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That is not the consensus of the medical community. If you donate a kidney, you need to make substantial lifestyle changes, such as no more contact sports or potential high impact sports.
You are confusing the medical community at large, with the kidney donation propaganda.
My kidney made aliyah! I donated a kidney a year ago (Rosh Chodesh Elul), it was the most amazing experience of my life (other than giving birth to my 3 wonderful sons). In fact my recipient told me that it is as if I had giving birth to him. His quality of life improved dramatically. He is doing wonderful, and I have never felt better or been in better physical shape than now. I would highly recommend it to anyone who is contemplating it. If you want to get in touch with me please have the moderators contact me, I will be more than happy to speak to you. My recipient lives in Israel, he came to New York and we had the surgery at Mt. Sinai hospital. I personally know many people that have donated kidneys to relatives or to strangers (I only met my recipient after the surgery), and not one of them regrets having donated their kidney.
do not ask US!!
on the subject…whats the halacha about organ donor cards
Poppa-
‘You are confusing the medical community at large, with the kidney donation propaganda. ‘?????
Please do not comment on issues that you are not familiar with.
Yes, you have to be more careful, but your life after donation does not stop, I was back at work a week after the surgery and I was back on my threadmill after two weeks. Six weeks later (chol hamoed sucoth) I was ice skating and bowling with my sons. I have not stopped doing anything because of my lack of kidney. Nine weeks after my surgery I was back to donating blood.
You might not agree with kidney donation, but don’t bash it. And believe me, if chas vechalila any one of your family members needed a kidney you would feel very differently about this.
pba – I think you were trying to be funny but it didnt work. Must be spending too much time in Chicago.
Holy kugel – My husband donated most of his liver two weeks ago to my sister. Even tho the recipient died days later, for unrelated and unknown reasons, he was very happy he did his hishtadlus. It is an unbelievable mitzvah that is obviously not for everyone but if the mods want to give out my email, either one of us would be more than happy to ‘speak’ to you about it. And the kidney surgery is much less invasive so kal v’chomer it’s worth considering. As far as being a part of their zchusim – I always learned that giving torah to someone who then gives it over or changes his life because of it gives you a part in thier mitzvos. So even more so wouldn’t giving a chance at life give you a part of the good they do with it? Definitely worth checking out!
Unquestionably, you have the potential to save a life, and that is an awesome thing. BUT – with all due respect to Caracas Chick whom I admire greatly for her chessed and courage, PBA is right. It is NOT as glatt and simple as the Kidney Donation requesters make it. There are people who have suffered serious post-surgical complications following this donation. And it IS a life-altering action. One can never again engage in contact sports or any activity that could risk injury to that area. And if your own kidney fails for some reason, you will never have the other one to take over. These are not issues to be taken lightly, but need to be well-thought out and discussed with other family members who might have a stake in your future health (including the possibility of one of THEM needing your kidney, G-d forbid – a small risk, but one which needs to be factored in).
If after really giving this a great deal of reflection, you still want to do it, yasher koach and be matzliach in every way. But don’t think it is a walk in the park, as CC implies. It is still at best, major surgery, anesthesia, potential for embolism, stroke,etc. And it is a recuperation period as after any major surgery.
I am happy for you, CC, that you could go ice skating and bowling (probably not the safest choices of activity after this type of surgery), and B”H you have three wonderful sons. May Hashem bless you with continued good health. Not everyone’s experience is like yours, unfortunately. If it chas v’sholom was a loved one, however, I would not think twice about it, no matter how risky. But we typically ONLY hear of the beautiful success stories and not the ones that go awry.
Oomis
” And if your own kidney fails for some reason, you will never have the other one to take over.”
if you get kidney failure it would affect both kidneys, the only way only one kidney gets affected is with cancer or physical injury to the kidney itself (and as my boys can assure you I do not play football!)
As to your comment about saving your kidney for the future for a relative, you have the chance of not being a match (I not only was not related to recipient but I am sephardic and he is ashkenaz, and we were a perfect match), or you might develop unrealted medical conditions that might prevent you from donating. The way I see it, if chas vechalila any of my relatives needs a kidney I certainly hope that someone will step up to the plate and help them out, just like I did.
