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I know we can’t understand hashems way, but maybe there is something we need to learn from the current events with the major hurricanes in the Caribbean islands?
The first sentence you wrote answered the question.
We learned that it’s hurricane season
Because people moved to an island in a place that they knew was prone to be hit by hurricanes, and they prefer to live their. For similar reasons Californians suffer from earthquakes, and people in upstate New York get punished with large snowfalls.
Now if a gigantic hurricane or blizzard hit Los Angeles or Tel Aviv, then you could ask questions.
I guess it must be the pirates…
Kingdavid, if the hurricanehit in December, it would have meaning, not during hurricane season.
Kingdavid: It is inspiring to see someone who sees current events and wants to learn from them.
Hashem promises in Parshas Noach that He will not bring a flood on the entire world (but He may bring the flood on parts of the world). Even though something happens in a natural way, we still need to know that everything is from Hashem and -especially if it’s causing such turmoil – to learn from it. The test is to be able to recognize that it is Hashem all the while and to learn from the situation, not to dismiss it as nature.
That being said, I don’t know what we are supposed to learn from it. Except maybe that this world is so temporary and the only things of our possessions that we actually keep are the mitzvos.
King D, the fact is that this hurricane season isn’t really so unusual. To respond in order;
1. Hurricane season runs from August 1 through October 30 every year. Atlantic cyclonic storms (hurricanes) that occur at other times of year are what is unusual.
2. while it somewhat unusual for two Cat 5 storms to make landfall on North America in the same year, the number of named storms this year is about average. the last eleven years have been fairly slow years hurricane wise due to extreme drought in North Africa. Dust blowing east from Africa had a tendency to attenuate storms that form annually in the vicinity of the Cape Verde islands. The breaking of the drought resulted in less hurricane weakening dust.There’s another major hurricane about to hit Puerto Rico and nearby islands after other parts of the Caribbean and Florida were hit, which itself followed a major hurricane in Texas.
And today Mexico suffered a second major earthquake two weeks after the last one. All this in the run-up to Rosh Hashana. I would definitely consider all this a warning from Hashem.
משיח צייטען
I warned you all not to vote for Trump or Hillary.
2 hurricanes of insane power in the same area so close together 2 giant earthqukes so close together right before rosh hashona i think hashem is trying to show us something
You can read anything you want into any natural event. When you get to olam habah, please post here and let us know if you were correct in your speculation as to the REAL reason why the Ebehster took the action he did. Per my prior comments, I’m skeptical poishete yidden can postuate a cause-effect relationship or point to a specific message from shamayim for even tragedy that occurs.
Torah was given to all of klal yisrael including the “poshut” yidden. We can all learn something from it. We can also ask our gedolim.
Gadol, there’s internet access in olam habah?
Gadol, there’s internet access in olam habah?
Of course there is, and if you are in a place without internet access, thats called Gehenom
Rambam Hilchos Ta’aniyos 1:2-3
This is of the paths of repentance, that when disaster strikes and they cry out on its account and sound the trumpets, all will know that they were harmed due to their evil deeds … and this will bring the removal of the trouble from them. However, if they do not cry out and sound the trumpets, but rather say, “What occurred to us is the way of the world and this disaster is mere happenstance,” this is a grossly insensitive reaction and will cause them to cling to their evil ways and the disaster will be compounded by additional disasters. This is what is written in the Torah: “And you shall act towards me with keri, and I will act towards you with the wrath of that keri.” In other words, when I bring a disaster against you so that you shall repent, if you say it is keri (happenstance), I will add the wrath of that keri.
We know the churban was because of sinas chinam and pritzus (per the Gemora), Tach V’tat occurred because of talking in shul (per the Tosfos Yom Tov), the holocaust occurred because of zionism and secularism, etcetera. Our contemporary Talmidei Chachomim, just as with Tach V’tat and the holocaust, are uniquely qualified to tell us what a disaster represents.
Right before moshiach comes there will be crazy happenings . Crazy discoveries and revelations of not only technology and crazy disasters but in also Torah and chassidis all these are part of the start of yimois moshiach don’t remember exactly the sicha but this is in my own words
how do you know Hes punishing them? maybe Hes testing them???
The Gemara says, “Ein pur’onee’os bah li’olam elah bi’shvil Yisroel.” [Yevamos 63a] No misfortune comes upon the world if not for the sake of Yisroel. Do you hear that? All misfortunes are only for the sake of our people. Even what comes upon the nations of the world. And Rashi says, “ki’dei li’yari’um,” in order to put a fear into us so that we should do teshuva.
Joseph
This is what i posted here last week but the editor for some reason didnt post it writing:
what you wrote & explaining that first Hashem sends us a hint to wake to teshuva by hitting other nations with tragedies so we ask ourselves why is this happening. if this sadly Chas vshalom does not work then sometimes klal yisroel needs to be hit by tzaros R”L (as we see in the solomon family in Nvei Tzuf to the 3 soldiers in Hadas aram etc….)
