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Why did Hashem create Chava? What is her purpose? And why was she created from Adam’s rib or side? (All joking aside, please.)
And what does it teach us as far as applying this in our lives today?
The GEMARA says:
On TU BA’AV
(coming up shortly)
ALL THE SINGLE LADIES
dance in the field
the BEAUTIFUL ones say
“women were created for beauty”
the ones with DAT YICHUS say
“women were made to
have (choshuv) children”
the ugly ones would say
“marry me despite my dress size,
but still gives me DEM NICE CLOTHES”
The parallel for today?
UNFORTUNATELY
no more dancing : (
(“WE’RE NOT ON THE MEDREIGA!!”)
but they’re still using
the same lines…
Unfortunately for the Yetzer Hara is what you mean, right?
Englishman – Hashem created Chava because Adam asked Him to!!
And why from the rib – I remember hearing a very good explanation to that once but I dont really remember it…
And it teaches us…
Be careful what you wish for 🙂
Bochur sog – Lo tov he’yis ha’adam le’vado – it’s not good, but it’s not bad
To serve man.
There are a few ????s about the purpose of women. Definitely not for power [see ???? ????? about why women are not for power and lessons from ????? and ?????]. One ???? says ??? ??? ??? ????? – for ornamental purposes. Another ???? says ??? ??? ??? ????? – to have kids. There is also a gemoro quoted a lot in the ??????? – i think the ???? is ??? ??? ??? ?????? – it means a woman is for her sewing. In short: In order so that the man can live an easy life!!!
Englishman: The Gemara in Brachos (I believe) gives several opinions. One is that they were like twins conjoined at the back. Another is that Adam had a tail which became Chava. I don’t remember if there were any others.
Kozov: Really? You have the arrogance to think that what we do is on a higher level than what was an accepted and joyous practice during the time of the Tannaim (and maybe even before)? No, it’s unfortunately for us that we cannot control our Yetzer Harah to that extent.
i think i heard in the name of rabbi miller that women were created to look nice and be quiet
Yekke: That Gemara is in Yoma 67b, I believe, and is quite taken out of context by many.
??? ??? ??? ???? because ??? ??? ??? ?????.
?? ??? ??? ???? ?? ???, ??? ??? ?????? ??? ?????.
Ksuvos 9b: ??? ?’ ???? ??? ??? ??? ????? ??? ??? ??? ????? ???? ?’ ???? ??? ??? ??? ??????? ???
R’ Chiya taught: “A woman exists only for beauty, a woman exists only for sons/children” and R’ Chiya taught: “A woman exists only for jewelery”.
Tanah Dvei Eliyau Rabbah 9: ??? ?? ??? ???? ????? ??? ??? ???? ???? ???? ????
“There is no kosher woman except one who does the will of her husband”.
Gemara – Shabbos 152a: ??? ??? ??? ???? ???? ??? ?? ???? ???? ?????
“A woman is an urn filled with excrement, and her “mouth” filed with blood, and everyone runs after her”.
Gemara – Bava Metzia 59a: ??? ?? ?? ????? ???? ???? ???? ??????
“Any (man) who follows his wife’s advice falls into Gehinnom”.
Brony,
I know that i am off topic, however can you post with out the spaces between each line? I get dizzy trying to read what you write!
pcoz: LOL
ohr chodesh: You mean like the Damon Knight story?
TO BRING SHLEIMUS TO THE WORLD!!
Look at the book The Merit of the Righteous Woman by the Biale Rebbe. You can read much of it for free on books dot google dot com, if you just search for the name of the book. It looks really fascinating.
Every person, male or female, was created to serve Hashem in his or her own particular way, through prayer, Torah study, mitzvos and other ma’asim tovim, and thereby achieve their particular soul correction (tikkun). Women, who are less violent and arrogant and more nurturing and compassionate than men, are created closer to Hashem’s ideal, so they don’t need the time-bound mitzvos and public davening to purify their souls and middos and keep them from sin. Women receive merit from the Torah and mitzvos of their husbands and children, but also from their own. Through childrearing, hospitality and chessed activities women often have more opportunities than men for gemilus chasadism, which is one of the foundations of the world (not to mention one of the mitzvos that has no measure, and which has rewards in this world but the principal reward in the world to come.)