Having never undergone surgery before, I did not know what recuperation would be like, but I had a wonderful support system. I left the hospital after two days, and my sister took care of me for the next week. As I stated earlier, I was back working (from home for the first week) a week after the surgery.
Thanks for your good wishes!
There are many who think it’s a strong Chiyuv to be an organ donor and many who think it’s an absolute Issur. Ask your Rov.
Caracas: I am familiar with it. You should not be ice skating, and I am sure your doctor would advise you not to.
syag: I am not trying to be funny. The medical community is not on the same page as the donation advocates.
pba – I’m not sure where your bias comes from but I can assure you that our donation advocates where very much a part of the medical community. And maybe you know of a DIFFERENT post op protocol, but you should never be so presumptuous as to think you are the one with the ONLY post op protocol. With the hours and pages of warnings, risks, forewarnings etc that they handed out to us pre-op, none of them were any you spoke of. Maybe there is more than one take on what is necessary, correct or appropriate after a transplant, even in the medical community.
I know this Aishis Chayal (Syag)who just went through an unbelievably difficult time in many respects and just got up from Shiva a few weeks ago. im sure everyone means well but this is not the time or place for an argument with her, even if well intended…Moderator.
Mod, I concur on Syag’s aishes chayilness.
Syag, Tell your husband musser zoger sends his greetings! He will know.
Syag, I am so deeply sorry for your loss. HaMakom Yenacheim eschem b’soch sh’ar aveilei Tzion V’Yerushalayim. May you and your family have a gebensched and healthy new year.
You are correct. Sorry, I hadn’t read the entire post.
Mod, while I feel terrible for what syag went through, this is a controversial topic and it would turn controversial. While I’m sure no1 means to insult or hurt anyone else or disagree with them, in this type of discussion it can happen. Also, I do not think that anyone is arguing with her as a person, I think they might disagree with something that was said. I think someone would have disagreed with whatever was said if it was anyone… not because it was siyag that said it.
Just thought that I’d bring this up cuz I was a little bothered by what that comment for some reason…
siyag, Hashem should give you the koach to continue on after these hardships that you have struggled with and this coming year should be a year filled with simcha and health for you and your family!!
Sorry for your loss
I dont think I could donate my Kidney or most of my liver though. Not for any Halacha reason, I just could not do it
syag, I apologize. I just read through my post again and saw that I spelled your username wrong the second time I wrote it. I’m sorry!!
“Should I donate my kidney?”
yes, that would be nice!
Kol Hakavod for people who undertake this mission.
There is a however.
People are sick and very promising when they need a kidney.
However, once they have the kidney some go back to their bad habits and feel they can eat whatever they want and end up sick again.
Before one gives part of himself, they should not rely on the info from the coordinator but do homework on their own in regard to the personality of whom they will be giving their kidney or other organ.
If there is secrecy involved, the coordinator should have some form that the recipient will sign as to how he/she will take care of their health.
Unfortunately, i am writing from experience and talking to the recipient is like talking to the wall.
syag: May hashem grant you the kochos to overcome this difficult challenge. I’m amazed at your and your husband’s courage. Donating most of one’s liver is a great thing.
I don’t think I’ll ever donate my kidney or liver, but I truly respect those who can do it.
holykugel: If you have the approval of your rav and family and feel ready and willing to donate – kol hakovod to you. Hatzlacha rabba.
Thanks everyone, Hashem has been very kind. I dont want to interfere with the thread or topic so I will step back.
Happiest, I am not sure what you meant about being bothered by the comment, and I certainly have no problem at all with the concept of someone seeing the whole subject differently than we did. It wasn’t even the subject at hand that I was commenting on. I was just getting stuck (as I often do) on the idea of not being accepting that other peoples opinions may be valid when different, and telling them they are incorrect. Please continue with the topic, it is very important. And thanks again.
syag, I wasn’t really talking to you. I was just saying that if the mod thought that a topic is a sensitive one to a poster (or anyone- I wasn’t singling you out per se) then that poster I’m sure knows this and knows that things might be said that they might disagree with and can be controversial. Honestly, I don’t know if I’m making much sense here but I don’t think it matters anymore.
