Who wants to be a Tzadaikes like Rus?

40 & 80 per the D’var Torah I heard in Shul today.

Shouldn’t we all learn from the Rosh Sanhedrin?

i actually thought the thread was about, why would someone want to be a tzadekes kike rus. she became very poor, had to pick her own wheat, take care of her mother-in-law, and married an 80 year old guy who died that same night, and was considered an outcast, as she was a giyores from moav!?!

not an easy life.

coffee addict -That shidduch wasn’t based on Yichus, like you’re implying. He was a Baal Chessed!

I’m sorry I gave off that implication

I was trying to say that you can’t bring a rayah from a tzadik like Boaz and Rus that did it L’shaim Shamayim

Rus did it fully because Naomi said so and it even says in Rus that Boaz praised her that she didn’t go for the younger men (mashma in those times too you married within your age range)

In New York State the wife can be 14.

And (trying again), Rus had to do specific actions for Boaz to realize she was the right one for him. Perhaps our current crop of girls should take a page for her book, and put more “hishtadlus” into getting married (even noting Keddushin 2b).

Not necessarily, just most people probably got married at 18 for males.

That’s just an assumption,(you might be thinking about the time of the Tannaim)

let’s look at the avos and gedolim,

Yitzchak got married when he was 40, Yaakov when he was 60, Moshe was somewhere between 60 & 80, Yosef when he was 30.

“In New York State the wife can be 14.”

With consent of all parents and a judge. The age is 16 with consent of parents; 18 otherwise.

“It is precisely that-Rus’ tznius-that impressed Boaz.”

AND her incredible chesed.

Health:

It was, in fact, her tznius. Medrash says that is what he noticed in her, that SOLE FACT. How she modestly squatted to pick the low-lying ones, instead of bending down. (refer to the crises in cars for more on this)

As far as the other acts she did, they were directly guided by Torah counsel – no personal gratifications of any sort. Chalila to attribute that to lack of modesty!

coffee addict-

Tzipporah was a young girl tending her father’s sheep and certainly much younger than the nearly 80 year old Moshe, and Osnas may have been the daughter of Dinah, who herself was only around the age of Yosef.

If you’re looking for a similar age shidduch in the Torah, it’s Adam and Chava. She was still younger though. After that the gap just grew and grew.

Brucklyn Jewess:

The answer to that is – I don’t understand. I really don’t. (another issue added to the things I don’t know)

do you have a mekor for how old Tzipporah was (saying she tended her father’s sheep doesn’t prove anything)

Since shepherdesses of 80 years of age are extremely rare (to say the least), I’d say the burden of proof is on you to say that she was so than on anyone else to say that she wasn’t.

IOW, where’s your makor that Tzipporah was anything other than a young woman?

The Wolf

I am aware of a gemara that puts Levi at age 13 at the time of the maaseh Shechem, but I would ask you to cite a source that puts Dinah at age 3. If you will recall, at the time of the incident where Yaacov met Eisav, his youngest son (Yosef) was 6-7 years old (we know this because Binyomin was in utero). Dinah was older than Yosef [as we know from Chumash, where Leah prayed for her 7th pregnancy not to result in a son since that would shame her sister Rachel]. Hence, according to any opinion, Dinah would have to have been a minimum of 8 at the time.

In any case, combining the two opinions would present a serious difficulty. If you will take the opinion that she was 3 (pending citation of a valid source for that) you will not be able to claim that Osnas was born of that union. Correct me if I am wrong.

As far as Tzipporah, I have no proof one way or another. But the account given lends itself to the assumption that she was not as old as Moshe (nearly 80). Aside from the way we are told about them as “daughters” indicating their youth, the fact no meforshim remark on her bearing children as miraculous indicates that it was ordinary (i.e. not an 80 year old woman). Beyond that, I will hark to Wolf who believes the burden of proof rests on you.

Just out of curiosity, what gave you the idea to randomly choose these two marriages as close in age? You don’t seem to have any proof, and there is also no obvious reason to think it was so. If you were looking for examples (other than the one I presented jokingly) you could have gone with the meforshim who say the shevotim married their own twins.

This further hurts your credibility. If anything, it shows that Yisro married when he was quite old and presumably to a young (child-bearing age) woman. Similar to Moshe/Tzipporah and just about every other marriage in the Torah.

or that he married young to someone his age and his daughter Tzipporah was Moshe’s age

I looked it up. The main gemorrah is Mem Daled

It’s on kuf aleph, amud beis, sixlines before the wide lines.

http://www.hebrewbooks.org/shas.aspx?mesechta=14&daf=101b&format=pdf

The relevant passage reads:

??????? ????? ?? ??? ????? ????? ???? ???? ??????? ?? ??? ?????? ?? ??? ??? ??? ??? ???? ???? ??? ??? ???? ???? ?????? ?? ?? ?? ??? ???? ?? ?? ??? ???? ??? ??? ?????? ??? ????? ???? ???? ????

Like Yehuda and Tamar (also not exactly the BY paradigm ) it was orchestrated from above to prepare the ancestry of Mashiach. It is not about tznius (mixed messages from Tamar) or about shiduchim, (rather short duration (one pirush in Yehudah/Tamar)), it is about the importance and nature of the Mashiach.