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Do you think its appropriate for parents to unexpectedly come visit married children at night???my in laws seem to think its fine to just ring the bell and come visit without calling first after 8. Opinions please
It’s fine unless the kids don’t like it.
Either tell them you don’t like it, or learn to live with it. It’s totally normal, so there’s no reason for them to think you don’t like it.
8:30?
Whether it’s socially accepted or not, you have
the right to object if you don’t like it.
It’s not fine, unless the kids like it. You should take it as a compliment that they think you like it.
No it is not accepted or acceptable.
Most respectful MILs would call first. What if you are not home for whatever reason. You dont need her asking about it the next time you meet. I think it’s an intrusion
if you feel its too often or they are interferinmg in your personal life then hint it to them to please call before coming.
a easy hint to tell them is “you & your wife have certain times of night when you go out shopping or to dinner etc… can you please call before coming to make sure we are home & not out?” i think this should be very easy to tell them & would not be insulting to them at all. everyone has needs to go out at night (rather its reasons above or for a Simcha etc…)
Your title said parents but your talking about in laws two different animals if it was your parents you wouldn’t mind but since you do mind TRY (not gonna be easy) to find a tactful way to tell them, don’t put your husband in the middle this is your issue.
I don’t ever visit my children without calling in advance.
It is very wrong for anyone to just show up at a married persons home after 8 PM. It doesn’t make a difference, whether it is parents, in-laws or friends. It is family time, bed time and very often couples need to go out. The Goq seems to think that the author would not have a problem would it be her/his parents, I think it is a problem either way. Mashiach Agent is correct, you can tell them ” we really appreciate that you stop by, but please call in advance, We really would like to make your visit comfortable, so we want to make sure it is a convenient time.
Parents should respect their kids privacy and should not just show up but should call first. I think the poster should ask her husband to speak to her parents and tell them how much they love when they visit but it would be better to call first.
If its your parents, its your spouse’s in laws, so its in laws in either case, which I regard as inappropriate.
it is DEFINITELY not acceptable, but you need to approach this issue with tact. first of all, you should be discussing this issue with your wife. make sure not to come across as if you are angry at her or don’t consider her relationship with her parents as important. then either you or your beloved wife should talk with your in-laws and respectfully explain that as a newly married (or not newly married, my DW and i had an issue with parents when our child was born and well meaning and excited grandparents did not understand our need for privacy) couple , privacy and space to build a relationship is needed and that a system should be made in regards to A) times they could visit you or B) times you could visit them. a phone call where you dont feel forced to say yes to a request to visit is a definite, as is your expression of gratitude to your mother-in-law (whether deserved or undeserved-it’s the accolade that counts) for raising your wife and for wanting to visit etc …
Also important is to ask someones advice, a rebbe or chosson teacher, to figure out the best way to resolve the issue. and if you don’t have one, get one now
So it’s acceptable to show up at a single person’s home after 8 pm uninvited?
They probably have nothing doing in their life and need you to fill that void.
Don’t stop you normal household activities because of them. Learn to ignore those people. I have an in-law that likes to converse when I’m trying to eat, especially Shabbat lunch. At first I tried to be polite, but after a number of years, I feel taken for granted and disrespected. I now just ignore the person until I’ve eaten.
That same in-law does almost nothing for my kids, but thinks that coming over and providing (unsolicited and unwanted) advice is helpful.
In any event, some people are takers, and you have to put up a boundary.
That is so cynical.
All I can say is that b”H many parents (in-law) actually like their children, and simply enjoy spending time with them.
MDG, you seem to be a taker. Since the in-laws isn’t giving you enough, in your opinion, you’re peeved at them.
When over, at least thank that in-law for giving you a wife. Without them she wouldn’t be here.
45 years ago we had to deal with this with my parents and in-laws.
We set the following rule: When you pull in our driveway and the living room shade is down, do NOT ring the bell. If the shade is up you are welcome to visit.
Taught the same rule to my married children.