Hashem is not waiting for personal teshuva, that was just done yesterday on yom Kippur. Hashem is waiting for ALL klal yisroel to come together for international teshuva of achdus & bein adam lchaveiro. to return together as one loving nation from all levels of frum to reform to chasidish etc…
may it happen very soon so we can spend succos at the bais Hamikdosh rebuilt
Because of gay marriage. Duhhh?
Hello, hurricanes during the hurricane season and earthquakes in Mexico and Japan are not out of thr ordinary. We’ve had only 13 named storms so far. When Wilma devastated Florida in 2007 during chol hamoed, it was the 23rd named storm at that point and it was still September
LC, clearly you missed the Rambam I quoted in about the 19th post on this thread.
lesschumars
thats the problem affecting the ENTIRE WORLD today (jewish or not) it s called “FACING REALITY”
What happens today when tragedy strikes? everyone blocks it fom his face & says to themselves “what does hashem want from me?” i have nothing to do with 9/11 i dont work in NY i dont even go visit NY. i dont know who leiby Kletzky is…. but the truth is that we get Hashems wakeup call for teshuva in the back of our heads were just not ready to accept reality & tell Hashem that yes we get your message & we will do teshuva so that we dont need more tragedies to happen C”V. “we can’t fool Hashem” a person is the fool if he thinks he can fool Hashem. its one of the 13 ani maamins/ priorites of faith to be a yid. that hashem knows every thought that goes through a persons mind…..
may we finally all wake up to reality & face it. ex. better to face a problem when its small then live in denial & wait until its a much bigger problem. rather its about a child falling behind in school or a tiny health issue that can grow much worse C”V
Hatzlacha
Joseph, i saw your post. The storms are not out of the ordinary.
Jakob. , if you go back decades, you can find storms, tsunamis, droughts, floods blizzards, windstorms, sandstorms, etc almost weekly everywhere in the world. WBhaiat makes these storms special?LC, Rambam is saying even “ordinary” or “natural” tragedies that occur “as expected” and “on schedule” are brought by Hashem to give Yidden a warning to fix their behavior.
Sure Joe….evern a broken clock is right twice a day……there is a game played by some to attribute and rationalize everything that happens to some variation of hashgacha paratis, whether it a routine, normal event or some natural disaster or tragedy and conclude they know that its the Ebeshter warning his hidden to “fix their behavior”. Perhaps what needs “fixing” are those who claim to know what is Hashem’s intent.
Obviously GH disagrees with aforementioned Rambam, Rashi, Chazal and Gedolim like the Tosfos Yom Tov, who attributed Tach V’Tat to talking in shul, and the Gemorah which attributed the churban to sinas chinam and women’s pritzus.
Joe and jake….attributing churban habayis to sinas chinam arguably makes sense under daas torah…..attributing tropical storms in the eastern Caribbean which arrive with clockwork regularity and intensify in cycles every few years to some unidentified need for tshuvah by the tzibur for their actions (e.g. yidden voting for Trump, Toevah marriage and other abominations) puts you guys in a rarified atmosphere of naviim that I wouldn’t subscribe to. BTW, there was more pritzus among the men just prior to Chruban bayis shaini than by women but I guess you guys don’t read history.
GH, I guess you don’t read and believe the Gemorah, Rashi and Rambam because everything I said I am merely repeating from Chazal, Rashi, Rambam and Gedolei Yisroel like the Tosfos Yom Tov and others (including Gedolim recently with us and some still with us) that attributed specific tragedies with specific acts among Yidden. FTR, pritzus among women by Bayis Sheini is one of the reasons Chazal themselves list in the Gemorah as a reason for the churban.
Joe….don’t believe everything you read…there is considerable debate among chazal and more contemporary meforshim as to the underlying cause of churban bayis sheini, and even those Chazal who mention priztizus were more nuanced. Also, this was in the historical context where the role of men in both the initiation and perpetuation of what was then called “pritzus” has changed and men today are recognized as much of the cause of the problem and thus part of the solution. With that thought, look in the mirror and a g’mar tov.
I shouldn’t believe everything I read in the Gemorah, Rashi and Rambam? Clearly we don’t share a common religion because my theology requires belief in what is told to us by Chazal and elucidated by the Rishonim. I suggest you educate yourself with Shabbos 62b. Yes, the husband/father is responsible in making sure his wife/daughters are dressed in full accordance with halacha.
Most Interesting and Most Meaningful information I just got..
The Ariza”l, the father of Kabbalah, lists the four elements of creation as:
Earth, water, wind and fire.
Afar/Adama, Mayim, Ruach and Aish.The Kabbalists explain that when man becomes corrupt, the elements of the earth follow suit.
