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One of the many taanos of the Mizrachi community on the Chareidim is, “How come you don’t share the burden, too?”
It would seem, though, that they are clearly against a clear gemara Baba Basra Daf 7 (Yes, yesterday’s daf) that Talmidei Chachamim are exempt from building walls, etc., for shemira because the Toraa itself is a shemira.
The Chasam Sofer though, points out that the Sheyarei Halishcha went to fix the walls of Yerushalayim, which is for shemira, and that came from Machtzis Hashekel, which was incumbent on Talmidei Chachomim and unlearned Jews alike?
The CH”S answers that the Gemara’s exemption is only for shemira between Jews and Nonjews in Golus , but when it comes to one country fighting another it does not apply.
This would seem to make the Zionists and Antizionists “Leshitosom”. Is this a golus fight between Jews and Goyim, or merely a country of Israel defending itself against an invading country?
In Tanach, Sefer Shoftim, [the Book of Judges] chapter 5,
the Prophetess Deborah [Devorah HaNeviyah],
sings a Divinely-inspired song.In chapter 5, verses 12 to 16, she publicly praises
those Jews who fought against the enemies of Israel.
Then she publicly REBUKES those Jews who did
NOT join the fight against the enemies of Israel.===============================
In Tanach, in Sefer Shmuel Aleph, chapter 18, verse 7,
we see Shaul HaMelech and the General of Shaul’s Army,
David ben Yishai. (This was before David became King.)They are both returning home from recent victory in war.
We see the Jewish women publicly praising both of them:
“SHAUL HAS SLAIN HIS THOUSANDS AND
DAVID [HAS SLAIN] HIS TENS OF THOUSANDS.”From this we see that the soldiers who fight our enemies
deserve to be publicly praised and thanked.===============================
Babylonian Talmud, tractate Sanhedrin, page 72A:
“If you see someone coming to kill you,
then arise and kill him first.”EXPLANATION: Hamas and Hezbollah are trying
to kill as many Jews as possible, and they have
been doing that for at lesst the past 20 years.Muslims, in general, have a history of killing Jews
that goes back more than 1,400 years into the past,
all the way back to Mohammed, who Muslims
believe to be the greatest prophet and the perfect man,
who actions must be immitated by all Muslims.Mohammed ordered that 800 Jewish prisoners of war
all be beheaded., and their orphans made into slaves
and their widows used for immoral purposes.All this was 1,200 years before the first Zionists.
So do not say that Zionists causes Muslims to hate Jews.===============================
Once full-scale war broke out after the State of Israel
declared its existence on May 14, 1948 [CE]
Reb Shraga Feivel’s [Mendlowitz] thoughts
were never far from Eretz Yisrael.A group of students saw him outside the Mesivta building
one day, talking excitedly with Rabbi Gedaliah Schorr
and gesticulating rapidly with the newspaper held in his hand.“If I were your age,” he told the students,
“I would take a gun and go to Eretz Yisrael.”SOURCE: Reb Shraga Feivel: the life and times of Rabbi
Shraga Feivel Mendlowitz, the architect of Torah in America
(chapter 26, page 338) by Yonoson Rosenblum for Artscroll / Mesorah,
year 2001, based on Aharon Sorasky’s Shelucha DeRachmana,
ISBNs: 157819797X, 9781578197972, 1578197961, 9781578197965===============================
During the last year of his life [secular year 2000 or 2001],
one person asked Rabbi Avigdor Miller ZTL ZYA,
if we Jews should pray for the Israeli Army.Rabbi Avigdor Miller gave this answer:
“IF THEY ARE FIGHTING TO DEFEND US,
THEN WE SHOULD PRAY FOR THEM.”Those were his exact words, which I personally witnessed.
Instead of prevaricating, please tell us what you think on the matter.
“Talmidei Chachamim are exempt from building walls, etc., for shemira because the Torah itself is a shemira….”
Two points.
First, tell that to the families of the 1200 kedoshim who were slaughtered on Simchas torah.
Second, it you truly believe that All of the 80,000+ draft- dodging yungerleit are “Talmidei Chachamim”, you obviously are in need of some serious intervention.
Rabbi Steven Pruzansky said:
“The IDF [Israeli Army] soldier fulfills three mitzvot
that cannot be fulfilled by the soldier in any other army:
[1] the settlement (Yishuv) of Eretz Yisrael,
[2] preserving Jewish life (Pikuach Nefesh),
[3] and Kiddush HaShem, the sanctification of G-d’s Name,
implicit in the Jewish people exercising sovereignty over our homeland.”SOURCE: Ask the Rabbi, Part 22 by Rabbi Steven Pruzansky
2023 August 18 from www (dot) RabbiPruzansky (dot) comRabbi Aryeh Kaplan [ZTL ZYA] said this in his
HANDBOOK OF JEWISH THOUGHT, volume II,
chapter 3, paragraph 24, top of page 23:“Experience has shown us that when Jews are
not ready to defend and die for their fellows,
an even greater number are killed in the end.”Thank you, Square and Gadol.