Works fine in the land of single family homes. Not in apartment buildings.
I don’t think it’s proper for mishulachim to come at that point either.
Why would you care what our opinion is? What’s important is your opinion. If it makes you unhappy you need to deal with it. The question is, how unhappy does it make you? Some things are worth ignoring…it depends on you.
It’s OK if they’re still supporting you. Then you’re pretty much still a child.
I sincerely apologize for my rude and unfair comments above. I had a rough week last week (mostly my doing) and it showed here. I have to say that we were inviting, helpful, and generous to my in-law this past weekend as always.
Joseph, your comment to me was a well-needed slap in the face. TY.
DY, thank you for your criticism.
Back to the OP:
You need to set up some rules, like CTLAWYER did. It is not easy to speak to your parents like that. But if done respectfully and tactfully, they should understand and respect you point of view. Just don’t hold it inside too long or you might just blow up like I did above. Fortunately, I did it here and not at home.
Possibly set up times for them to come over, like a couple nights a week for various activities. That way you all can spend time together and there are no surprises.
People want to be wanted and needed. Perhaps that’s what they want. Maybe ask them for help with things or their opinion. Make them feel valued.
I agree that it’s hard and perhaps uncomfortable but very often it’s in your own perception of things. So you for example might be embarrassed if your house isn’t in perfect order or your kids have chocolate all over their faces, while your in-laws might feel perfectly comfortable with the “mess” and love seeing your kids in this funny state. And if it doesn’t happen too often your kids will survive a slightly later bed time and benefit from spending time with their grandparents.
So examine your true reasons of discomfort, it may be you actually need your privacy at that hour, or perhaps you feel you must be the perfect in-law and bake a cake and do a major clean-up before having them over. If it’s the latter, the more you accept them unexpectedly the easier it’ll get down the road. Hatzlacha!
Glad to hear it was just a rough spot and not a bad relationship.
You don’t have to open the door. If they are insistent, say “Osek B’Mitzva Patur Min HaMItzva”. If they still don’t get it, well I guess people do have clueless parents and/or in-laws.
No, no, no! I don’t visit ANYONE at night without calling to see if it’s convenient, so why would it be OK to do that to my children? Husbands and wives need time alone, and 8 pm and later might just be that time. Call first, and see if they are receptive to a sudden visit. Don’t get upset if the answer is, “Now is not a good time.” If your idea is you want to see the aineklach – offer to babysit so they can go out.
PS…the child of those parents should be the one to set the boundaries with the intrusive parents. Never have it come from the in-law child. Back up your spouse and suggest an alternative visiting time.
Don’t visit during the day either without calling. At least not in the first year.
You have to communicate with them that you don’t like it. If they persist on coming, don’t let them in. Make sure they don’t have a key to let themselves in, even if that means changing your locks.
In a marriage, your privacy is extremely important, and you need to respect that yourself for others to respect it.
What about grandparents; should they be put in their place as well, if necessary?
It’s not about putting people in their place.
99.9% of normal parents know not to come visit on their own without calling at night. You can safely assume that if these parents are doing this to their kids, they lack a certain basic sense of privacy and proper behavior.
People who lack a basic sense of propriety need to be told politely and firmly what the limits are, and then you have to stick to them.
The child of those parents should be the one to set the boundaries with the intrusive parents. Never have it come from the in-law child.
Gentlemen, behold wisdom.
Comlink-X, thank you.
agreed. also if it is an inconvenient night why not ignore the bell?
Well, it’s harder to hide all those E10 video games, PG-rated movies, and rock ‘n’ roll music if the parents come unannounced. That’s how it has always been, from childhood to adulthood. 😛
Some people are persistent, especially if they see the kids’ car in the driveway. They will continue to knock, ring the bell, and call until there is a response. So not answering the door is not a great plan. I know someone who called 911 when her kids who were home didn’t answer. A bit extreme, to say the least, but it happens. Boundaries have to be set, in a respectful, loving manner, at a face to face sit down.
