Supreme Court Rules – States Can Ban Abortion

This is great news from everyone’s perspective because it gives power back to the states which is something we need more of. Also even if you think abortion should be legal the libs have been claiming for a long time that it is a right from the constitution without any eve Odense of that. Trumps actions coming up big

“Endangering the poor”

Easy solution; don’t do the thing that makes them have to get abortions. Sin has consequences.

There will be more abortions next year than any year in the last thirty years. Which fits well the neo-conservatives idea of morality.

@Young Rechnitz
“This is great news from everyone’s perspective…”

WHO ARE YOU to assume you can speak for everyone. It does not apply to me.

Reb Eliezer, rape and incest is no more an excuse for abortion than if she became pregnant as a result of her immorality.

> Roe vs Wade has been overturned.

Roe was overturned. Wade – won.

For those concerned, this is not a gezirat malchut, the issue the being returned to the democratic process, like many other issues in this country. Most states have reasonable laws for most issues lately (excepting slavery 160 years ago). CA is not (yet) arresting people for owning businesses, and AL is not arresing people reading Das Kapital. So, they will figure out this also, hopefully. some states might be pushing for extreme positions now, because of political stagnation, but will do some accommodations later. At the end, each state will get what their voters deserve, and those who really really do not like the result – they can easily move. Just be grateful for all these painless freedom options that this great country provides.

The dangerous part for liberals – in 19 years, growth of number of voters in red states. This is already happening based on ideology and has a scientific name “Roe effect”, and now it will further increase red state population, leading to changes in electoral college.

Another question – some hope that Dems will be so outraged that they’ll drive to elections this November. (Well, given gas prices, maybe they need to be bussed). From rumors, even Trump is afraid of that. From experience, though, Rep base is showing up more for social issues, while those Dems who did not vote so far do not really care much. Maybe because Rep social agenda is positive for a normal human being, while the slogan “let’s make sure a girl in Alabama can get rid of her baby if she can’t afford to feed her” is less motivating.

AAQ: The question is whether the increasing population in red states are coming from blue state voters, diluting the red state voting base.

Shocking amount of ignorance in these comments.

CT, you knew what ulm meant ( although in New York committing a crime definitely doesn’t usually entail imprisonment).
Quite frankly, I’m surprised you did give one of your condescending lectures as to how things are done in your town and your compound.

Rabbi Bachrach (Chavat Ya’ir, no. 31) was asked by a certain errant woman who sinned promiscuously, became pregnant and had regrets. Would she be permitted to abort? He cited the above mentioned Talmudic source (Arachin 7a) and permitted her to do so in order to save herself from a life of agony.

The famous Rabbi Ya’akov Emden (She‘ilat Ya’avetz I:43) was asked a similar question by a married woman who sinned promiscuously, and gave her a similar permit to terminate the fetus. However, he concluded his words with the cryptic statement, “Any wise person can understand that lechat‘chila it is prohibited to kill, although Bet Din does not administer capital punishment for killing fetuses”.

Rabbi Moshe Feinstein (Iggerot Moshe, Choshen Mishpat II:69 par. 2) claims that, with the above statement, Rabbi Emden recanted from the permit. But Rabbi Eliezer Waldenberg (Tzitz Eliezer IX:512 part 3) understood his words as teaching that if not for grave circumstances, one should not easily permit abortions for just any minor reason (such as financial distress of a woman seeking career advancement etc.).

Gadol – 99% of the time it’s not being “forced” on her. She did something she’s old enough to understand the results of. Live with it and don’t kill.

Gadol, I quite frankly couldn’t understand what you’re trying to say. My point is that not all women support prochoice; there are any number of organizations run by women that oppose abortion.

One other thing, the statistic being thrown around that 55% of Americans support abortion. However, it turns out that when asked if they support late term abortion, the approval % drops significantly.

Reb E, no one’s dismissing him. Being rov of a hospital is wonderful. Writing teshuvos is also great. Having government rabbinical jobs is neither good or bad, it’s just a parnosa, it doesn’t show gadlus. He was a legitimate posek and i use his sefer myself(not that he needs my haskama).

But in the big picture, he was one of hundreds of influential rabbonim in the 20th century. Rav Moshe was one of…3 or 4, who built up klal yisroel after the war, and was on the level of an early acharon in learning. He’s up there with the chazon ish, brisker rov, rav aharon kotler, and maybe one or two others.

We will know z’man moishiach is imminent when we go a week here in the CR w/o debating weather Reb A was a bigger talmid chacham or more chashuvah than Rav B, or a more influential posek etc. etc.

Aseh l’cha Rav (Rabbanit) and stick with him (her) until you have reasons not to.
P.S. Just trying to elicit a response on a slow, cloudy Monday AM

Court also ruled this morning that denominational prayer by public employees is OK in public events like football games, school meetings, etc.

AAQ, are you drunk again (still?)?

R’ Moshe was very much in favor of taking money for learning or teaching.

Amil – there’s no child expense to pay from that time, so why don’t money? Also, you’re assuming that the torah’s position is that a life begins the moment of conception, because the only two perspectives you’ve heard are “my body my choice” and “life starts at conception”. The first one sounds better, and it’s “empowering” so you go with it.

