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well seeing as im becomeing of age to marry…(not yet so save the emails :P) ive been paying more and more attention to the subject and something keeps bothering me. i keep reading threads and hearing people talk about shidduch crises and kolel vs. no kolel…working vs. no working…and i dont know maybe im wrong about this, but doesnt it seem a bit too…industrialized? i mean (people please tell me from experience as i have no actual data on this) do you people walk into a shadchan and ask them for “a girl from x type family who will allow me to sit in kolel for x years and who will work to support the family?”
ive been giving thought to what i would say to a shadchan when teh time comes and to be honest…i dont care so much about the financial or logistical details as much as i care about finding someone to marry who i would actually LIKE to spend my life with. i dont want that to be incidental. so if a shadchan asked me what i want all id say was “a girl with XY and Z interests, preferrably smart” none of the financial strings…
what do i want in life? nothing much. a family. thats basically it. i dont care what i work as i dont care what she works as…i dont care if her parents are whatever…i just want someone who i will want to spend my life with. someone who i would OTHERWISE want to spend my life with. what i mean is…assume i met this person outside of teh shidduch context i would be friends with her (well not really…i dont have any female friends..this is hypothetical)
i may be wrong…like i said i have no experience with the whole shidduch thing…enlighten me. what did you people tell your shadchanim?
Depending on the circle you’re in, much of the answers to the questions you pose will be relayed by and flavored by, your parents.
So while you might want one thing, the shadchan will hear something totally different.
Speak to your parents to be sure they know what you really want.
sometime I just want to answer that I dont know anymore what I want. show me a guy and ill tell you if you should redt it. its hard to talk when its all theoretical
Sorry to hear that, but glad to hear you’re ready to take the initaitive. I’m re-posting (with some minor editing) something I wrote yesterday (in case you did’nt see it)
No matter what your “brand” you can do your homework and find the person that is right for you. Once you know what you want, setting the ball in motion is easy. Don’t be held hostage by the “system”. Talk to the Rov (and his Rebbetizn) that you’re affiliated with and tell them what you seek. You’d be surprised at what comes across their desk.
And if that does not yield results, talk to another Rov / Rebbetizn that is from a similar shul / background. Networking is the key to success.
Its my personal bias, but I put very little faith in professional shadchanim. Unless you are sitting on a major money pile, you’ll have a tough time getting noticed. Don’t burn any bridges, but don’t hold your breath either.
You’re attitude and optimisim is rare and refreshing. You’ll go far, and will make a great spouse. You are truly the bomb!
One thing you do need to think about and act on now, is start being consistent about where you daven, and if you’re out of yeshiva, where you learn at night.
Nothing says more about a person than predictability and visibility. From what you’ve said about your relationship with your parents, putting down roots in a specific place will help you overcome any negative vibes people may have (and trust me, they will have them).
Prove them wrong by showing how stable you have been over the next few years.
Oh, and a word about looks. When the connection is right, you will see the looks take a serious back seat to the other considerations. Be mindful of the way you dress as far as being neat. Labels mean little, so don’t get hung up on that. Put your best foot forward and let your personality do the talking for you.
“sometime I just want to answer that I dont know anymore what I want. “
I once answered this question to a shadchas as “a pulse”.
Marriage is not about marrying someone who has interests X, Y, and Z like yourself. Marrying is about building a bayis neemen byisroel that will be a Torah home serving Hashem. You do not need to share the same general interests with your spouse to do so.
Huh? Because someone doesn’t share your hobbies and interests, you have no desire to spend time with that person? That sounds vain and coming from non-Torah values. Do you reject being friends with people who don’t share your X, Y, and Z interests also?
bombmaniac, Don’t feel it’s necessary to do anything through a shadchan. It’s good to have people to talk to though, as you never know where the girl you want may come from. As bpt said, networking is the key to success. You seem responsible and outgoing, so if you feel comfortable about it, why not try to find a girl yourself? Speak to people, do some searching, even online. The fact is, unfortunately, that someone from a difficult family situation may have to work harder at finding a match. I know this because I’m in the same boat. It’s a shame, because a lot of people in our situations are so nice, caring, responsible, and giving, and all other people look at is: Oooh, dead parent, divorced parents, OTD brother, sister with medical problems, no money…
Bomb –
I can relate to much of what you say about yourself, as I was in some of that scene when I was post school. I had a past I needed to put behind me and by staying very visible and in a stable shul, I was able to silence my critics.
One comment about compatibilty with your spouse: Its important that you share a common vision, but its also important that you each have somethings that you do apart (example: You play softvball, she takes art classes) so you do not stifle each other, and do not become a barrier between each others friends.
Which is not to say, you need to take separate vacations, but a day every now and then apart will be of great benefit to both of you.
Also, if you get offers to go to someone’s house for a Shabbos meal, take them up on the offer, and where practical, daven at the shul of your host. Having you seen on the outside will boost your visibility. Everyone has a niece, a neigbor, a babysitter, ect, and you never know where the promising lead will come from.
Dear Bombmaniac,
I’m sorry to hear that you’ve had to experience so many difficulties at such a young age. In a few years you’ll be at the age of marriage and probably be expected to marry but you should make sure that you’ll be psychologically ready.