Rav Shalom Arush, in his bestseller Garden of Peace, teaches that men cannot achieve their soul correction in this world without being married, because it is only through the process of achieving true and complete shalom bayis that his middos can be refined and his emunah/bitachon perfected. So that is one reason women were created — men cannot achieve their spiritual purpose without making them happy. 🙂
According to Chazal, the original human was both male and female.
Vayikra Rabba 14:1 et al:
??? ?’ ????? ?? ????: ???? ???? ????? ???? ??? ??? ?????? ?????????? ????. ??? ??? ????: ???? ????? ?? ??????? ???? ????? ????? ???? ???? ?? ???? ?? ?????. ??????? ???: ???? ??? ????????! ??? ???: ???????, ??????: ????? ?????.
R. Shmuel bar Nachman said: When God created Adam, he created him androgynous. Reish Lakish elaborated: At the time [Adam] was created, two faces were created. Then they were split and two backs were made; a back for the male and a back for the female.
He answered: [Therefore what the Midrash said stands, because she was originally one side of the entire human; Hashem simply cut her side off and made them two separate persons.]
Accordingly, answers like ‘to help man’ only explain why the woman was split from the man (and that is where the Torah says it). They do not explain the purpose of her essence, which was created together with the man’s.
to make sandwiches
Every creature was endowed with whatever it needs to fulfill its purpose. So if woman’s purpose is to be an ornament, to have children, and to sew, why was she endowed (“Vayiven ess hatzelah”), from the moment of her creation, with bina yiseirah?
Chava was made (at Adam Harishon’s request for a mate like all the other creatures had)from his rib, because it was under and close to his heart, and so that she would always be by his side and his eizer k’negdo.
Awake My Glory (by Rav A. Miller):
1095. There cannot be two kings. The marriage relationship is twofold. 1) The wife is submissive. This is not only Jewish but natural. There can be no harmony when there are two commanders. Without this indispensable condition, the home is disordered. “Arrogance is unbecoming a woman” – Megillah 14B. For a man it is not an ornament, but for a woman it is as if she wore a mustache. 2) The second, but equally essential foundation: a man must always demonstrate respect for his wife. This is “the way of Jewish men that… honor and support their wives in truth” as stated in the Jewish marriage contract. “He honors her more than his own body” – Yevamos 62B, Bava Metzia 59A. He is the captain, but she is the First Mate whose counsel is respected. She cannot be made a doormat, she need not beg for money, she deserves some assistance in the house chores, and the husband sides with her against his kin. He must express frequent appreciation and give words of encouragement, and he should remember his wife from time to time with gifts, big or little. Husband and wife should always say “Please” and “Thank You” and never forget to be always polite to each other.
1105. Before marriage it is imperative to ascertain the young woman’s attitude toward feminism and “women’s rights” and careerism. It is out of the question to build a Jewish home, or any home whatsoever, if the prospective wife has been tainted with these anti-natural and anti-social preachings. The woman’s career and happiness are in her home: absolutely and entirely. Her husband, her children and her home are the expressions of her personality and her Free Will, and they are her chief forms of serving G-d. The modern orthodox “Rebbetzin” with a college degree and a job in secular professions is a misfit even in a non-Jewish home. The ideas of revolt against a husband’s authority and the unrealistic dream of equal leadership in the family, lead only to unhappiness and failure, and very frequently to divorce. A Beth Jacob girl should be wed soon after or before graduation. Every day after she leaves the Beth Jacob marks another step away from idealism, for the street and the office and the secular school have an unfailing effect which increases from day to day. It is never a simple matter to achieve harmony in the home; effort and wisdom and fear of G-d are required. But with the additional burden of feminism, all problems become aggravated; and like all the unnatural and anti-social affectations of the libertarians this leads only to failure and unhappiness.
Without a woman, a man will never realize his shortcomings in life.
The wife helps the man achieve his mission in life by mirroring his faults on a magnified level (that’s eizer kenegdo, the help is that it’s sometimes against him).
Behind every great man, there is a greater woman!
To complain about men.
You know it is said that until a man is married he is not complete. After marriage, he’s finished!
