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Although I think the idea of Waiter/Waitresses are silly people who patronize these establishments must tip the Waiters/Waitresses properly which is 15-20% of the bill or you aare making a chillul Hashem. I am a Mashgiach Temidi for one of the local vaadim @ one of these establishments & one of the waiters told me yesterday that Jews don’t tip properly or @ all which is a huge chillul Hashem.
Tipping is totally optional.
That isn’t a chilul Hashem. Stick to your job. Tell their bosses to give them raises. The prices of kosher are expenses as is and you are part of the cost.
Tipping is totally optional.
So is saying “excuse me” after burping.
The Wolf
Tipping is not optional, which defeats the supposed purpose and is in fact very silly, but if you don’t tip, the waiter basically doesn’t get paid.
Maybe if kosher prices weren’t too high, people would have more money to tip. Stick to your job.
RebYidd23 the store owner is supposed to pay the waiter
What do you mean by “stick to your job”?
The store owner is supposed to pay the waiter, but the fact is that the system is this way, and within this stupid system, it is wrong not to tip.
He is sticking to his job. He’s not berating the restaurant’s patrons, he’s pointing out that workers who depend on tips ought to be tipped. If you can afford to eat in a restaurant, you can afford to tip.
Tipping is totally optional.
No it isn’t.
http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/topic/tipping-waiter#post-687480
Maybe if kosher prices weren’t too high, people would have more money to tip. Stick to your job.
If you can’t afford the tip, don’t go to a restaurant. The price of kosher food in no way justifies withholding the waiters their due.
The job of a mashgiach temidi is not to tell people what they should do with their money; it’s to make sure that the food the customers are eating is kosher. Not everybody who eats out can afford to tip. The prices of kosher food leave less money for customers to tip.
Its the responsibility of the restaurant owners to pay their employees fairly, not the customers. Customers already pay the price of labor.
Although tipping is technically optional, it is expected unless the services was particularly poor. In fact, tipping is so standard that there are laws that take this into account – whether it is the law that allows a lower minimum wage for waiters since there is a presumption that they will receive an additional amount as tips, or the fact that waiters have to include a certain percentage of the bill for tables they serve in their taxable income, since it is presumed that a tip for at least that amount was received – and as tips are often paid in cash, it would otherwise be easy for the waiter to just not report and pay tax on such income.
So yes, tipping wait staff properly is not only an issue of being a “mentch” – if you don’t do so, you’re litterally taking money away from such staff.
an Israeli Yid
The prices of kosher food leave less money for customers to tip
Worst argument ever.
The tip should be factored in when you figure what you’re able to afford.
If you believe that someone deserves a tip, not giving it to them just because you spent your money elsewhere is selfish at the least.
Also just a side point about tipping: that extra few dollars means a lot more to the waiter than it does to you.
Maybe every employee should get a tip? Maybe the cashier at a grocery should get ripped as well
If you feel the waiter did a good job (though most times it’s the chef who’s slow or if food is made too fast it won’t come out right) it’s your right to tip. Paying waiter shouldn’t be thr responsibility of the customer. The customer already pays for labor.
Maybe every employee should get a tip? Maybe the cashier at a grocery should get ripped as well
Maybe you’re right, but that’s not really relevant to this discussion.
The fact is that waiters’ salaries are based on the assumption that they will be supplemented by tips. This is not the case with other employees.
“The fact is that waiters’ salaries are based on the assumption that they will be supplemented by tips. This is not the case with other employees.”
Why is the customer responsible for the salary level or compensation level of employees at a business he’s only a consumer at? Logically that’s entirely the responsibility of the business owner, not his customers.
Why is the customer responsible for the salary level or compensation level of employees at a business he’s only a consumer at? Logically that’s entirely the responsibility of the business owner, not his customers.
Maybe you’re right, but once there is an expectation that people will tip, and salaries are set based on that expectation, it is completely improper not to tip just because you don’t agree with the system.
Meno so we should all be sheep and follow
Meno so we should all be sheep and follow
Glad that we agree
Maybe if people would not FRESS themselves in restaurants as often as they do, they would have money to TIP when they did go.
What else do people do in restaurants besides dress?
Tipping is entirely optional.
I’ve been to places that don’t pay salaries and the tip gets included on the bill in the total cost.
I assume most places where I live, in Israel pay salaries.If I feel like tipping I will.
If my waiter didn’t do a good job I definitely won’t.There’s a difference between “should be” and “is”.
In the USA tipping is expected. The IRS will affix a minimum 8% tip level to server’s income if it feels tips are under-reported. Servers in restaurants have to tip out set percentages to bartenders, hostesses and busboys. So, if you stiff the server, he/she may still have to take 5% of the checks for the shift out of his.her pocket and pay the other workers. Then he/she may get a tax bill for that income not made.
