Questions About Monsey's Litvish/Chasidish Sociological Mix

I wouldn’t recommend moving to Monsey if you have these issues. The Chassidish community there is spreading extremely quickly. It is also over-crowded. It wasn’t built with the infrastructure of a city, but it now has the population density of one.

Monsey Yid, have you ever heard of SINAAS CHINAM?

I actually wrote a whole long essay detailing different areas of Monsey and their levels of saturation with chassidim, until I realized how useless it was. Chassidim are people, they are a big part of life in Monsey, if you don’t like it move elsewhere, etc. etc. Unless you want to live in New Hempstead or Pomona and only shop in Wesley Kosher your whole life (not even Costco or the Palisades Mall), you should probably look into someplace else to live. This is not meant antagonistically. It is meant realistically, the perspective of someone who has lived here her whole life.

rabbiofberlin: Though you can’t really functionally get to one from the other except by car, and the Zishe’s parking lot is a war zone. However, as it’s a war zone with the best vanilla rugalech you will ever taste (made by chassidim, at that), it is pretty much worth it even if you come out with a few scars :).

There are, though, bigger or smaller concentrations of chassidim in different outer areas. If the post office calls it Monsey (except the Concord area) then you can expect to find more chassidim. Spring Valley, either yeshivish (if New Hempstead) or chassidish (not the greatest neighborhood anyway, however). Wesley Hills, Pomona, Forshay- probably not. But even in these areas, unless you only shop in WK, which is impossible as the other stores are MUCH better, you will bump into chassidim. (I assume yosef isn’t interested in Airmont as all the nearby shopping is in the 306/59 area.)

Also, you mentioned something like a shteibel on every corner. I assume that you realize that Monsey is stretched out. You need a car, you may never see your neighbor two doors down, etc. You can pretty much pick where to go.

The very essence of the thought process behind the OP, is pure sinas chinam.

Flatbush has a strong Chasidish constituency that is integrated into the fabric of the frum neighborhood longside the Litvish presence. Boro Park has a notable Litvish constituency (even greater than the Flatbush Chasidim) completely integrated with the Chasidim.

The main difference being that while Boro Park is nearly completely frum, Flatbush has a large goyish presence. Which is, essentially, what you seem to like.

So perhaps a recommendation of moving to Little Italy or Little Manila might be more up your alley.

VERY different. The difference is that Flatbush is big enough to support its own stores, which cater to its misnagdish community. Monsey has pretty much one main Jewish shopping district, the 306/59 area, where EVERYONE goes (and I mean everyone. Like I said, WK is NOT enough). There is one Costco where EVERYONE goes. There is the Palisades Mall where EVERYONE goes. There are a few isolated shopping centers, like the WK one and that one on Saddle River Road, but those are not enough to survive on, and like aspiringrabbi said, chassidim own most of the best places to shop around here.

On any given day, you may not feel it as much. You might buy a nice house on Sherri Lane or McNamara Road, go to a nice litvishe shul, have nice litvishe neighbors, and hop over to WK to get a loaf of bread- but if you want to do anything more interesting than that, like drive your kid to practically any school except YSV Girls, Bas Mikra or Chofetz Chaim, or eat anywhere except Al Di La or Bubba’s, or any of the thousand and one things most people need to do, you’ll have to bump into chassidim.

It depends on whether that’s a dealbreaker for you. If it is, I gotta say that that surprises me a bit, but that’s your business, not mine.

yosef999- From the way you’re writing, DON’T move to Monsey! I’ve been there and IT”S HAUNTED! they, (the men with the sideburn hairlocks) lurk at street corners and WILL pounce upon you! They will cross the street right in front of your car and even knock into your car. knock on your car window. They will stick their thumb out at you and knock and mumble something in yiddish. (my friend told me one of them said “I will eat you”)

seriously, calm down.

If you wake up late, you can still go to Viznitz or Satmar

If you get a flat, Chaveirim will fix it for you

If you have taste for good food, you will find yourself in their takeouts once in a while

If you are hurt, they will be on Hatzlah saving you

If you cannot afford shabbos meals, they will deliver it to you

I had a friend that went to camp and those that went with him came from all backgrounds – Yeshivish, Chassidish, non-religious and everything in-between.

The only thing they had in common was that they were Jews when they entered the camp. Upon leaving the camp – they had 2 things in common – 1) they were still Jews and 2) they had either no or very few relatives left.

They were all of different backgrounds yet they shares bunkhouses and bunkbeds. Sadly, many of them shares the same “showers”.

