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I work in a public school, and every morning the pledge of alleigance is recited over the loudspeaker.I normally dont stand and put my hand over my heart, because at that time of day Im in my own room by myself, however when I have my students in the room I will stand and recite the pledge with them half heartedly. The reason I do this is because if these kids are around, I dont want them to say something about us jews being unpatriotic, and in a public school its mandatory to recite it. While I know we should have hakaras hatov for religious freedom in this country…is there any issues with frum jews stating the pledge of alliegance with our hands on our hearts? when I am around my students, I dont say the entire thing, and I usually think to myself something along the lines of as a jew, this is not my primary obligation…….
I’m confised by your reasoning. If being Jewish excuses you from being patriotic than you should be proud to refrain from doing patriotic acts. If it doesn’t excuse you than you should be as patriotic as the rest of your school.
I don’t know of any halachic issues regarding placing your hand on your heart.
You aren’t swearing to anyone or anything.
I have been at many gatherings for political or chizuk reasons. And at many of these gatherings the pledge of allegiance was recited. I am proud to say that the Rabbonim in the crowd did the pledge as everyone else in the room, without a question. Why would you have a problem, are you not a citizen? Are you not proud to be living in this country?
Is there anything in the pledge that you find offensive or against our religion?
aries: Which Rabbonim? The OP asked a question, why rip them apart???
I’ve never had to pledge, but have been present when the star spangled banner is played. I stand, but do not remove my cap. Its at a ball game, and many people don’t even stand, so the cap is not an issue. If it were, I’d remove it (but not the yarmulka, of course).
The pledge text was altered to remove g-d from it, so you’re safe on that issue too. I don’t see the issue with the pledge or the hand/heart part.
The pledge text was altered to remove g-d from it
Actually, the pledge was altered to *add* God, not remove Him. The original pledge did not have the words “under God.” It was added on June 14, 1954 by a joint resolution of Congress.
The Wolf
by showing them ur hakaras hatov to america u crate a kiddsh hashem- think of it this way- wat if u DIDNT do it- they would think- look, Jews think they;re ABOVE us…and thats wrong…we dont mean, need, or want that.
They’ve removed “under G-d”?
When did that happen, (I guess I missed it)?
– No wonder He left…
Houseofjava
I think you hit the nail on the head in the question. It most certainly is a case of showing hakoras hatov and I don’t beleive there is anything halachicly problematic with it.
bpt
you are right about g-d being removed, but that was for people who did not beleive. When g-d was in the pledge it was non denominational so there was also not a problem.
The Wolf is correct. G-d was *added* to the pledge. The pledge includes a reference to G-d.
That is a good thing.
At sporting events i remove my cap (not my yarmulke of course) hold my hand over my heart and mouth the words to the star spangled banner.
Jews are obligated to support the country they live in. Being patriotic is not just a nice thing, it is a chiyuv.
During graduation at the yeshiva I learned in, they play the national anthem. They ask everyone to stand and take off their hats while doing so.
Feif Un- AGREED!
Jews are obligated to support the country they live in. Being patriotic is not just a nice thing, it is a chiyuv.
I am as patriotic as they come, but where is this so-called “chiyuv” mentioned in Shulchan Aruch? (And I don’t mean paying taxes or following the law.)
I’m not sure exactly where it is in the SA, but there have been many instances where the Gedolei Hador have said a Jew is obligated to support his/her home country.
“Support” and “patriotic” are not synonymous.
And can you name some of the many Gedolim? And specifically what they said.
Growing up I went to a bais yaacov school and we always said the pledge of allegiance in the afternoon in english class and we stood and put our hand to our heart.
I know people who put up an american flag on the fourth of July and Memorial day. Also in my neighborhood we have a parade on Memorial day and I know frum people who join in marching and watching and waving flags. It is to show the goyim that even though we are jewish we still feel for america.
Growing up I went to a bais yaacov school and we always said the pledge of allegiance in the afternoon in english class and we stood and put our hand to our heart.
I know people who put up an american flag on the fourth of July and Memorial day. Also in my neighborhood we have a parade on Memorial day and I know frum people who join in marching and watching and waving flags. It is to show the goyim that even though we are jewish we still support the country we live in.
ive
The pledge:….One Nation under G-d indivisible with liberty and justice for all…
Did that change?
TBT, is that what I did? Maybe that’s the way you read it, it is not the way I wrote it? I was just asking a question not ripping anyone apart.
As citizens of this country to which we both contribute and take, in my opinion there is nothing wrong. We too were students of Rabbi Newhouse’s Z”L Bais Yakov and we did pledge each afternoon and sang the national anthem. It would be nice if todays children would know the words to the pledge and national anthem. One never knows when joining in such will show a Kiddush Hashem.
When one goes to obtain citizenship it is a requirement!
Really? I just Googled it, and you’re right; G-d is back in it. Maybe its optional, so you can use the text you’re comfortable with?
I cannot imagine a religious day school having their kids say g-d in the pledge.
Any Torah U’mesora folks out there?
Since we believe that dina d’malchusah dina, it would seem to me that Chazal believed hakoras hatov and respect should be show to our country of habitation. Saying the Pledge of Allegiance is a small price to pay for the freedoms which we enjoy in this country.
bpt: what is wrong with the word God? You know which One you mean and that should be the end of it.
we say it every day in history class! our teacher hung a falg in the back of the class
whats a falg? i hope its nothing alive.
whats a falg?
Reminds me of one of my favorite Calvin & Hobbes lines:
“I pledge allegiance to Queen Fragg and her mighty state of hysteria…”
The Wolf
I’ve seen the State of Hysteria many times? Anyone else been there? 😉
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