Shakespeare

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  • #2086467
    Zaphod Beeblebrox
    Participant

    Many have pointed to Shakespeare’s okay the merchant of Venice in which a Jew is the villain as proof that he was an anti semite. However, I’ve heard that in IRL the Jew was in fact the hero of the story, and Shakespeare made him into the villain only because he knew that in those anti Semitic times no one would show to a play in which the jew was the good guy, and that he was not in fact an anti Semite. Has anyone else heard this or have any sources that prove this?

    #2086582
    ujm
    Participant

    The lady doth protest too much.

    #2086642

    Shakespeare lived in the period when Jews were not allowed in England (1280s-1650s), so Jews were probably just a theoretical concept for him and his audience.

    #2086667
    Reb Eliezer
    Participant

    People get influenced from the times they live in.

    #2086668
    Gadolhadorah
    Participant

    I tend to agree with the many critics who contend that “sympathetic” readings of Shylock are a post-Holocaust invention. There is a bit or irony in contemporary audiences who only read Shylock sympathetically because reading him any other way, in light of the horrors of the Shoah, would reflect poorly on the reader. Defenders of Merchant usually offer two compelling arguments: Shakespeare’s somewhat sympathetic treatment of Shylock, and his mockery of the Christian characters. I just don’t buy either argument as credible, then or now.

    #2086677
    commonsaychel
    Participant

    There was always a ting of Anti Semitim in the classics, take for example Mark Twain and concerning the Jews, that piece can be interpreted both ways.

    #2086683
    ujm
    Participant

    CS: The most important question here is we need your assessment as to whether the OP is a troll?

    #2086690
    Reb Eliezer
    Participant

    Shylock also said that if they pierce us don’t we bleed.

    #2086725
    ujm
    Participant

    Do any mainstream Mesivtas today still teach Shakespeare?

    #2086750

    Do any kids read any of world classics, whether at school or not? And if yes, what is your secret?!

    #2086754
    Marxist
    Participant

    I think Torah Vodaath does, though I’m not 100% sure.

    #2086923
    smerel
    Participant

    >>>However, I’ve heard that in IRL the Jew was in fact the hero of the story, and Shakespeare made him into the villain only because he knew that in those anti Semitic times no one would show to a play in which the Jew was the good guy, and that he was not in fact an anti Semite

    I’ve seen the claim that the Jew was the hero of the story and Shakespeare changed the roles is a Marcus Lehman. I question if the story ever happened to begin with that anyone had any role in it.

    As far as Shakespeare himself is concerned the excuse sounds like all the Germans who said after the war “we only members of the Nazi party for business purposes” And in the case of the Germans some of them really didn’t actively do anything other than belong to the Nazi party whereas Shakespeare personally wrote anti-Semitic works

    #2086925
    maskildoresh
    Participant

    Dirk Gently and Arthur Dent were not anti semetic.

    Faulkner probably was.

    #2086953

    what are world classics that we think Jewish kids should/could read and which ones they should not?
    keep in mind not just what is talked about in current America – as a lot of classics (such as Mark Twain) is already banned in USA.

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