- This topic has 42 replies, 9 voices, and was last updated 2 years, 10 months ago by .
-
Posts
-
The Shelah Hakadash prescribes saying Parashas Haman shenayim mikra v’echad targum.
I’m still waiting for someone to document the Tuesday of Beshalach as a segula for anything. Reb Mendel of Rimanov pushed for saying it every day, as mentioned in countless seforim. Neither people who lived in Rimanov nor his descendants can support anything relevant to Tuesday of Beshalach. I think it’s a great hoax.
We say PARSHAS HAMAN around T”U B’Shvat, since it is a month before Purim (Purim Katan this year) when we lein about Haman. We are mekayem “shloshim yom kodem haChag” start learning about the Chag – Purim. – LOL, Purim Torah
¨If I had a dollar for every email I will get today reminding me to say parshas hamon, I wouldn´t need a segula for parnassah.¨- An Anonymous Rav
said over by R’ Dovid Bashevkin
MB: R’ Dovid should find some way of electronically screening emails for segulahs and ranking them by authenticity. He is one of the more “tech savy” rabbonim I’ve encountered (online of course).
“I think it’s a great hoax…”
The entire issue of “segulahs” and their legitimacy is a really grey area in our hashkafah with some holding strongly by certain segulahs associated with very narrow and specific actions (i.e. being machmir on a certain mitzvah at a certain time/location) or more generally “buying a segulah” by giving tzadakah to a Rav/Mosdos to daven on your behalf for one/multiple segulahs, sometimes linked to a yahrtzeit at the kever of a big tzadik. There are frequent ads on all the frum media an websites promoting various segulahs linked to financial donations.Bottom line is that some segulahs appear to have strong foundations simply based on their “sponsorship” whereas others appear borderline new age kefirah. I guess its all based on the emunah of whoever is seeking the segulah, the credibility of the sponsorship and their willingness to pay.
It seems from some Gemoras that any kind of segulohs or stam requests from Hashem might be considered after you did hishtadlus. A person who asks for segulah for parnasa but does not send resumes out is challenging Hashem.
Why Jews used to daven for rain rather than stam for food? What if Hashem taki sends rain, but I don’t want to go sow and harvest in bad weather?
GH:
Segulos have become a subject of heavy marketing, and I seem to share the disgust in this. Tzedokoh is a wonderful thing. And when we give, we should not be purchasing anything. While it is true that one can ask for reward for giving tzedokoh, sacreligious for all other mitzvos, this has been taken to an illogical level, and actually poses a threat to our fulfilling mitzvos as Dvar Hashem that we follow to become closer to Hashem. The treasure of segulos is hinted in countless places throughout Chazal, and the greats of all subsequent generations have accessed this inyan as well. So not denying the existence of segulos in general, I am horrified when I see them become the subject of marketing. Cuiases, otherwise worthy and charitable, now suggest that they are the supreme resources for various brochos, heretofore the domain of HKB”H.
The seguloh of Parshas Hamon – reciting it daily is referenced widely, including the annotations on Shulchan Aruch. It didn’t make it into the siddur as a hoax. And the sopurce for reciting it with שנים מקרא ואחד תרגום is also mentioned by Acharonim from long ago. The relevance to Tuesday of Beshalach is the hoax. It was created by a prankster in the early post war years. There is not even an explanation for why that day is any more auspicious than any other calendar date. The spread of this hoax just testifies the level to which our community expect shortcuts in Avodas Hashem.
The Satmar Rov – Divrei Yoel ZT”L is quoted regarding the seguloh of reciting Parshas Hamon, stating that it works up until 8:59 am. From 9:00 and on, the seguloh for parnosoh is to go to work. It’s like expecting the win the lottery without buying a ticket.
TLIK +1. I guess I am a Nistar (Modern-Litvishe) Satmar. Same for Igros Moshe, I think there was a response from R Kanevsky recently why religiously lighting candles does not always help raise a T’Ch – “maybe he did not supervise what the child is learning”. Note focus on parent supervising, not “maybe school did not teach properly”.
Also, current Daf Megilah talks about several people giving their segulos for long life. Here is what I learned:
First lesson – these questions are being asked of actual people who are pretty old, not from a rando in the street who wants to teach longevity.
