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amush is already over…..
as the joke goes… “Have a great day!!”
tzi lange yuhren
Another 120
Can someone live to 121?
Can someone live to 121?
Why not?
Jeanne Calment lived to 122.
The Wolf
WolfishMusings; Did you check her (Jeanne Calment) Birth Certificate, or Driver’s License??!!
Isn’t their meforshim that indicate 120 as the maximum? (Going on vague memory.)
How reliable are the records of people who allegedly lived beyond 121?
WolfishMusings; Did you check her (Jeanne Calment) Birth Certificate, or Driver’s License??!!
No, of course not. But her life was well documented. Her birth and baptism in 1875 are matters of public record, as is her marriage in 1896. She is listed on her daughter’s birth certificate in 1898.
She was listed in a census in France in 1876 and 1881, as well as several censuses between 1900 and 1920. Since then, until her own death in 1997, she has left a paper trail of documents ranging from birth certificates to death certificates that all attest to her continued existence and her family’s.
The Wolf
Isn’t their meforshim that indicate 120 as the maximum? (Going on vague memory.)
Perhaps for the overwhelming majority, but there is nothing that says that selected individuals can’t exceed that.
The Wolf
Grandmaster: I never really told anyone here me age, did I?
Don’t we just bless people to live until 120 and not longer because moshe rabbanu did? That’s not saying people can’t live longer (as others are saying)
Jeanne Calment lived to 122.
There is good evidence that she did time travel, and her actual earth years were only 87.
See more here: http://tinyurl.com/6eyuy7y
But her life was well documented. Her birth and baptism in 1875 are matters of public record, as is her marriage in 1896. She is listed on her daughter’s birth certificate in 1898.
She was listed in a census in France in 1876 and 1881, as well as several censuses between 1900 and 1920. Since then, until her own death in 1997, she has left a paper trail of documents ranging from birth certificates to death certificates that all attest to her continued existence and her family’s.
Does her 1896 marriage certificate indicate her year of birth as 1875? Does her daughters birth certificate list the mothers year of birth? Do the French census records list her year of birth? And what existent records from 1875 document her birth or baptism in that year?
The Birthers aren’t satisfied with questioning Barack Obama, they are insisting on questioning Jeanne Calment!
The Birthers aren’t satisfied with questioning Barack Obama, they are insisting on questioning Jeanne Calment!
+1
Does her 1896 marriage certificate indicate her year of birth as 1875? Does her daughters birth certificate list the mothers year of birth? Do the French census records list her year of birth? And what existent records from 1875 document her birth or baptism in that year?
Her marriage certificate from 4/8/1896 lists her age at 21 years old.
Census records don’t usually list dates of birth, but they do list ages. The 1876 census lists her at one year of age. That puts her year of birth at about 1875. Her daughter’s birth certificate from 1/20/1898 lists her age at 22.
The birth, baptism and associated records all exist today.
The Wolf
“How reliable are the records of people who allegedly lived beyond 121?”
Other than Jeanne Calment, they are not reliable.
charliehall; You mention that the “Birthers” aren’t happy with questioning Barack Obama’s Birth certificate but are also questioning the facts on Jeanne Calment’s birth certificate. The reason people are questioning the facts on the latter is because she makes a claim that isn’t borne out by the facts in most other cases.
I would ask them how they stayed calm because a temperamental person would never live that long.
is because she makes a claim that isn’t borne out by the facts in most other cases.
Well, she’s not making any claims now, because she is deceased.
Nonetheless, her claim is borne out by the facts of her particular case.
The Wolf
My husband once found a source (I’ll have to check the details with him later) that says not to say “ad meih v’esrim”, as why limit the scope of your Bracha? (It is used due to Moshe Rabbeinu, as mentioned earlier, not because it’s the “maximum” one can live). We say “ad bias goal tzedek” (obviously implying and beyond as well!)
Getting back to the original topic-Let him know that statistically, most people do not die after 120, so he/she should be safe.
BTW, I’m a new member here. Loved all the posts, so I decided to join in.
Hey,anyone agree with me?
Eclipse: Yes. There’s a famous story of how the Chafetz Chaim crossd over and made way for a goy on the street. The goy commented “that Jew will live long”. Didn’t he?
Actually, we wish people “until 120” because of a pasuk in bereshis (not noach, see Wolf, I remembered :)). Bereshis 6:3 ????? ????, ??-???? ???? ???? ?????, ????, ??? ???; ???? ????, ??? ?????? ???.
BSD: I like that one!
Itche,
That pasuk is also interpreted to mean that there are 120 years left until the mabul.
The Wolf
its soo weird that a random lady outlived Moshe Rabbeinu
its soo weird that a random lady outlived Moshe Rabbeinu
I don’t think it’s random at all. Mind you, I don’t know why she merited such longevity, but I’m fairly certain that HKBH knew what He was doing when he allowed her to live that long.
The Wolf
How about Mesushelach who lived to 969? Avraham Avinu? Sara Imeinu? Og Melech Habashan?
“The reason people are questioning the facts on the latter is because she makes a claim that isn’t borne out by the facts in most other cases.”
Well as Wolf pointed out, she isn’t around any more to make a claim, but nobody who is informed questions her dates of birth or death.
‘The goy commented “that Jew will live long”. Didn’t he? ‘
He was born in 1838, and died in 1933 at the age of 95. Radvaz may have lived to the age of 110.
“its soo weird that a random lady outlived Moshe Rabbeinu “
So did his brother.
You tell him or her that your count is wrong, you are only 99 and should have many more years.
“Nonetheless, her claim is borne out by the facts of her particular case.”
Ill believe Chazal and the meforshim over any “facts” anyday. i dont believe she lived past 122. I bet its all a scam or misstake.
Of course its possible to live longer than 120 its a bracha we give because alot of the Tzaddikim lived till 120…
Moshe rabbeinu, rabi Akiva, Rabi Yochanan ben Zakkai to name a few.
Who was Jeanne Calment anyway!?
Assuming he outlived his wife:
“I have a wonderful Bubi for you.. she still has most of her teeth !”
Wasn’t Jeanne Calment the lady who presold her apartment with the agreement to live in it until she died and then outlived the person who bought it?
Ill believe Chazal and the meforshim over any “facts” anyday.
So would I, but could you kindly cite for us the source in Chaza’l and meforshim that it’s impossible for a human being to live past 120?
According to those who consider it impossible for someone to live past 120, I suppose that the proper thig to say when in the presence of someone about to turn 120 is “KOIHANIM AROIS!”
am i the only one who fell for pba’s trick?
no. i did not believe there was time travel involved – but i thought there might be some interesting article.
though it was very cool what happened instead. 🙂
Wolf: Is there any frame of reference for that pasuk (e.g. when ploni died or was born or something) to place it as being said 120 years before the mabul or does the reasoning work the other way?
mosherose: So you’re saying no one can live past 120 and chazal back that up? Interesting.
How many people do you know that are over 120, that you need to know what to tell them? ; )
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