The Torah says it is because ?? ??? ???? ???? ????. But, it doesn’t say what part of it is ?? ???, and how that is remedied.
Shlshi, did your wife give you permission to write your post?
Sam that’s also true but its not a contradiction to what I said. Did you see the quote “WERE NOT ON THAT MADREIGA!” in the post to which i was responding? But it seemed to me that the writer had in mind what i was addressing.
To make a man feel important.
To keep a man humble.
To serve man? Check out Twilight Zone, “To Serve Man”
To Serve Man
“IT’S A COOKBOOK!!!”
LOL
to be as a “kenegdo” for adam. Men can’t live without women. Hashem created chava as an “aizer” an assisting helper to adam. Men and women have opposite cochos on purpose, its to help eachother.
Brony: Don’t stomp on my punchlines!
pba: All is solved with a well placed comma.
The answer is befeirush in Bereishus.
Why was man created?
There is really only one reason why Hashem created Woman. He looked at Odom and said to himself, “Hmmm…. I really could do better than that!” (Don’t stone me, I was JK)…
To get serious, Man was created so that there would be someone to do Avodas Hashem by CHOICE. The Malachim have no breira.
Because racks and thumbscrews werent invented until thousands of years later, in the midieval, and waterboarding not for hundreds of years more.
“Men can’t live without women”
I can! And I have done so for quite a few years. Doesn’t mean I like it. It all depends on what of kind of Woman!
Rashi explains that the reason it wasn’t good for man to be one being because then it would appear that there were 2 domains with ????? ???? ??? ???? ???????? ???? ?? ???, ??? ???? ???????? ???? ?? ???.
Therefore, Hashem separated man into two being male and female, with the female either aiding or fighting the male, neither of which is sufficient on its own.
“There are a few ????s about the purpose of women. Definitely not for power [see ???? ????? about why women are not for power and lessons from ????? and ?????]. One ???? says ??? ??? ??? ????? – for ornamental purposes. Another ???? says ??? ??? ??? ????? – to have kids. There is also a gemoro quoted a lot in the ??????? – i think the ???? is ??? ??? ??? ?????? – it means a woman is for her sewing. In short: In order so that the man can live an easy life!!!”
Yekke2: Yasher Koach. Do you have the maare mekomos for the Gemorahs that you cited?
I don’t think the sewing is meant literally. I feel like I may have learned what it means once, but I don’t remember anymore.
Actually, it should be obvious that it’s not meant literally.
All these things (like most things Chazal say) are meant on a deeper level.
I don’t think “ornamental purposes” is an accurate translation of “l’yofi”.
“All these things (like most things Chazal say) are meant on a deeper level.”
I should hope so. Taken at face value, why would any woman want to be frum?
Just curious, Joseph – why are you so into these kinds of topics?
Zeeskeit: “TO BRING SHLEIMUS TO THE WORLD!!”
Yes! Good answer!
Golfer: “creature was endowed with whatever it needs to fulfill its purpose. So if woman’s purpose is to be an ornament, to have children, and to sew, why was she endowed (“Vayiven ess hatzelah”), from the moment of her creation, with bina yiseirah?”
I’m not sure, but I think that “sewing” may be a reference to bina yeseirah. Similar to the Midrash that says that men bring the flour and women make it into bread (or something like that) which is a reference to their different (spiritual) tafkidim.
I will have to look into it when I have a chance.
Why just asking about women? Why was Adam created?
I am copying and pasting part of a post that Little Froggie wrote on another thread because I think it is very relevant here. (Hope you don’t mind, Little Froggie):
“Women by nature tend to crave close relationship. It’s inherent, deep within them. Men by nature do not NEED this connection-relationship, their desire lie elsewhere (not for now).