All I can say syag, you seem like such a strong person who really believes in Hashem with your full heart. I can tell this by your comment “Hashem has been very kind”. I really look up to you and hope that if c”v I was given such a hard nisayon like you that I would be able to have the same outlook and strength that you have right now!!
Question
Kidney donation: Are there long-term risks?
I’m considering kidney donation. Are there long-term risks?
Answer
from Erik P. Castle, M.D.
Research has shown that there’s little long-term risk for kidney donation, provided you’re carefully screened before becoming a donor. As a potential kidney donor, you’ll receive a thorough medical exam to determine whether you’re a good match for the potential recipient. And you’ll be carefully checked to make sure you don’t have any health problems that might be made worse by donating a kidney.
Kidney donation involves major surgery, and there are risks including bleeding and infection. After your kidney is removed (nephrectomy), you’ll spend time recovering in the hospital and at home. With time, your remaining kidney will enlarge as it takes on additional blood flow and filtration of wastes.
Your long-term survival rate, quality of life, general health status and risk of kidney failure are about the same as that for people in the general population who aren’t kidney donors. Regular checkups, including monitoring of your kidney function and blood pressure, generally are recommended to evaluate your health after kidney donation.
I am new to the board, but this topic caught my interest. I am also seriously considering donating a kidney. I believe it was R’ Yechezkel Abramsky who used to have Kavanah in Bentching when he said “v’Lo Li’Yedei Matnas Basar v’Dam” that he should never need a transplant or blood transfusion.
When faced with the question of transplant and whether or not donating is what Hashem wants from us what WE personally decided was to go ahead and try (with a sense of commitment). We wanted to do it and figured (on our basic level of emunah) that if it is not what Hashem wants from us then one of the hundreds of things that would disqualify us would be present. We could know we did our hishtadlus, know we get the mitzvah for our intent and thats the end of it. When we ended up a match we felt that perhaps that was an indication that that was what Hashem wanted from us. Of course we spoke to our Rav, (and our kids, but not for a psak) but it helped give us direction. Instead of sitting and making decisions about things that may not even be shiach, we tried to see if we could get hints from Hashem and take each step as it came.
If your a match to another yid and can save his life then of course do it. I know 2 people who have donated kidneys in the last 14 months. One is working out every day same as before and you can’t tell a thing happened to her and the other is still in recovery mode but both talk about it all the time about how good they felt after they gave it.
Syag, i am pretty sure that there is a difference between liver and kidney because the liver is a regenerating organ so if you remove part of the liver it will regenerate and grow back. It is NOT an easy procedure but it is not a procedure that leaves you without an organ.
On another note, I am truly sorry for your loss, you certainly did everything humanly possible on her behalf. I would also like to wish your husband an Refuah Sheleima. May you have only simcha and nachas in the future.
HK, the decision to donate an organ, or have surgery in general is a very personal decision and certainly not one to be made according to the opinions of strangers. One would need to discuss such a major decisions first and foremost with your family and posek.
To be able to save a life is truly an amazing gift and mitzvah but that is NOT the ikkur in this decision. The ikkur in this decision is to have the support of your Rav and your family. Without complete and total support, it is not something to consider. On the other hand if you have the courage to do it, and you have the support necessary, you do you homework on the subject, and you work with a reputable organization, all I can say is I tip my hat to you.
Oomis once again I have to say we think alike.
Syag,
I am so sorry for your loss. I’m so saddened to hear. I have you in my prayers.
I think donating is the greatest way to give of oneself, but not everyone is up for the challenge. It’s very important to be very well informed. Writing here is a good beginning towards getting information. It’s just that, though; a beginning.
Such an undertaking has to be taken with careful thought and consideration. A person would be wise to speak with as many people as possible (donors as well as recipients) as well as top medical professionals who can shed light (statistical and case examples) of positive and negative reactions to the surgery. Elective surgery should not be taken lightly.