Of course, the correct answer is that it depends on the couple.
Look, my in-laws stop by without calling first. So does my sister – and I stop by her place unannounced at times too – but that’s because we have that sort of close relationship. Others may not have it.
By all means, if a couple asks that you call first before coming over, then they’re wishes should be respected — and it doesn’t matter if it’s parents, sisters or brothers, in-laws or even adult children who no longer live in the house.
The Wolfr
I feel sorry for you. For inlaws to violate a married couple’s private time — the penalty should be Heavenly death. If they refuse to stop or get offended — they should die.
I have seen marriages and engagements end because of parental interefence. I have no mercy for such dispicable creatures.
Personally, I am not married but I have seen this many times with others. I will tell any lady’s parents upfront will they respect our privacy or interfere in our lives. If that offends them, well, that answers my question, doesn’t it?
In your situation, if they make an issue, would have prayed they die. Show no mercy to those who want to murder your marriage and shalom bayis. And I think a measure if their Gan Edan should be transfered to you for recompense. Of course, it goes without saying, no children you have will be named after them.
Excellence, I vote that post overreaction of the year.
And there have been some huge overreactions lately…
I will tell any lady’s parents upfront will they respect our privacy or interfere in our lives. If that offends them, well, that answers my question, doesn’t it?
Not really. If I would ask you, for example, something like “Will you refrain from chewing my dog’s chew toy?” or “Will you be sure not to shoot the principals of the kids’ schools?”, would you not be offended?
I will be polite and nice and diplomatic … but I will discuss the matter all the same. Upfront at the beginning.
Gents, I lost an engagement from this. I will be making sure they know me and I know them.
BTW>>>>
I posted earlier with our solution to this problem.
A good part of my practice is family law. This is not a Jewish problem, it is a universal problem. Many marriages have suffered from unscheduled parental visits and interference in the younger generation’s lives.
An earlier post made reference to situations where the parents are still supporting the married couple. Financial support does not mean that the parent has the right to intrude physically at will.
Each member of the couple must voice concerns to his/her own parents and establish working rules/parameters for visits.
I know someone whose inlaws wanted to make a deal about having a milah inside a hospital, not in a shule. When I say being polite but firm to made their business, this is the sort of idiocy I was thinking of. Todate, my friend has had only girls.
Also, when you’re in your mid-20s you’re more polite and effusive. When you’re in your late 30s . . . the nonsense leash you tolerate from monkeys is a great deal shorter. Not after that much life experience. No one tells you what to do. No.
“An earlier post made reference to situations where the parents are still supporting the married couple. Financial support does not mean that the parent has the right to intrude physically at will.”
I made that earlier post. It was a joke. Sorry if that wasn’t clear
“Also, when you’re in your mid-20s you’re more polite and effusive. When you’re in your late 30s . . . the nonsense leash you tolerate from monkeys is a great deal shorter. Not after that much life experience. No one tells you what to do. No. “
Pretty much agree. But I still try to be polite.
I think that main reason for the change is that we 1) get more comfortable with ourselves 2) have a better sense of what we want and don’t want 3) and have a clearer understanding of our (realistic) goals in life and what it takes to achieve them.
Excellence, it sounds like your anger goes very deep, and it affects your attitude. Make no mistake, I don’t disagree with your assessment that parental interference can destroy relationships. But I also think that your sad experience has greatly embittered you; hardly an attractive or productive attribute for anyone to have, especially for someone not married yet. I hope that status changes soon for you, and that you get wonderful in-laws (as opposed to out-laws), whom you will love and respect and vice versa.
Wise words spoken. I know that and agree.
Also, who knows what I did past lifetime that I should suffer at their hands? Until I stand before the Heavenly Court and get the fill download, I must hold myself back.
End the day, I have the best teacher. The Vilna Gaon lost his daughtet just before her wedding. He accepted the decree. Can I do no less?
: )
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