15% went away in the 1980s. 20-25% of the pre tax bill is a proper tip in 2018. If you cannot afford to tip, go to a joint without table service, you don’t have to stay home. BUT, if you have service pay for it.
Similarly, push your state legislators to raise servers’ minimum wage to the same as everyone else and get rid of tipping altogether.
“15% went away in the 1980s. 20-25% of the pre tax bill is a proper tip in 2018.”
This is inaccurate. 15% tipping was still commonly recommended in the early 2000s. Then they got greedy and raised the recommended tipping percentage. And they also started about that time to recommend tipping for workers that previously never expected a tip.
“Also if the waiter/Waitress doesn’t do a good job & you feel they don’t deserve a tip or less of a tip you are mechuyav to tell the Waiter/Waitress that you are not tipping them because of their bad service this way they know why you didn’t tip them & would avoid the chillul Hashem.”
That does nothing to reduce the alleged chillul Hashem. The waiter will hate you, or Jews, all the same if not more if you tell him to his face that he provided shoddy service so you’re not tipping him, then if you simply walked out without a tip or a comment.
Furthermore, your idea of telling him why you’re not tipping does nothing to alleviate many of the above reasons given in this thread as to who tipping is allegedly mandatory.
If you just want to convey a message but want to be careful not to cause a chillul Hashem, tell him to his face that the service was substandard, and tip 25%.
allegedly mandatory
Why allegedly? Do you think Rav Belsky didn’t actually write that? Does anyone disagree?
I didn’t see anything about Rav Belsky commenting on this issue. But even if he did you can’t assume other poskim who didn’t comment on the issue necessarily agree with him.
I didn’t see anything about Rav Belsky commenting on this issue.
I posted a link above
But even if he did you can’t assume other poskim who didn’t comment on the issue necessarily agree with him.
Au contraire, you can’t assume anyone disagrees without reliable information.
You can’t assume anyone disagrees, true, but you can’t assume anyone agrees either, in the absence of them so saying.
Who is THEY? you refer to…….
As of the 1990s most travel guides for tourists coming to NY listed 20% as the expected or common tip percentage.
It wasn’t about being greedy, but providing servers with a living wage.
In 2018 any 16 year old working at McDonald’s here in CT starts at state minimum wage of $10.10 hour, but a 45 year old server with 25 years experience is legally only paid the server’s minimum wage rate of $6.38 and is expected to earn the difference through tips.
In NY, that kid at McDs gets $7.50/hr minimum wage and the experienced server is paid $4.00 plus tips.
That’s ludicrous.
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If you and Mrs. J go into a sit down restaurant for lunch and the bill is $60 before tax. A $12 tip is appropriate. The server will be expected to tip out $3 to other personnel on your check. The $9 for serving you for an hour is not much. Remember for much of the shift, it is not lunch time and business and tip income may be lower.I support a $15 minimum wage bill (coming in CT) and no tipping
You can’t assume anyone disagrees, true, but you can’t assume anyone agrees either, in the absence of them so saying.
Which leaves us that it’s a chiyuv, and not just “alleged”.
“Maybe every employee should get a tip? Maybe the cashier at a grocery should get ripped as well”
As a cashier sometimes I work the outside register (selling plants,ice,snacks) sometimes someone will give me a tip or when I’m out there and I see someone needing assistance to get their groceries to their car ( not my job but if a cart guy is not around and I see someone elderly or handicapped that needs assistance i help out) sometimes they will give me a buck. Never expected but always appreciated.
Hi, Goq!
In NY, that kid at McDs gets $7.50/hr minimum wage and the experienced server is paid $4.00 plus tips.
That’s ludicrous.Why is that ludicrous?
WB Goq!
DY: If Rabbi A issues a ruling on an issue no other rabbi addressed, his ruling isn’t universally binding.
Tipping is something the #MeToo movement should have gotten rid of.
Expectation from having a beard and peyos and chasidishe garb for example does create a chilul Hashem see Rambam Hilchas Yesodei Hatorah 5:11.
There was an article in one of the yiddish magazines ‘Inyan?) few years ago an interview with one of the SATMAR REBBES ZT’L hois baucher (personal attendant..have his name) on the Rebbes daily down to earth life (in the 50’s). Among the episodes he mentioned , there was once when he came home with the Rebbe with taxi. After they went into apt the Rebbe asked him ‘did you give tip?’ he said ‘No’ and the Rebbe was upset and told him ‘Dont you know in America the minhuk is to tip?, also you caused a chillil Hashem’
@DasYochid
Do you think any experienced adult should work for $4 per hour from the employer and have to live on the generousity of customers?
That’s what is ludicrous!I read threads here in the CR that teenagers get $10/hr to babysit, why should an adult working a regular job get 40% of that?
NY is way behind the times when it comes to minimum wagesHigher minimum wages causes job losses.
Thank you DY and Joseph I am not the prolific poster i once was but i am always reading.
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