Second – those segulot intersect but vary. According to my maggid shiur, this means that each person might have his own moment in time when he needs to make a special effort that is special to him. Gemora sometimes refers other people who do same middah when explaining it, but does not mention anyone who copied someone else and had a long life!
3 – while patience is mentioned, it is NOT a required one apparently! One elder’s guards chased R Akiva to the palmtree for asking about longecity secrets until he proved that he is a T’Ch.How could it be Kefirah to Daven for Parnassa?
Why would you have an issue of someone Davening extra for Parnasa
YI > Kefirah to Daven for Parnassa?
Like asking your parents to help you with math homework while you did not bother opening a book.
If Hashem creates challenges for us, and you turn around and ask him – no you go first, then you don’t believe that what he created is really important for you to deal with, you have a better agenda.
RebE > don’t believe the Satmar Rav ztz’l said that as mentioned above.
I am also suspicious: 9am is too late to start working.
AAQ:
There is another nusach floating around cyber space of 8:00 am.
This quote has existed for many years. It is more believable that the supposed quote from Reb Mendel of Rimanov. The Divrei Yoel pushed his chassidim to work honestly and to learn. Reb Mendel Rimanover pushed for Parshas Hamohn daily.
The Mishan Berura says that it is not enough to rattle it off. One must understand it. It says that each person received exactly what he needed. If a person internalized that he will be satisfied with his lot, which is a rich person (Pirkei Avot 4:1).
If someone learns and then davens for parnasa – could someone who works whole day and does not learn daven to become a Talmid chochom? Is reciting brochos on Torah a good segulah? Which day of the year is the best? Asking for a friend.
RebE, is this still so? If we define parnosa as abililty to have some food, shelter, clothes, a little extra food for shabbos – then, really, if you are legal, you will get this from state of NJ withou, has vesholom, any davening. So, maybe, tefilah is to earn honest living. Even then, the situation is not as dire as yam suf. Yes, everyone is anxious when looking for/losing a job, but 95% of people who want it are employed. Need more guidance how to apply this Chidushei Harim to our days.
This entire discussion is more shallow than superficial. There is a glaring question that is either beyond the awareness or simply denied. We are told that מזונותיו של אדם קצובין לו מראש השנה עד ראש השנה. Could someone rely on that and not bother working? There are several answers to this? Here’s one.
The קצובין provides the allocation of this parnosoh. Trump allocated money to build the Wall. While Hashem will not withdraw the allocation, if the receiver fails to merit the delivery of it, it rermains unspent. People who write budgets for businesses understand this well. All the segulos won’t help the one that will fail to merit it or provide a conduit for the shefa.
Lastly, there are numerous known segulos for parnosoh. Many of these are commonplace, done by all, yet seem to have failed in the expected wealth. Others are also well referenced in Divrei Chazal, yet we have no campaigns or publicity. I can provide ample references if anyone here wants them.
“If someone learns and then davens for parnasa – could someone who works whole day and does not learn daven to become a Talmid chochom? Is reciting brochos on Torah a good segulah? Which day of the year is the best? Asking for a friend.”
If someone spends their days and nights serving their father, waiting on him, filling his cupboards, cooking and serving him food, respecting and honoring him in ways that make him happy you can be sure the father will make sure he is cared for and has his needs met. His love and appreciation for his son’s devotion will bring him to keep him fed and clothed. But if you tell your father that you don’t have time to tend to him, ask about him or do what makes him happy because you are too busy stuffing your pockets, stomach and closets, you will have no reason to expect anything, and should not have the chutzpah to ask for anything.
ps – as always your negative attitude toward full time learning is disgusting and comes out in so many ways in your posts that i wonder why most of what you submit is approved.
Syag, I have very positive attitude towards full time learning. Gemara says that it works only for some – very special – people, like Rashbi. Can I say “I agree” or is this presumptuous as it is sad that Gemora needs to be defended. Most of our Rabbis and Teachers came from this background. Speaking of that, how did R Yaakov Kamenetsky was earning a living? You may know the story – he was first a Rabbi at a very small shtetl in Lita. Then, in America, he signed up to fundraise on behalf of some organization. He was asking a businessman to contribute $X, “same as last year”. The guy checked his records and saw that he paid less than $X last year. “Please let them know this amount was wrong”. “I can’t”, Rav answered, “I already resigned”. I think this is integrity required of a T’Ch.
