Origins of Muslim Anti-Semitism

The reason for *all* anti-semitism, whether Christian, Muslim or left-wing anti-semitism is very clear. It is because we are in galus. And until we leave golus with Moshiach, it will continue.

That being said, Christian and European anti-semitism has been far far worse and much much much more violent and spilled far far far more Jewish blood than Muslim or Arabic anti-semitism, by a very very long-shot.

The numbers do not lie.

Whereas Jews were constantly facing Crusades, burning of the Talmud, blood libels, black death scapegoating, pograms, Tach V’Tat, numerous expulsions (England, France, Spain, Portugal, Germany, Hungary, Austria, Switzerland, Italy, etc.), Inquisitions, Dreyfus and most recently, and notoriously, the Holocaust of 6 million, the Jews in the Arabic and Muslim lands, by comparison (and that is key) were living mostly peacefully and safely despite sporadic exceptions.

To be fair, the poster you are mentioning also does not believe that most Jews are even Jews, which is in complete agreement with the Nation of Islam and other such groups that also do not believe that Jews are real Jews. Even lurking, I am tired of seeing such offensive posts. I have a very hard time believing there was rampant intermarriage in 1870’s white Russia and that everyone was did it.

Usually not in agreement, but Square Root is 100% right here. Antisemitism is explicit in the Quran. We are to them as the Amalekim were to us. You can’t appease a group who believes in a chiyuv of killing you.

“the Jews in the Arabic and Muslim lands, by comparison (and that is key) were living mostly peacefully and safely despite sporadic exceptions.”
This just isn’t true. The Muslims could not pull off something like The Holocaust, not because they wouldn’t love to, but simply because they are so bad at life. It’s just not even shayach to compare them to Europeans. They don’t get brownie points for being failures. If modern, western civilizations became as Anti-semitic as Islam (as Germany indeed did), they could do some serious damage. Uncivilized barbarians running around in loin cloths living in their own filth simply could not ever be as big of a threat, but that has nothing to do with their hashkafa being any less Antisemitic.

The Muslim world, like the Christian world, has throughout the centuries risen and fallen in culture vs barbarism. In the last few decades, barbarism has taken hold (again) of the Muslim world. Jihadis have beheaded and murdered hundreds of thousands, maybe even millions, and displaced millions, of their own Muslim people and other minorities in the Middle East and Africa. They have carried out terrorism globally. To think that they’d be viscous to everyone, including each other, but they’d make exceptions for Jews, if not for Zionism, is ridiculous.

“The Muslim world, like the Christian world, has throughout the centuries risen and fallen in culture vs barbarism. In the last few decades, barbarism has taken hold (again) of the Muslim world.”

It’s not comparable. In an anthropological sense, Nazi Germany was still a civilization as evil as they may have been. Groups like ISIS and Al Queda are simply not; they are more comparable to hoards of barbarians that sustain themselves on constant killing. Even back in the “good old days” when Iran was under the Shah before the Islamists took over, it’s not like Iran was comparable to England.

“They have carried out terrorism globally. To think that they’d be viscous to everyone, including each other, but they’d make exceptions for Jews, if not for Zionism, is ridiculous.”

100% agree. This thread shows the dangers of Chareidim trying to argue against Zionism in a “logical” or political way. Stick to the script: chazal say it’s a problem, so it’s a problem. When people start trying to apply political logic to justify anti-Zionism, they end up integrating this leftist nonsense about how Muslims used to be so nice.

Neville Chamberlain,
“We are to them as the Amalekim were to us.”
It always amazes me how Yidden instinctively understand we don’t follow the literal Torah. But instead we follow the modern day interpretation of the Rabbanim.
There are a lot of smart Jews. Why aren’t the Rabbanim calling to raise millions of dollars to isolate the “Amalek” gene so we can perform this Dioraisa mitzvah?
The truth is we have no interest in performing this mitzvah at the current time. We avoid it by claiming 1. We don’t know who Amalek is though with it being Biblical we SHOULD be, but are not Machmir.
2. A more modern approach is Amalek is the evil inside of us we need to get rid of. Either way no Jew that I know is working on a plan to fulfill this Mitzvah.
The Christians of today are different than those of yesteryear. In the past they believed they were doing a big Mitzvah converting Jews by any means necessary. Today it’s all about love, only love. They donate to Jewish causes, they help Jews, they try to convert us through “Good Works”
This can (& G-d willing soon) & will happen with Muslims as well. Taking the LITERAL text of the Torah, Xtian Bible &/or Quran & claiming this is the final word of G-d which is not subject to interpretation by their respective religious leaders & scholars is unsophisticated thinking. If we do it constantly so can other religions.

Kuvult:
If memory serves, Rav Hirsch notes that it’s the zecher of amaleik, meaning any remnant of their practices and values, that is the issue. That, not genes.

Kuvult > In the past they believed they were doing a big Mitzvah converting Jews by any means necessary. Today it’s all about love, only love.

specifically, Catholics decided in 1960s (Vatican 2) that Jews per se are kosher and do not need a conversion to be saved. So, no more inquisition for us.

KGN, “Islamism” as a radical movement is not totality of Muslims. At least in theory.

golden age also had ups and downs, depending on a local ruler.

muslims let us live for hundreds of years much better than the christians even with all these quotes, not saying zionism is the cause but hashem is the one who decides how they act toward us, anyone trying to claim otherwise is at least approaching kefira

There are billions of Muslims. Some are extremists, others are not.

It’s the extremists that we care about and notice. Therefore, we label all Muslims as ones who want violence.

That is not the case.

@2scents
I think that’s a very PC view. Some are not exterme and would rather money or lavish lifestyles vs violence. They are usually modern and less “frum” who just aren’t as devout. But the core of Islam is still about violence. I haven’t seen any “peaceful” Muslims denounce Hamas at the UN..

More generally speaking any religion that produces a large amount of violent cult like followers such as Islam there is something fundamentally wrong with the religion as a whole. In other words even if there are 1B peaceful Muslims but there are 20M who are violent, the fact that it can produce 20M violent followers says alot. Yes us frum jews have a few crazies too like Lev Tahor or Boruch Goldstein but its a blip. Everyone has a few bad actors. However, when its so large in size that brings up the question that there is a larger fundamental issue. This is even more profound when the other “frum muslims” won’t denounce the radical’s like Frum jews do.

i forgot the source but there is someone that says that between every level of the domem tzomeach chai medaber yidden ladder there is an example of the lower level that is close to the higher level, for example a monkey is a chai but its close to a medaber, the closest goy to a yid is an arab