Will the fact that NY will have more casinos really affect things in a big way?

You have never met a compulsive gambler. Nor have you watched the complete destruction that is inflicted on the gambler, his/her immediate family, the extended families, and countless others. You certainly have not witnessed the futile efforts to bail out the gambler from crushing debt. And you are clearly unfamiliar with the ease of developing a gambling problem, far more insidious than other addictions.

P.S. Gambling addiction is rampant among Jews. The membership of GA (Gamblers Anonymous) has an extremely high percentage of Jews.

Zdad,

What a silly comment.

Racinos or lotto are nothing like full fledged casinos. There is a reason why Las Vegas is one of the busiest tourist destinations. Developers and NYS are going to invest Billions of dollars for something that is not going to bring in new money.

As far as convenience, how can you compare something being 15 minutes away to the casinos in Atlantic City or Connecticut?

What a silly comment.

I cannot say I have been to all those establishments of ill repute as you have, because I have not. But I doubt the accuracy of your comments.

Ive been in Vegas, Atlantic City and Empire Casino (Yonkers)

Why shlep when you could just go to the corner store for a lottery ticket?

ZD, if casinos are more interesting, they’re more tempting, and if they’re more readily available, we’ll see, r”l, more ruined families.

Did you catch one teenager’s post about her father’s gambling issue and how horrible the consequences? heartbreaking.

I was opposed to the proposal for this reason.

Zdad,

What a ridiculous comparison.

This is not about a “ban” (I know you love that word)on casinos. They were illegal thus far. It is legalizing something that was not legal to date, even though it is known to have deleterious effects on individuals and communities. It would be comparable to legalizing cocaine or heroin.

This difference is not even in the least bit subtle. You should be able to comprehend it.

And FYI, there is nothing wrong with getting drunk on Purim, it is in fact a halacha to do so.

But I suppose you believe you know better than the shulchan oruch.

Zdad:

You wrote, “How many lives are ruined from Alcohol?

We all know about Kiddish Clubs, Drunkenness on Simchat Torah and Purim

Should we ban Alcohol too? “

Big difference, and it is one that matters. Alcohol can be used appropriately, and can be part of simchos and mitzvos. When used properly, there are no incursions into areas of issurim. We need to e careful to set up the proper and healthy undaries and gedorim to insure that alcohol remains a brocho, not the opposite ch”v. That fact does not exist with gambling. It is assur anyway whch you may study by examining the sugya of mesachek bekuvya in Sanhedrin, which you should review with the meforshim and poskim. Yes, casual gambling is also assur. Yes, the establishments that offer mini-casinos within the frum community during Chanukah are committing a grave issur, being machshil every one of their customers (besides being evil in their pursuit of everyone else’s money).

Just for your information, the Chinese auctions that are held as fund raisers for various tzedoko are actually relying on a flimsy technicality of halacha. These organizations know quite well that they can procure more of your money by making an auction, than they could by ordinary soliciting.

Those with propensities to gambling should not even buy the $1 ruboffs from the kids raising tzedokoh for their yeshivos. Donate – yes. Gamble – no.

ZD, no, they should not ban alcohol, but no competent rov should allow a kiddush club in his shul.

Ive seen people drunk on Simchat Torah and Purim and Im sure if the Shulchan Aruch saw these people behaving this way it would have felt differently and these were Yeshiva boys whom I expected better.

It turned out had the amendment failed, Gambling would have spread anyway,but instead of casinos there would have been alot more VLT’s (Video Lottery Terminals) and Racinos downstate

anyhing can become addictive. a compulsive shopper can put his/her family into debt as well.

by the way, theres a beautiful hotel/casino in Bethleham , PA called The Sands. For those who dont like gambling , there is also an outlet shopping mall attached to the hotel.

Hey thanks! Yes, I am new. I appreciate the kind words.

I have been to Las Vegas twice & I voted against the Casinos. This is because although gambling is an aveira the pritzusdika woman who work @ the casino is the bigger problem. Is this what we want our community & children to be exposed to?

I strongly believe that allowing casinos will have a bigger impact on the Jewish community than allowing gay marriage.

ZD, no, but it will add casinos in Sullivan County.

