than before. This is in theory more accurate, but can introduce a bias as the correction is based on some assumptions about voting population. Ok, you might reasonably assume that ratio of D and R voters will be same as last time (will it?), but when you also include age, area, income, etc – your assumptions essentially guide your polling correction.
It is not just mobile phones, response rates are now very low. One way to deal with it is to re-weight results using demographics to account for non-random responses. Previous weighting by a small number of factors – party, age, gender, education, etc – was proven not to be sufficient when alliances change, like with Trump. So, this year pollsters seem to be using more weighting. As some researchers point out that because of this increased weighting current polling is abnormally stable over time and, at some point, reflects your weighting assumptions instead of actual voter preferences. So, at this point, there are 2 possible outcomes: or vote will be indeed very close and take long time to sort out, or one of the candidates is way ahead and polls systematically made the same error. In the latter case, it is more likely that T was “misunderestimated” but there is no guarantee that there was not a over-compensation the other way. Note that campaigns have way more internal data and you can try getting clues by where the candidates are campaigning at the end – defending their own or attacking in new areas.
Neville> I’ve not seen convincing evidence that this means we model ourselves after the goyim,
We have photos of both sephardim and ashkenazim from 100+ years ago. Most of them dress like locals. I don’t know what the “modern” position is, but my personal is that we need to use not “average” goyishe dress, but top 1 to 10% – those who are eligible to see the King. Obviously, Polish peasants did not wear charedi dress, poritzim did. Of course, there were Jews who dressed like peasants, but it is not the standard for us.
> great Papa Bar Abba once remarked in one of these CR discussions, all of religion is one big “no true Scotsman” shmooze
Who am I to argue with the rishonim … I am not even an aharon … We just to define who the SCotsman are. I am defining them as Talmidei Chachamim who have a grasp of Torah, you seem to define them as those who follow exactly same derech. As, say, R Moshe, R Soloveichik, Lubaviche Rebbe were respectful of each other, I would include all of them – and those how any of them respected – into the circle.
>> “as we developed more sophisticated ways to deal with modernity.”
> Which is what? Surrendering to secularism and liberal academia?I think every reasonable response that we have now is more effective than what was there 200 years ago – whether it is lakewood yeshiva, bays yaakov, or chabad houses, or Ohr Sameach, or modern day schools. Note that there is no tension right now between science and Torah as ideology. In certain times, there was. Many rabonim objected to Mendelhson translation as it led to Jews learning hochdeutsche and that to mixed dancing. Anyone is objecting to Artscroll nowadays? I personally try teaching children that Torah is by Jews but yesh chochma b’goyim, and it is not a problem to learn chochma. And then train them to separate chochma from liberal and secular stuff by discussing every issue and defining what the Torah outlook on that issue is.
xCTL > Fafsa is only open to US Citizens
I don’t think so, green card and refugees, for sure, and asylum seekers with valid docs also.
Neville > , but this traditionally was not true.
college prices go up way higher than inflation, and private higher than public, so do the math (if you took it).
My experience is with ASU and U of FL, their prices are lower than comparable private in midwest and northeast. It may be different in other places.
Also, online now is highly competitive – as the competitor is just a click away.keith > where they are beginning to accept aboriginal mythology as equivalent to science!
even if this is true, you don’t HAVE TO (so far) to tka it, you can take normal science. As xCTL says, educated parents can help student take reasonable classes at reasonable prices.
> how could any of minhag lita that is based on the Gra exist before the Gra?
How is debatable that Chassidim changed minhagim – whether in Lita or other places also? I don’t think any chassidim disagree with. Community separation went beyond davening – separate kehillot and shehita, leading to decrease in community income from taxes on meat and candles, etc.
I am not learned enough to evaluate how Gra’s changes relate to Chassidut. I’ve read that some of the R Chaim Volozhiner work is a response to chassidut, and I think mussar might be influenced also, but do not about the Gra.