This is Hashem’s way of showing man that he must change his ways.
The first Hebrew initials of the four elements are aleph, resh, mem and aleph.
Guess what they spell – “Irma”.
Who else is speaking if not Hashem?
Let’s not forget that all this is happening in Elul, the month of Teshuva.
The Ohr HaChaim HaKadosh and the Chasam Sofer, osb”m, say that when Moshiach is about to come, calamities will happen one after the other in rapid succession, in order to stimulate people to repent and come back to HaShem.
There’s Harvey, Irma, earthquake in Mexico, biggest wildfire in LA..
> Wind, Water, Earth and Fire..
Again the four elements..> Time for Teshuva, Tikun, Geula..
Let’s do our part..
May we see BeKarov Refuos, Yeshuos, Geulos and Besuros Tovos!
Got that text a few weeks ago
Emunah247, there are a bunch of old ladies named Irma (and about five people by that name aged 0-65) who might be offended by that.
And yet another hurricane hits America, in such close proximity to an already unusually high number of hurricanes.
And now large portions of urban California is burning down full neighborhoods of urban population centers.
I can already hear the apikorsum yelling “but it’s fire season!” Right, urban neighborhoods that have been thought to be safe from wildfires now burning to the ground, with dozens known dead and hundreds more unaccounted for…
how many times will every yid be screaming out to Hashem tomorrow on Hoshana rabba “HOSHANA L’MAANCHA…”? HUNDREDS of times (perhaps it even reaches over a thousand) but how can YOU expect to be saved by Hashem if YOU are not ready to accept his direct tragic wake-up calls for teshuva????? theres only a few hours left until the last day of last years sins of teshuva is over at shkia tonight. WAKE UP MY LOVING BRETHREN WAKE UP…. we dont need any more horrific wake-up calls,
“Nothing in life is coincidence” every tragedy has a direct message/reason from Hashem.
may we all finally wake up to “FACE REALITY” & each person admit to his problems so s/he can work on themselves to solve them (from ruchnius to gashmius problems) %80 percent of solving any issue is admitting to the problem a person has.
Have a chag kosher v’sameach
I can’t wait to hear the specific reason that will be cited by some of regular CR neviim who communicate directly with the Ebeshter as to the reasons for the Northern California wildfires….is it the growing acceptance of toevah marriage that originated in nearby San Francisco, the growth of the internet facilitated by Silicon Valley to the south or perhaps some yidden in Sonoma County who davened with too much kavanah when they said tefillas geshem last year on Shemini Atzeres (fire experts attribute the rapid spread of the fire to the high winds but especially the unusually heavy growth of underbrush due to the end of California’s drought and heavy rains in the past year).
Do you think Hashem had nothing to do with it?
With Tropical Storm Ophelia’s transition to Hurricane Ophelia on Wednesday, 2017 became the first year in 124 years — and only the fourth on record — in which 10 Atlantic storms in a row reached hurricane strength. Franklin. Gert. Harvey. Irma. Jose. Katia. Lee. Maria. Nate. Ophelia. The last time 10 consecutive Atlantic storms became hurricanes was in 1893. Since modern records began in 1851, there has never been an 11-hurricane stretch.
This year the Atlantic has experienced 18.75 major hurricane days: the total number of days logged by Category 3, 4 and 5 storms. This is nearly five times the full-season average of 3.9 days.
And with major urban areas of California still burning down over a week after large wildfires broke out, with dozens dead, hundreds missing and complete large urban neighborhoods burnt to the ground along with thousands of homes in the largest state in the United States — is anyone still in denial about all this being a message from Hashem to Klal Yisroel?!?
To Joe and DY:
YES….. השגחה פרטית
NO: ……assigning a specific inyan or musar to a specific event….
Like blaming talking in Shul for Tach V’Tat? Or blaming sinas chinam for the churban?
Yup….just like that and a bunch of rabbunim offering multiple theories as to the reason for the shoah…….the answer is that there is no answer NOW and won’t be until z’man moishiach.
Too bad you weren’t around to set Chazal, and the Tosfos Yom Tov, straight when they came up with their “mistaken theories”, ghd.
To Joe: Agreed…just think of the possibilities had I been around….obviously, the point being that for most events, we don’t know and the thoughts of our gadolim as to why certain tragedies befell klal yisroel provide much for us to consider.. However every rav or mekubal who for his 15 minutes of online fame pretends to know the specific behavioral reasons for every contemporary event or tragedy have devalued the currency of such admoniitions and musar to a point of absurdity.
thank you YWN MODS
I guess i was right about the shocking messages i sent earlier. their too shocking for people reading the coffeeroom & are only for people who can take these shocking wake-up messages from Hashem seriously.
thank you for your great MOD work. after all that is your job
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