I donated a kidney a little over two years ago, through the organization- Renewal. I have not met and do not have contact with the recipient. I was up and about in a few days after surgery, and back to work after two weeks. I feel fine, boruch Hashem. My Kidney function must be tested every year.
Since my kidney donation, I have met many other kidney donors, including my brother, whom are all doing well, boruch Hashem.
A potential donor is tested thoroughly. Since a donor is in very good health before surgery, they should b’ezrat Hashem, recover quickly and completely, and live a healthy, long life.
Just to clear up something in my previous post, I have always known my brother, although he did donate a kidney shortly after I did.
Not to be taken as personal advice, but I have my doubts about kidney donation from the recipients standpoint. I really wonder if a transplant is safer than dialysis. If it’s not, it’s definitely not a Mitzva to donate. The reason I started not believing in transplants so much is because a friend of mine died from infection after having one. Tons of immunosuppressives are given to these pts. It might be easier for the patient to live with the transplant, but usually the Halacha goes after which prolongs life the longest. I used to believe the hype that it was the transplant as being safer, but I recently (18 months ago) spoke to s/o who works in a dialysis center and said some of these pts. can last forever on it. And not all centers are created equal. Find one where they have pts. coming for 25 years or so. Also with the latest study coming out today that 3 times a week dialysis might not be enough, if s/o now gets dialysis every other day or will get it like this -this makes dialysis safer than ever! Something to think about!
From the New-Jersey Star Ledger:
“Even with diligent compliance, however, a patient on dialysis faces a shortened life span. An ordinary American, age 30-34, can expect to live 50 more years, while a patient on dialysis, of the same age, can expect to live 11 more, according to the U.S. Renal Data System.
For someone receiving a kidney transplant, the life span for that age group increases to 30 years.
“A transplant is not just life-altering, it’s truly life-saving,” says Shamkant Mulgaonkar, chief of renal and pancreas transplantation for the Saint Barnabas Health Care System. “Someone gave you extra years that no other medical treatment does. That’s life-saving.”
mobico -You got it. That’s exactly the hype I used to buy into. Like I said above, these statistics are based on overall pts. But it seems that there is a big discrepancy between dialysis centers. Some are good and some aren’t – at what they do. So I’m questioning these statistics that say transplants are better for pts.
On a side note I did donate blood over the summer, first time i did that in a long time and I am a member of the Bone Marrow transplant registry.
They thought they had me as a match (Ashkenazic Jews are easier to match) and I had to re-submit my DNA, but I guess I was never a match, but I would donate my Bone Marrow
i too was looking into donating through renewal.
popa: after reading all the responses, do you still feel that one cannot do the same sports/excersizes as before the donation?
health: after reading all the above responses, would you still have doubts about the donation if the infection didnt affect your friend? (i’m not lessening the importance or hurt you feel about your friends untimely passing, just want to hear an objective opinion)
popa: after reading all the responses, do you still feel that one cannot do the same sports/excersizes as before the donation?
This has nothing to do with how I feel. This is simply the fact. Once you donate a kidney, you are not supposed to do any contact sports, and there are all sorts of other lifestyle changes as well. Ask your doctor.
There is no reason not to be on a bone marrow donor list.
miritchka -“health: after reading all the above responses, would you still have doubts about the donation if the infection didnt affect your friend? (i’m not lessening the importance or hurt you feel about your friends untimely passing, just want to hear an objective opinion)”
To inform you -I am a medical professional, in spite of what some posters here have said about me. You can take my opinion as a prof. or as anon. poster -it’s up to you. We in the medical profession don’t formulate opinions from one case.
I have some serious doubts on which is safer. If I were you, I’d discuss this with a Rov who is knowledgable in medicine before proceeding. You can mention to him my doubts and let him ask top Nephrologists their opinion.
