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I’ve noticed that a lot of people on these forums misuse the word “troll.” Many here are predictably not very connected with mainstream internet culture, so this is understandable.
By the most traditional definition, when you call someone a troll, you’re actually saying they do not really believe what they are saying in their post. So, for example, responding to a post you consider misogynistic by saying, “so-and-so is trolling; he’s a known misogynist” is self-contradictory. Someone sharing an opinion that is legitimately their opinion is not trolling just because you don’t like it.
A real troll post would be like if, hypothetically, someone who recently made a bunch of anti-Chabad-meshichism posts wrote a post arguing that Rubashkin is moshiach. Hypothetically.
If you take the troll post seriously and yell at the troll, he laughs at you. If you take it seriously and AGREE with it, he laughs at you even more.
there are trolls who write posts for the sake of riling people up and causing machlokes regardless of their views.
Neville, this forum has its own slang, as Popa said to the Wikipedians (IRRC).
And of course some folks just say things that are so stupid, everyone assumes they are “trolling”….
In Internet slang, a troll is a person who sows discord on the Internet by starting quarrels or upsetting people, by posting inflammatory, extraneous, or off-topic messages in an online community (such as a newsgroup, forum, chat room, or blog) with the intent of provoking readers into an emotional response or of otherwise disrupting normal, on-topic discussion, often for the troll’s amusement. (Wikipedia)
So it is irrelevant if the troll believes what he writes or not.
“there are trolls who write posts for the sake of riling people up and causing machlokes regardless of their views.”
That’s not trolling. When David Duke publishes his Antisemitism, it’s not trolling; he really believes the stuff. It riles people up because he’s a jerk, not a troll.David Duke did not post for the sake of riiling people up. You mentioned the David Duke ilk in your post. I was mentioning others.
“Neville, this forum has its own slang”
Yes it does, but “trolling” is not CR specific slang. It’s a popular internet slang word which just happens to be misused a lot on this site.my only answer to that is that if you weren’t where you shouldn’t be it wouldn’t be bothering you.
Neville ChaimBerlin,
That’s not trolling. When David Duke publishes his Antisemitism, it’s not trolling; he really believes the stuff. It riles people up because he’s a jerk, not a troll.
Your definition is simply not correct. Using anti-Semites as an example like you did, an infamous neo-Nazi Web site makes itself a base for what it calls a “troll army” to attack prominent Jews in the media. The neo-Nazis on that site thus really do believe what they are saying, yet refer to themselves as trolls. Additionally, governments, organizations, and political factions are increasingly resorting to online trolling as a means to advance their agendas or products.
I understand that you may be concerned about someone with honestly held controversial views who unintentionally disrupts a forum or engenders highly emotional responses being labeled a troll perhaps unfairly, or people using troll as an ad hominem to attack those with differing positions, but your redefinition of the term is much too narrow. I would broaden the definition of troll to mean someone on an online forum who attempts to provoke, surreptitiously influence (e.g., caution trolls, or sockpuppetry), or cause pain, regardless of what his/her true views are.
Yes it does, but “trolling” is not CR specific slang. It’s a popular internet slang word which just happens to be misused a lot on this site.
I’ve typically seen it used correctly here, and with a few exceptions, those identified as trolls are usually rightly identified.
“Trolling” isn’t CR-specific slang, but in CR slang, the word has a different meaning.
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One of the definitions of troll on Google is a “person who deliberately makes a provocative or inflammatory post online”. It has nothing to do with if you believe in the content of your post or not.
Neville
According to your definition
How are you ever supposed to know the real beliefs of an anonymous internet poster? The label of troll must be left up to the interpretation of the reader(s)Neville, the problem starts when he tells you that he always lies.
I understand your frustration with this. Most people use the word against anyone who says anything they disagree with. And it’s an insulting word. What’s a troll. It’s saying you are a wierd, icky creature because you disagree with me.
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