I live in the perfect neighborhood for you. My neighbors are so anti anyone who isnt as yeshivish/litvish as them. They did get some people in my neighborhood to conform to their type(put on hat, wear white shirts..). They will not give you an aliya if you have the wrong havarah. They actually had a meeting discussing ways to insure chasidim dont move here. They failed since a few blocks away shtreimels moved in. I am ready to move out, do you want to buy my house? Maybe a new person like you would have great ideas how to keep the others out.

By the way, I am part of the others they want to keep out. The problem is that I was here first.

We used to be just Yidden. When we return to just being Yidden we become whole again. The question itself separates us… If you can’t see that then you are more assimilated than you’d like to admit.

take a chill pill

I lived in Monsey as a bochur for a few years and continued to visit many times over the years and I always marveled myself at the pleasant natural integration of the litvish and chassidish elements. In so many shuls, you’ll see all types davening together. It made a strong impression on me then and I always recall it fondly.

I don’t like getting into specifics about a specific group or place here. It’s a great place to live if you need to be close to the city. But property taxes are through the roof.

Jewishly, you’ll have everything you need. I have found that the more I deemphasized the groups- I have become more enriched from benefitting from all what each has to offer to our Avodas Hashem. Monsey, for me, was the beginning of that approach.

Yosef999 go to Passaic…BTU… Ask for Rabbi Zupnik… Bring your posting … Talk with him… He is one wonderful Rabbi who will be able to help you. Just spiff balling here but I am wondering if you are really interested in learning or if you came here to separate Yidden.

I think many people are misunderstanding the OP.

I’ve often gone to SeaGate or similar new mother homes after having a baby. They are predominently used by the chassidishe community. I am yeshivishe and feel comfortable shmuzing with all the ladies, yeshivishe, modern or very chasidishe. With roommates however, I felt the most comfortable with those who are yeshivishe like me.

When you live somewhere, especially if there’s close quarters, and the majority around you have different minhogim, especially when their minhogim are more stringent than yours, it’s hard to feel comfortable and happy.

One may tend to feel inferior or just feel like an outsider because everyone knows each other, they share a lot of “Jewish geography” together, send their children to the same schools, share similar outlooks and experiences. What’s very fancy clothing, homes, or food to you, may be ordinary for them. Your day to day experiences and expectations in your role as a husband/wife/employee may be very different. You may feel uncomfortable with a style of dress that is different from yours.

Monsey seems to be the best location geographically for the OP, but he wants to feel comfortable and “in his element”, there’s nothing wrong with that.

Probably, besides for a Shabbos visit, I’d advise a touring drive around town.

Hatzlocho.

With regard to my comment about comming for shabbos, I didn’t realize that YWN doesn’t allow any links and I included my email address in the post. you can get my email address from our website. its pomonashul then add dot com. I spelled it out so it won’t get removed

yosef999: If someone wrote (to paraphrase your OP) “I have nothing against blacks, however I can not live with them” and then proceeded to inquire to make sure there weren’t too many blacks in a prospective neighborhood, would you have a problem with that statement? Or do you only have a problem with Jews?

Wk613, BP is nowhere near completely frum.there is a large Chinatown and 13 ave beyond 60 st is mostly not Jewish.

What if HaKodesh Barachu sent him to tell us we are not who we think we are.

First he insulted me, then he insulted my friends, then my community. Now I am wondering if there is more to his dribble than just dribble… Maybe its a good time we all take an accounting of our behavior, our family and friends and our community as a whole.

Assuming he is a Yid for the purposes of this discussion, we should be embarrassed that a fellow Yid would not want to live with certain parts of the tzibur.

And if he’s not a Yid, then how disgusting have we become that Ribono Shel Olam had to send this person to tell us?

When you get deep into Monsey for sake of discussion, we are different than a Yid who is coming from the outside… We share the same “religion” but they are not us nor are we them… Even though we carry a piece of the same neshama. We don’t want outsiders who carry the virus with them, this is why we have Ohr Samayach, whereas we heard the Rosh Yeshiva say the Ohr Samayach is not a Yeshiva but an emergency room for Yidden … Yidden that want to come home.

We host bochurim from Ohr Samayach for Shabbos… We shed tears when they leave, you know how difficult it is to see a distressed neshama? If you don’t then try hosting these young men who have the tenacity to leave behind what they know to become like us and here we have someone telling us we are not the kind of people he wants to partner up with… How sad that is.

Just behave like a Jew. Practice “vahavtu l’reiachu kumuchu” (zeh klall gudol baTorah) and you’ll be accepted here. Ironic how you’re getting a taste of your own medicine.