There is another aspect to dialysis, too. My dad was on dialysis for years and when he had to wake up at 4:30 am and shovel out his car from the snow so he could spend three hours in a clinic, or take a taxi in on Yom Tovim, or dread storms that would block the streets and prevent him from getting to the clinic that day he personally would have loved a transplant option. And btw he chose the 4:30 slot so he could continue working full time. But he would not hear of me undergoing surgery on his behalf and when he was finally ‘sick enough’ to ‘make the list’, they told him he was too old to qualify (this was many years ago). So this is not a medical opinion and I speak for nobody but my dad. It is just a view from another side. Also, dialysis causes a drop in blood pressure and once when he was sick they wouldn’t/coudn’t dialize him becuase his blood pressure wasn’t stable enough and it was very uncomfortable for him.
popa:
“This has nothing to do with how I feel. This is simply the fact. Once you donate a kidney, you are not supposed to do any contact sports, and there are all sorts of other lifestyle changes as well. Ask your doctor. “
what other lifestyle changes?….except for making sure I drink plenty I have not had to make any changes, I exercise regularly and eat healthy, and I was never a football player, so no changes in that front
The longer a person is in dialysis the chances that the kidney transplant will be succesful diminish, this is why it is so important to try to get a kidney as soon as possible when someone has kidney failure. Being in dialysis is extremely hard, by donating my kidney not only did I potentially add years to my recipient’s life but I improved his quality of life tremedously
except for making sure I drink plenty I have not had to make any changes, I exercise regularly and eat healthy,
Oh. I do not exercise regularly, and I do not eat healthy, and I sometimes forget to drink all day (except beer of course).
In fact, I just made myself a grilled cheese, which I made properly on a pan with plenty of margarine. There was no butter available.
@ popa: “This is simply the fact. Once you donate a kidney, you are not supposed to do any contact sports, and there are all sorts of other lifestyle changes as well. Ask your doctor.”
sometimes facts are distorted or in this case, it may be that this fact only applies to a small percentage of donors. As seen above, there are a number of donors who are back to themselves with no change and i’m sure there are more.
@health: “I am a medical professional, in spite of what some posters here have said about me. You can take my opinion as a prof. or as anon. poster -it’s up to you. We in the medical profession don’t formulate opinions from one case.
I have some serious doubts on which is safer. If I were you, I’d discuss this with a Rov who is knowledgable in medicine before proceeding. You can mention to him my doubts and let him ask top Nephrologists their opinion. “
I didnt know you were in the medical field, this changes the way i understand your response. I definitely would discuss with a rav before i do anything. thanks
I am a nurse and have seen patients who have donated kidneys. There are definitely restrictions and lifestyle changes put on someone once they donate a kidney. Before someone would donate a kidney I would advise them to speak to their doctor, who knows them medically.
allnighter-
I was not given any restrictions or lifestyle changes, except to maintain a healthy weight and exercise, which is a lifestyle everyone should aspire to, since you are so sure of your statement please specify exactly which are these.
Before a person can donate a kidney you have to undergo extensive medical tests, both physical and psychological. You are assigned a team of doctors which is completely different from the recipients team, because they want to make sure that this medical team has your best interest in mind, and they should not be biassed to the best interest of the recipient, and until the morning of the surgery I could have still changed my mind, there was absolutely no pressure for me to go thru with this.
I have yet to meet or read an article written by a donor who regrets having giving the gift of life to another human being….
And yes I discussed this with my Rav, and my son’s Rebbe, who happens to also be a doctor….and both of them were very supportive of my decision
And I am also a card carrying member of HOD (Halachic Organ Donation), as well as a regular donor to the NY Blood Center, and I have been in the Bone Marrow Registry since 1990….
from the university of wisconsin school of medicines public health website:
“Kidney donation, most often, does not change your present lifestyle. It does not change the length of your life or increase your risk of getting kidney disease. It does not interfere with a woman’s ability to have children. You will not need to change your diet or take additional medicines. The other kidney will grow and take over the work of both kidneys.”
You will not need to change your diet or take additional medicines.
But Caracas Chick was told she needs to eat healthy, make sure to drink properly, and exercise.
That may or may not be a change for some people.
popa-
I was eating healthy and exercising before I donated my kidney, so there was no change for me….
I am talking from my personal experience, unlike some of the posts here which are from what they think or have heard, but have no way of substantiating…
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