STOP BLAMING THE BOYS!!!!!!

oomis1105, azoi.is is correct- when i offer a shidduch to someone, I am honest in what I know and what I ddon’t know.

If I have reference, which I usually do, I call them and ask what they can tell me about the boy/girl..and what kind of person would be suitable etc…

I usually get honest answers, and mention shidduchim accordingly…

I also never tell anyone they are being to picky or things like that, because I figured it is ‘min hashamayim’ and it’s not the right shidduch..

there must be a way…I have so many singles I’d love to help..

There is a major problem with so-called references. Who would give out their friend or neighbor’s number as a reference without being sure that the person has only nice things to say? Do you really think a reference is going to tell you ANYTHING negative?

On the rare occasion that the person would be 100% candid about something less than stellar about the proposed shidduch, it could get back to the person who gave that person as a reference, and cause machlokess.

AZOI you are absolutely right – it makes no difference who the source of the shidduch is. Very few people whose names are given by the boy or girl are going to be candid, though. if you have heard of such people, then they are the exception or had reshus from the family to speak candidly. Most people like to put their BEST foot forward, so they choose references who will bedavka enhance their image, NOT speak candidly about their flaws. Kind of like a used car salesman. I myself do prefer to network, but I don’t necessarily know people who live in the communities of a proposed shidduch.

WOW!! Good stuff here….however, i honestly didnt read most of the posts. A couple pf observations.

1. Boys who are sitting and learning in Yeshia until 22-24 are not ready to date. They don’t have any idea what the responsibilities that will come with marriage. The Yeshivos, somewhere along the way (11th/12th grade perhaps) should start explaining to them what is expected of a husband (and I am a husband who knew nothing 20+ years ago). Being sheltered in Yeshiva for 20 years and suddenly to start dating in the hopes of getting married quickly is alot of pressure for any boy.

2. Girls who want “the best boy” and think they can support AND raise a family is unrealistic to most (those with $$$ are the exception….for the rest it is a struggle). While idealogically I understand why one would want such a lifestyle, today it just seems that more and more young families are setting themseleves up for failure.

3. Parents need to set realistic expectations for THEMSELVES and understand what they want may not be what their son/daughter wants. If a shidduch sounds good, let them go out. If it is B’shert it will happen, if not, not. But for parents to influence the dating process based on their own desires is wrong.

I just read the first few comments and felt that a reply was needed. To whoever said, that the boys should mature earlier- hello!!! Girls are bas mitzvah at 12 and boys at 13- there is obviously a reason for it. And physically they mature at an older age than do the girls- there is a reason they are telling the girls to wait- and he did not say to wait until they are older, just till they are 20! That is very reasonable!

When I being a “baal Teshuvah” went to shadchannim I had one main

quality I was looking for, that that was a girl who wanted to be careful about Loshon Hara, not someone who wanted to know the “latest juicy gossip” but who wanted to focus on building a family based on Torah and Mitzvohs.

I was told by the shadchanim that such a girl (even though she may have been in yeshivah only a few months)deserved a boy who had been in yeshivah for 10 years or more.

It did not matter they said, that the boy was interested in being careful about such things.

All that mattered was the number of years, he spent in yeshivah.

So a guy with lousy midos would be pared with a girl with excellent midos just because of how long he had spent in yeshivah.

Such attitudes destroyed my chances of finding a good shidduch for me and in my opinion the blood of all those of my descendents who will now never be born, is on the hands of those shadchanim and those who think like them.

When I first started looking for a shidduch I had not heard of Rebbetzin Esther Jungreis.

I met her about 15-20 years later and she invited me to come to her weekly lectures which had singles who could meet each other.

I however did not have the money to dress well enough on a weekly basis nor did I have the excellent high paying job that everyone else who went to such things had.

I would have looked and felt extremly out of place and did not have the kind of background or professional job that is needed to fit in there, either.

And if sophistiocated is not goyish then there is absolutely no need to leave the Torah world to get it.

Everything is in Torah.