Most people did not have dream parents or religious ones. But. We have to be thankful to our parents that they clothed and fed us and to recognize that we would have had no existence if it hadn’t been for them. Our situation could truly have been worse. Some of our issues with our parents will last a lifetime but if we try to be the “one who takes the high road” then we end up being happier people. A happy person will be a stable married person. A spouse does not substitute for the relationships that you might be craving for right now.
My suggestion for now is to find opportunities to help other people. This will make you more attractive for shidduchim prospects. Right now you got a lot going against you in terms of being “prime” material. I used to think that my situation was hopeless in this regard but in the end Hashem took care of me in His own special way. He of course will take care of you. Just pretend that you’re Rabbi Akiva (or Rabbi Zusha – one of those) in the story where the village will not accept him. He only learns much later why he couldn’t be in the mainstream and he sees that Hashem saved his life.
Always have a positive attitude. Put up with your Rabbis if you feel sometimes that they don’t truly understand you. Don’t get frustrated and if Chas v’ Shalom you’re made to wait until you’re 30 to get the proper partner just be grateful to Hashem for your very special existence in His Creation.
You really have nothing to worry about but you do have a lot of work to do until you completely grow up.
Best of Luck,
LSH
“if Chas v’ Shalom you’re made to wait until you’re 30”
“you do have a lot of work to do until you completely grow up.”
I agree with the 2nd line, but 30?!
Bomb – if you’re working at a decent job (part or full time) and are on track towards a full time job, you will do most of the growing up you need to do by the time you are 22-24. The rest of the “growing up” you / your wife need to do will take place over the next 20-30 years.
Don’t for one minute accept or contemplate the 30 year mark. If you are focused (and it sounds like you are) you will be ready to get married sooner than you think. There is nothing wrong with being young. Its also wise, (once you are ready to start dating) to look for someone who is within a year or two of your age. That way, (with your work experince) you’re on the same maturity level as your spouse.
Set your goal for your early to mid-20s and you will b’ezras hashem see solid results.
I second bpt.
bpt- I agree with what you said but what do you mean about marrying someone your own age so they are on the same maturity level as you are? did you mean that as a general statement or just to bomb?
bomb- you have a lot more going for you than you think. Keep up the great work. Your maturity and smart insight is amazing.
” did you mean that as a general statement or just to bomb? “
Both.
Bomb has the advantage that he is working, and that his personal life situation has (or will) force him to grow up sooner than most young men.
I also feel this way as a general statement. If a bocher of 24 thinks his peer is a 19 year old, we have a major problem in our values system.
If he does not feel capable of looking a woman of his age bracket eye to eye, its because he feels inferior.
And that is his fault.
I am young but I am very deep and logic (can get emotional too but whatever) and I find that among my friends I dont feel like they really understand me all that well
I can relate to you, adorable. I have very few people in my life that fully understand what my life is like. And I’ve always been comfortable around people a bit older than me. I would want to marry a girl at least my age, and preferably a little older.
Bpt, I don’t think you can make a general statement about what age a person should look for in a prospective spouse.
MP- I also have lots of older friends for that reason and younger ones (not tooting my own horn its very hard to feel like you are too mature for yourself! its nothing I did right its just the way I was born) I know of a few ppl who believe in letting girls get married a couple years out of high school because that way they are more mature and have more life experience. its funny because I find that I’m even more attracted to guys who are older as I find them more stable rather than young boys right out of yeshiva.
” I don’t think you can make a general statement about what age a person should look for in a prospective spouse. “
Perhaps not as a deadline, but surely as a goal.
Condsider that under 20 is too young (boys AND girls) and mid-30s is kinda late, the middle 20s seem about right for a target.
I’m also working with the premise that the couple expects to meet their own cost of living expenses, and since it takes 5-10 years to reach a point in your carear that you are making a good living, starting younger (but not too young) is better.
Which is not to say, that if you are 26, you should give up. But for someone 19-21, now is the time to start formulating a goal and how you expect to acheive that goal.
People don’t plan to fail.. they fail to plan.
Adorable –
Are you sharing a sign on name with someone? I’m pretty sure yesterday you implied you’re a guy.
Your quote from yesterday:
“I am single because he just didnt come around ( no not mr perfect but mrs perfect for me!) “
Whats the deal? Which one are you looking for, and which one are you aiming to be?
BPT- I did? where was that? I’m a gal
do you think a guy would have a name “adorable?”
That’s what I thought. I guess I mis-read your comment about ( no not mr perfect but mrs perfect for me!) “
OK, your back on the right side of the fence. (and yeah, I thought Adorable was a funny name for a guy, but who am I to point fingers)
adorable is not a guy and never pretended to be one
bpt- I dont really get what you misunderstood but I’m happy that its all worked out. thank you 80 for proving it for me.
Explaining 30. I was saying worst case scenario. It’s up to Hashem when the marriage will happen. What can happen when a person starts seeing their friends marry and they don’t is it can be discouraging. This might cause resentment in the person who’s tried really hard to lift themselves out of their situation. There’s a lot that can happen along the way and a person must have firm belief that Hashem is looking out for him and has in mind the best life for him.
I ALWAYS SAY THAT I WANT THE RIGHT ONE AT THE RIGHT TIME. NO ONE WANTS THE RIGHT ONE AT THE WRONG TIME OR THE WRONG ONE AT THE RIGHT TIME. MAY WE HEAR SIMCHOS!!!
mod 80 asked for it so he got it. now that joke is over!
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