The gemara says that until 40 days there’s no neshoma. Many states also want to restrict it to about that time, when a fetal heartbeat can be detected.

Also, for “strong independent women”, why do they need child support?

“The Jewish Bible identifies human life as a soul placed (breathed) within a body by G-d Himself, with inestimable sanctity and value.” That is the authentic Jewish view, as determined by Rabbinic texts and legal codes stretching back to Sinai. We support Heartbeat Laws and other efforts to distinguish between tragic cases of abortion due to medical necessity, as compared to disregard for fetal life as simply the mother’s “choice.”

Reversing Roe v. Wade would not ban abortion, as alarmists insist—on the contrary, it would restore this policy decision to the hands of the democratic governments of the individual states. We hope that more states will be able to enact reasonable restrictions, and restore America to a posture of valuing all human life.

Israel Loosens Abortion Regulations In Response To Roe
The new rules, approved by a parliamentary committee, grant women access to abortion pills through the country’s universal health system and remove a longstanding requirement that women appear physically before a special committee before they are permitted to terminate a pregnancy.

Who could have foreseen that?

The stated goal of the rally is to proclaim that “Abortion access is a Jewish value, plain and simple.” Its real goal, however, is to gaslight broad swaths of the country, and to provide cover for secularist elites. The rally’s organizers, sponsors and supporters wish to render the killing of a fetus a religious liberty “right” and, at the same time, promote the dangerous fiction that a rational pro-life position violates the “separation of church and state.”

In situations where termination of pregnancy is necessary to save the mother’s life, it would be offensive to claim that such a basic humanitarian concern is uniquely tied to a particular religion. Is chemotherapy a “Jewish value?” What about access to X-rays or organ transplants? The panoply of sponsors, then, are not addressing the actual underlying debate. They are rallying to demand, in the name of religion, elective feticide until the moment of birth.

According to a didactic tale, a well-meaning person once asked a rabbi, “If you were to bless a pig, would that make the animal kosher?” “No,” the rabbi replied, “but it would make me trayf (not kosher)!” Jewish values are not determined by an alphabet soup of Jewish organizations, but by an immutable and transcendent code of Jewish spirituality, ethics and law. And that Jewish code is clear that life and the soul precede birth. In Genesis, for example, Rebecca is told that her unborn twins have distinct natures (25:23). In the Prophets, G-d informs Jeremiah, “Before I placed you in the womb I knew you, before you left the uterus I sanctified you, I appointed you a prophet to the nations” (1:5).

Moreover, Jewish tradition insists upon adherence to the Oral Law, in which the Mishnah provides moral instruction that a mother must be saved even at the expense of her child, if necessary, “because her life precedes his life” (Ohalos 7:6). Read that again, because the NCJW, the lead sponsor of the rally, refers to this Mishnah without quoting its explicit reference to the “life” of the fetus. Inexplicably, in the same paragraph, NCJW claims that, under Jewish law, a fetus is “not yet having [a] life of its own.”

This is shocking, and shameful. Still worse, other major Jewish organizations and even “rabbinic” groups signed on as rally sponsors, despite the NCJW’s perversion of an obvious statement in Jewish law.

Every citizen has a democratic right to advocate a public policy position, but it is wrong to misuse or mistakenly invoke the First Amendment. Unfortunately, many American Jews have so utterly lost sight of that which Judaism holds dear that they have elevated their own progressive agenda to the level of faith, likely to fill a resulting spiritual void. This rally, led by those who cherry-pick, decontextualize and distort Jewish law to support their position, will draw from those ranks. As mentioned earlier, no Orthodox organization will be at the rally.

This dichotomy between authentic Judaism and idolization of the progressive platform manifests itself in other ways, as well. In several weeks, the Jewish world will celebrate the 3,334th anniversary of G-d’s giving of the Torah to Moses on Mount Sinai. Jews who faithfully adhere to the Mishnah’s teachings will pray in synagogues around the world, celebrating what we believe to be G-d’s greatest gift. Yet, even conceding that I have no special talent for predicting the future, it is quite certain that not 5% of the attendees at the “Jewish Rally for Abortion Justice” will fully observe this annual festival of Shavuot.

Even holding faith aside for a moment, common sense should also have its say. Visit a neonatal ICU, and you will meet babies who cannot yet breathe on their own or ingest nutrients. Yet they are learning to recognize and find comfort in familiar voices, music and their own thumbs. Doctors and nurses work around the clock to ensure that these babies go on to live normal lives. It is utterly nonsensical to argue that a fetus, in precisely the same situation during a routine pregnancy, is not alive.

The transparent and patently dishonest message of the “Jewish Rally for Abortion Justice” is that valuing life is neither a matter of common sense nor an American principle, but rather a parochially Christian tenet—and, further, a tenet that constitutes a violation of the much-ballyhooed “separation of church and state.” Balderdash. In fact, the sanctity of life and the importance of traditional morality both come directly from the Hebrew Bible. Thus, all Americans, especially of the Abrahamic religions, should reject the progressives’ position, predicated as it is upon the absurd notion that it is somehow unconstitutional for the moral values of the citizenry to be reflected in the laws that govern our society.