This is the powerful “glue” HaShem in His wisdom set in motion. When you come to think of it, it almost seems miraculous- why should a women submit herself to a husband (and all it entails), go though childbirth etc.. And why in the world would a happy-go-lucky man want to link himself up with a woman just for some external features or other senseless attributes? It’s these miraculous forces at work. A woman knows she’s forgoing her freedom, ???? ????? ??, nevertheless ??? ??? ?????? she craves this, and does so most willingly. Man knows (most of them at least) what he’s in for by the time he’s ready to step under the Chuppa (unless they did a good job hiding), that’s the ??? ??? ??? ????? because ??? ??? ??? ?????. As Chazal say elsewhere ?? ??? ??? ???? ?? ??? ??? ??? ?????? ??? ?????. All for one cause, to effect a “family”. That’s why we put the pasuk ???? ???? ??? ??? on a Tnaim.
Back to the first point, the deep relationship part, it is was and will be mostly the female’s inyan in the marriage.”
Oish!! You don’t have to post my NarishKites all over again…
But I wanted to further comment on my post earlier about bringing Shleimus to the world…
The job of the woman is to be ?? ?? ??, that is the way Adam in his Ruach Hakodesh defined human females. To beget,nurture and bring up children. That is her tafkid in life, doing so attains her Shleimus. Spending hours in davening, learning, deveikus etc. while maybe some sort of good feeling, is not the avodah of a woman. And by marrying and connecting to a true oved HaShem who can soar to great heights – that is they way she attains true Shleimus. Each one brings in his/her specialty, each one serves HaShem in the way He wanted – that is true Shleimus in the world.
Even a couple where the man does not totally dedicate himself for Avodas HaShem 24 hours, still, shleimus for the wife is child care and more home related, whereas for the husband at seeking a livelihood. Today some wives try to juggle both… kol hakavod, by some it’s a necessity.. still a woman’s specialty is her home while a man’s is out making ‘dough’ – ??? ??? ?????. That is the medrash about the woman taking the husband’s wheat and making bread out of it – ????? ??????.
May you meet true zivug b’karov and strive for true shleimus.
LF – Amen! Shkoyach! I hope you don’t mind that I reposted your post. I just thought it was important to put it here, because I was a bit bothered by the way those maamerei chazal were being quoted and I was concerned that others could misunderstand and it could be a Chilul Hashem. So I thought it was important to have some explanation.
One thing that I would like to add to your last post. From things that I’ve learned, it does seem that davening is a VERY important part davka of a woman’s tafkid, since women’s davening has a power that a man’s doesn’t. She doesn’t need to spend hours davening, and perhaps it’s the informal, heartful Tefillos that she says while she is busy with child care and housework that are the most important, but her Tefilos are definitely of utmost importance.
Hashem created the woman primarily to be her man’s *eizer knegedo.*
To say that she was made to bear children and raise them is complementary towards being an eizer; yet not her raison d’etre. Only Hashem is in charge of who gives birth. Raising children is one tafkid, but it’s not the most vital, ironically.
If it was to stay at home raising children, then the Lubavitcher Rebbe’s Rebbetzin would have missed out on her calling. Yet she did not. Her purpose was to support and lift up her husband, according to his needs. Furthermore, there are couples that marry later. Even then, the wife is the eizer knegedo.
How that plays out depends on the individual couple. Generally it’s about the woman’s special intuition, where the husband gains insight through his wife. The wife offers the husband something spiritual and beyond tangible, foremost.
Lightbrite – I don’t think Sara Schnirer’s main tafkid was either being a wife or a mother. And there are women who never get married (and according to “statistics” if you believe them, it is impossible for everyone to get married) – yet they still have a tafkid in life. I am not married yet and don’t know if I ever will be, but I think I still have a tafkid in life. Even if you want to assume that I will get married eventually, I still have been single for the past many years and I don’t think that means that I haven’t had a tafkid all these years. And it is entirely possible that I will never get married, and that doesn’t mean that I have no tafkid in life.
I do agree with you that being a mother and/or wife is the most important role for a woman (I’m not sure which of the two is more important, but I do think you make an interesting point on that topic), but I just think that one has to be careful how one says such things, because not everyone gets married.
Rav Leff said that a woman’s most important tafkid is being an “Aim B’yisrael” and this can be accomplished in many ways. For example, Sara Schnirer didn’t have any children, but she was the mother of all of Am Yisrael. Anyone who is involved in Chinuch or Kiruv in any way can be considered a “mother”.
It would be harder to say that there is any way to be a wife without being married, so I like Rav Leff’s vort because it can apply to anyone.
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