L’maase, I value more “life-long learning” than “full time” learning for part of life. They are not opposites of course.
Your negative attitude toward people who learn full time is apparent in most of what you write. If saying the sentence “I have a very positive attitude toward full time learning” is enough to make yourself think you really do, then you may be operating in a place that has no room for conversation.
The moshal about the father and son is beautiful and maybe a good answer to my question, so I hate to offer a different interpretation, maybe consider it an “additional insight”:
Maybe a working person is _actually_ taking care of the Father’s house, while a learning person is reading Father’s instructions on how to take care of the house. Hope this is not misconstrued as an “attack on learning”. In my defense, I am not vaguely recalling maybe a similar Sephardi moshal: where Balabos gave instructions to his servant what to do while he is on the trip and to review instructions daily. On his return, everything was ruined but the servant cheerfully responded that he faithfully reviewed instructions “every morning and every evening”.
Syag, you should take people at their word, I have no reason to deceive you. Do you want me to go down the block and ask Rosh Kollel for a letter confirming our good relationship?! Same Rosh Kollel who told me that being honest in business is the most important middah and who cried “genevah” when listening to a visiting Talmid Chochom who was giving a lecture about humros in kashrus and yichud and then kulos in business to the cheering audience.
” maybe consider it an “additional insight”:”
maybe consider it your inability to accept other views or rethink yours.
You say you are open but never refrain from taking people’s words and rearranging them to fit what you already decided was right. Thinking that learning is reading instructions is a gross understatement.
Torah is literally instruction on what to do in the world. It is a profound argument on what is more important – learning l’shma or l’maan laasot, nothing personal here.
For example, Avoda Zara 17b: Rav Huna says: Anyone who occupies himself with Torah study alone is considered like one who does not have a God. The alternative offered there is tzedokah. Obviously, one needs to have funds to do tzedokah, whether inherited or earned.
Again, I am not making a silly argument one v. another in modern practical world. I am saying that those who insist on “only learning” (or “only working”) have to prove their case and not pretend that other opinions are outrageous. These opinions are all over Gemora and later. You can justify deviations, but do not make deviations normal, and normal devious.
Syag > learning is reading instructions is a gross understatement.
Here I found R Twersky using a similar analogy of Torah as literal manual to the world (quoting from a secondary source):
Think of the user’s manual that comes with a new car. It contains the manufacturer’s instructions for the proper care and maintenance of the machine. If one follows these instructions meticulously, the car will perform well, but on the other hand, if they are ignored there will certainly be problems down the line. Failure to change the motor oil regularly will eventually result in the engine malfunctioning and ultimately failing. This is not a punishment for not following directions, but the consequence of not providing proper care.Yes, the Torah is the manual of the world. That doesn’t mean you can extend that to any odd scenario that applies to car manuals.
RebE, the question from the drash (that I don’t remember source of, maybe Sephardi as people here seems not to have heard it) – is this enough to be reading instructions and maybe writing more books about the instructions, or are we supposed to engage with the world and follow instructions.
One thing here is that parnosa is usually addressed as a need to be supported, and then challenges or opportunities for mitzvos that occur within it, usually refusing good money to avoid an averira or dishonesty. There is another aspect, though – engaging and improving the world according to Hashem’s instructions: making people respec Hashem/Jews more, feeding them, curing them, making them laugh … If someone gives $20 to a poor man, he is giving tzedoka. If the same person creates a job for that poor man, or makes an affordable product for hi, or builds him a house – it is just a “parnosa”.
Think of say, Fritz Haber, written out of history of science for his sins of creating poison gases during WW1. His development of fertilizer changed modern agriculture and saved billions of people from starvation. With that and his assisting Jews with connection when they were being expelled by Nazis (they did not dare touch Haber himself for a while, until he left himself and died from a heart attack while contemplating going to EY) – what is his place in Olam Habo based just on his “parnosa”?
A week passed already – any good news?
- You must be logged in to reply to this topic.