Zdad,

I fail to see what point you are making?

Gambling is a problem. So it was available in some form till now, this is any way going to greatly increase the presence. And it will be very close to where frum Jews live in the summer.

It will absolutely impact the hundreds of thousands of people who vacation in and about Sullivan county.

So, what is your point??

ZD, thousands of Yidden spend their summers in Sullivan County, and casinos there will tempt some of them.

The Little I Know said that casinos steal from their patrons, and rather than provide a legitimate product or service only offer the fantasy of winning.

I think that casinos are bad for people and for society, but the fact is that casinos are great at entertaining people, and entertainment is a legitimate service that some people work hard to provide and others willingly pay for. Casinos are in show business – everything about a casino is designed to help people have fun (while they gamble their life savings away).

Would you say that Broadway cheats people because they have nothing more when they leave than when they arrive? Broadway provides excellent entertainment. The difference is that people know what they’re paying for Broadway up front whereas casinos use various methods – many of them deceptive – to extract money from people.

Some people go to casinos with $100 worth of quarters (and that’s it) and have a good time with their friends. They don’t expect to win, they expect to lose the $100 but have a great time. To me that’s the way to enjoy a casino.

However most people don’t do that. They get sucked in by the lights, sounds, free drinks and the atmosphere. They forget that chips are actual money and get careless. They lose track of time because there are no clocks or windows. And before you know it they’re deep in debt. That’s the part I have a problem with.

With Casino gambling legal almost everywhere Las Vegas had to re-invent itself and now over 50% of its revenues are from non-casino sources.

Atlantic City is also trying to reinvent itself the same. You actually need more activies than gambling to be successful.

The fact of the matter is Sullivan County is an economically depressed area and they need tax revenues and jobs there. At one time when the Borscht Belt was huge people would go, now only Charedi jews go there and then only for 2 months.

All the anti-casino arguments would hold true if it wasnt generally legal. But its legal most places now, might as well keep the jobs and tax revenue here

And BTW quite a few jews have made huge fortunes from Casinos Dr Irwin Moskowitz and Sheldon Adelson both of whom I think give alot of Tzedkah

People here don’t seem to care that Sullivan county has all year round Yidden living there as well. There’s the Yeshiva in South Fallsburg and a Small Viznitz shtetl — in Kiamesha lake close to Monticello — and more Yidden scattered elsewhere.

Additionally, many see viable potential for the Catskills to solve the Heimishe affordable housing crisis. To only worry about the summer crowd despite the huge number of vacationers is being unfair and shortsighted.

Nishtdayngesheft, that was visious and uncalled for. There’s no reason you can’t debate ZD in a civil manner.

Historically, the hospitality industry has been the mainstay of Sullivan County. There is no manufacturing to speak of nor is the much in the way of agriculture. Since the demise of the Borscht Belt, Sullivan county has been an economically depressed area. Casino gambling is simply a modern iteration of Sullivan County’s traditional industry. So the answer to the OP is yes, it will change things sort of back to the way they were.

Is it good for Yidden? Well, if you own property in Sullivan County you’re going to do well. If you’re a compulsive gambler, it may be a little easier to lose your shirt although, remembering the six hour odyssey to get to Grossinger’s back in the day, that might not be so.

Just a note. If any of you do plan on sampling the delights of the new casinos, please don’t go in levush. It’s embarrassing to to see all those bekeshes on the casino floor.

Apushitayid, I’ve posted on other threads about this and it rankles me every time I read a post like yours. You simply have no knowledge of history nor any idea of what secular America is like. All you know is the opinion of Rebbes and Mechanchim who are as cloistered as you are. I take personal offense when folks like you, who really don’t know what they’re talking about, run down my country. Is casino gambling good? for most it’s harmless fun, for some it can be a trap and a nightmare. In the grand scheme of things, America is the greatest country on the face of the earth and it’s place in the golus is unique. To say that, since the churban, Jews never had it so good is an understatement. Not only are we Yidden blessed to live here, the rest of America, the “Goyim” who you despise and denigrate, is hard working, respectful, broad minded, fair and upright. Your characterization of America as “the most hedonistic society in the history of mankind” is so obviously silly that I won’t waste time and effort refuting it.