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Are you makpid on shkia for mincha. If yes, do u still daven an hour after with the satmar and skeverers?
Yes, No. But why would one answer yes and yes?
“But why would one answer yes and yes?”
??????, ??????.
(It’s not my answer; it’s what one could answer.)
The MB specificly discusses this. He says one should be Makpid even if you hold like Rabbanu Tam.
(I apologize that I can’t remember the actual Marr’a Makom).
Shkia? Some condition in the sky. Far away. Don’t know. Maybe ask eclipse!
Daas,
That’s actually not as easy as it sounds. Most people either hold of Rabbeinu Tam’s definition of Shkia or they don’t. Some are Machmir on Shabbos not to do Melacha, but otherwise it’s usually not just a Chumra.
I do know of a reasoning that if you are Davenning along with those who are permissively Davenning, your Teffila can sort of hop along.
I’ll daven at the RT zman if necessary, but really try to make it by 30. (so I have a safety margin)
But I really get a laugh out of the way Flatbush folks flip, when I ask them “where can I find a minyan for mincha” at 20 min. past shkiya (knowing full well, I can find one at Landau’s)
Daas,
That’s actually not as easy as it sounds. Most people either hold of Rabbeinu Tam’s definition of Shkia or they don’t. Some are Machmir on Shabbos not to do Melacha, but otherwise it’s usually not just a Chumra.
I’m not sure how easy it sounded, but I’ll explain; if you hold like ?”? ????? ????, you might still try to daven before the earlier ?????. If you hold like the ??????, you can’t rely on the later ?????.
Yes, of course. It’s just that it’s usually not the case.
I never took a poll 🙂
I was answering real-brisker’s question about how could the answers to the OP’s questions be yes and yes.
Gavra-at-Work; the Mishna Berura, indeed discusses the proper time for davening Mincha and Maariv. He concludes by saying that anyone can freely choose to daven Mincha before the Sh’kia or after. Or, daven Maariv at an early Z’man (when three Medium size stars are visible.) or Rabeinu Taam. He stipulates, however, that you can’t daven late Mincha and early Maariv.
I daven before shkia. It helps that there are two mincha gedola minyanim at my college but at times I have had to stop in the middle of the street and find a wall to face.
I just saw this thread and permit me to say that there is a major misconception in the whole thread. Whether you “daven” mincha before or after the “shkiah” has nothing to do with Rabbeinu tam’s shittah or the geonim’s shittah.
It has to with whether you can “daven” mincha till night or not. PLEASE check shulchan aruch “siman 233-se’if 1” and the remo.
Nowhere is there a mention of Rabbeinu Tam or the geonim-which really has to do when is nightfall.
What is commonly/ colloqually referred to as ????? is “sunset”.
not the Halachic ?????
To tidy up my tidying
The machlokes of the rabbeinu Tam & Geonim is
when is shkia Geonim at “sunset”
R”T 58 1/2 min after “sunset” (subject to machlokes)
??? ??? ??? ????
after which is ??? ???????, ???? ????
Everyone davens by “their” shkiah, the question is when do you hold shkia is? People that daven by Rabeinu Tam (like my husband) beleive that that’s when shkia is.
before shekia shnia (Tzais). Check!!! IMHO u don’t know what you are
talking about. Tzais is not shekia shnia
The span os ??? ?????? IS 3/4 0f 18 min(generally accepted MIL )
with the greatest respect to all posters, the shulchan aruch and the remo discuss when mincha is prayed, whether we can wait till “tsais” or not-when it becomes night. the time of mincha has nothing to do with rabbeinu tam or geonim times.they are concerned about how much after sunset does night fall. there is a ‘second’ shkiah concept but it is not mentioned in shulchan aruch and rabbeinu tam’s zman does not appear in this siman.
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