Gadol…, cut out your apikorsus – you can’t dismiss a Gemora like that. Also, you misunderstood it. The Gemora says that Torah protects the Talmidei Chachomim themselves. There is another Gemora nearby which says that their Torah provides a degree of protection to others as well. It does not mean, however, that it is guaranteed that nothing can happen to them.
Rambam, Hilchot Shabbat, chapter 2, paragraph 23:
[The following rules apply] when gentiles lay siege to Jewish cities:
If their intent was financial gain, then Shabbat laws
should not be violated because of them,
nor are we allowed to wage war against them.If a city is located near the border, however,
we should march against them with weapons
and wage war against them, even when
they are [merely] demanding hay or straw.In any location, if the gentiles’ intent was [to harm] Jewish lives,
or if they engaged in battle with a city or laid siege to it,
without stating a specific intention, we must wage war against them
and the Shabbat laws should be violated because of them.It is a mitzvah for every member of the Jewish people
who can come [to their assistance] to go out
and help their brothers who are under siege
and save them from the gentiles [even on] Shabbat.It is forbidden to delay until after Shabbat.
After they [the Jewish soldiers] saved their brothers,
they [the Jewish soldiers] may return home
with their weapons [even] on Shabbat, so that a
dangerous situation will not be created in the future.>>>It would seem, though, that they are clearly against a clear gemara Baba Basra Daf 7 (Yes, yesterday’s daf) that Talmidei Chachamim are exempt from building walls, etc., for shemira because the Toraa itself is a shemira.
Not so simple to begin with . As the Poskim say the Gemora is discussing a situation where the Talmidei Chachamim are saying that on our end you don’t have to build the wall if you don’t want to. We are relying on our Torah to protect us and don’t need it. If they aren’t saying that then they are obligated to pay like everyone else (see the Shaarim Metzuynim B’halacha on those dafim)
“The fact that the 1200 people who were nebach murdered wouldn’t agree is #1 they were mainly nonreligious people and I don’t think a Gemara in Baba Basrah really talks to them….”
You can call it apikorsus or whatever….My only point was that secular Israelis have been told for decades that limud torah by the Chareidim offers “protection” to klal yisroel but that mantra has become a very difficult political sell after simchas torah.
That Bava Basra gemora raises a lot if questions. One would be – what kind of T’Ch are deserving such protection in terms of learning and behavior.
Maybe we can use Ravina’s approach when he tried to force his poor neighbor Runia to pay up for the fence: he sent a worker into Runia’s field to prentend to pick up dates, and when Runia started shouting at him, Ravina said – so, you do need protection?! So, if we have T’Ch who showed that they do not need physical protection or financial support from amei haaretz, then they should be left alone. As in Bava Batra, when T’Ch refused to pay up a Roman tax (which was more like a one time gezera rather than dina d’malchuta, if this matters) and merchants threatens to leave the city, T’Ch saud – ok, leave and this worked out. So, current T’Ch should be ready to live near the border and refuse protection from Tzahal.
T’Ch are also expected to provide protection to others.
Makkos 11 discusses Kohen godol caring guilt for unintentional murder. Even when a lion ate someone 3 parsangs from Yehoshua b’ Levi, Eliahu did not visit him for 3 days. I do not know, though, what to make out of such temporary punishment.
“And he [Rabbi Shraga Feivel Mendlowitz] expressed amazement
that anyone who considered himself a good Jew could possibly
go seven days without thinking of some way
in which he could improve the lot of settlers
in Eretz Yisrael or otherwise improve the Land.”SOURCE: Reb Shraga Feivel: the life and times of Rabbi Shraga Feivel Mendlowitz,
the architect of Torah in America (chapter 25, page 322) by Yonoson Rosenblum
for Artscroll / Mesorah, year 2001, based on Aharon Sorasky’s Shelucha DeRachmana,
ISBNs: 157819797X, 9781578197972, 1578197961, 9781578197965Rabbi Shraga Feivel Mendlowitz was the founder of Torah U’Mesorah
and became principal of Yeshiva Torah Vodaas in year 1921 CE.
His career in Yeshiva Torah Vodaas lasted 25 years.
He was known as “the premier architect of Torah in American history.”
He left this world in 1948 CE at the age of 62 years.They themselves do not believe that they are on that level, If they did, they would not run when there is a siren. In any case, there is an obligation towards one’s fellow Jews (see Rambam, Laws of Kings 7,4).
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