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Why is it that shadchanim deal with girls who are slightly overweight, well not huge but definitely not on the skinny side of life… as if we suffer from something contagious ??
no other reason for running away from us BH no divorce, illness or criminal record … no demanding money,or only working/learning and yichus, just real good nice boys with more good middos than anything else..
With no one interested in us it makes us take out the double box of oreos and an ice coffee to calm down, and thats why dear shadchan we are gaining even more weight! don’t ask me again to call in 6 months after I loose all my weight because after years I see this will eint happen and this is who I am!
Has someone actually said that to you? To call back after you have lost weight? Uhg!! My friend is a shadchan for YU and she says that boys/guys/men say things like ” I want a blonde girl no bigger than a size 4-6, blue eyes preferably”.. And so on. I understand that attraction is a huge factor in a relationship, but to be so specific and superficial. I hate it. Give someone a chance, you never know!! I know Hashem has your basheret out there who will love you exactly the way Hashem made you.
stop whining and take ownership. unless you have diabetes, you can lose the weight and be happier and healthier. stop going straight to the pantry when youre stressed, and hit the gym instead. if you can’t control your weight now, just wait until you have a few kids.
There is a difference between being obese, and a little chunky. There is also a difference between being chunky and a few pounds over weight. Some people can exercise 5 times a week and eat healthy and still have pounds too lose. Everyone is built differently, it’s how Hashem made us. When you have someone who makes no effort to lose weight, and they live an unhealthy lifestyle hats a different story.
seriously? Yuck. Go find yourself some normal shadchanim. I sure wouldn’t want someone like that redting me a shidduch.
SaysMe: +1000000000000000
scrisis: I am sick of hearing about these kinds of “shadchanim”. They have no business being in this business!!!!! How cruel and insensitive. I would love to have the phone numbers of some of these so called shadchanim. I would not hesitate to call them and give them a piece of my mind! I know someone who was also told “don’t call me back until you lose 50 pounds”. This girl happens to be working very hard on herself. The last time I saw her, she looked so nice – she was dressed very well, had just the right amount of make up on, her hair was done very nicely, etc. – yes still had a few pounds to go – BUT SO WHAT!!!???? Do these shadchanim tell the boys to lose weight? I doubt it!
And by the way – are these Mr. Americas always going to look the same? What will 5 or 10 or 15 years down the road bring? His hairline might be receding (OMG) or he might put on weight from his wife’s wonderful cooking, etc. And what about the girl? She may be a size 2 now and look like a model. What happens after the first few kids?
Now a word to the dear shadchanim – Just buy a bunch of Barbie Dolls and give them out to these amazing boys. There! Problem solved.
My father was over 50 and very overweight. His father was overweight and had diabetes for the latter half of his life. The doctors told him that he’s going down the same road, so he lost over a hundred pounds in a few months. He simply stopped eating junk food altogether, limited his carb intake to two slices of bread a day, stuck to only diet drinks and stopped eating sugar and oily foods altogether, including salad dressings. He also started walking five miles every day and ten on weekends.
If a fiftysomething year old man very busy and very set in his ways can do it, so can a twentysomething year old girl.
That being said, the shadchan has some serious issues. You should demand that she ask you mechila. It’s simply assur to insult someone by calling them fat.
Going back to my original statement, you still have to work on yourself. If your weight is causing you to have trouble in shidduchim you simply have to ask yourself what’s more important, comfort food or getting married? My Mother in Law always says that there’s no excuse for a young single girl to be overweight.
yserbius- your mother-in-law is wrong. And not everyone can or will lose weight the same way. Another person may go on your father’s diet and not lose anything. Maybe your father was eating excessively before and these girls arent. Many girls ARE trying to lose weight but its not so simple or easy for most.
Gefen – buy a bunch of Barbie Dolls and give them out to these amazing boys
LOL! That is an awesome idea!! Love it! Shadchanim should really do that, and to the mothers who demand it too! It’ll make them realize what they’re saying. Awwwwesome 🙂
SaysMe: Glad you like my idea. 😉
scrisis- I really feel for you. Not as someone who is also overweight, but as someone who understands how the shidduch system can bring out the worst side of humanity in some people. These people need to learn that looks are important but there are other qualities of far greater importance. These guys (or there mothers who are often overweight themselves) are satisfied as long as the girl is good looking and from a wealthy family. It is because of these shallow thinking narrow minded fools that finding a shidduch becomes so hard for many excellent and highly talented young people. It is my hope that people will start to look at your inner qualities rather than your outer appearance.
Gangnam Style, to sum up your post, you think that looks are important, but should nevertheless be disregarded. Is that correct?
This has nothing to do with the shadchanim. This is like blaming the shadchanim for telling the boys that the girls want learners.
I’m not telling you to not complain about it, but complain to the correct address: the boys.
On an unrelated story, I once went on a first date and the girl was kinda heavy. I was furious at the shadchan for not telling me in advance.
I’m divorced, I don’t mind heavy.
So sad that people have this pre conceived notion of the perfect mate. There are so many fantastic girls out there who can stand to lose a few pounds but have sterling characters.
No question that there has to be physical attraction but this is way beyond normal what is going on. I see so many of my daughter’s friends subsisting on a starvation diet in order to be nice and slim.
Why is it OK for a boy to have a few extra pounds?
We live in such a chitzoynius age and I do not see it improving. We are all ensnared by what the media portrays as attractive and we buy into this sheker.
We are all ensnared by what the media portrays as attractive and we buy into this sheker.
Do you think that boys who have less exposed to secular media are less choler about appearance?
We are all ensnared by what the media portrays as attractive and we buy into this sheker.
That is simply not true, as any man well knows. It’s as true to us, as it is true to you that childbirth is hard.
A shadchan told me that many boys do not want girls who are too slim. (Probably because he didn’t have anyone appropriate.)
I’m amazed how many girls out there are not as slim as I’d like. 85% of the girls I’ve gone out with were too heavy. I gave them all a good chance but every single one was a waste of time. Obviously there are boys out there that don’t mind a bit heavy but I can’t stand it. And I’m not looking for super beauty super slim just normal and I can’t find it.
6 years in Shiduchim and still looking for the ‘thousands’ of perfect girls in Shiduchim.
See my thread on this topic:
http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/topic/is-there-a-shidduch-crisis-1#post-418983
There is no question that a boy who was not exposed to secular media and culture will not have the same notions when seeking an attractive girl. No question at all.
The secular world’s ideas on body image seem not to be too different from ours.
OTOH, some guys like a voluptuous woman. Different strokes for different folks.
From my previous post: “choler” should read “choosy”.
Popa, in type, or in degree of hakpadah?
Rd, yes, but is there a causal relationship?
DassYochid- I would sum up by saying someone should not marry someone who is repulsive to them but todays shiduch system over emphasizes the importance of marrying the most attractive girl, without the important qualities being equal. This is what I believe is wrong.
GS,
1) As popa says, don’t blame the shidduch system, blame the boys (then we can argue about how to fix the boys).
2) Who says other things aren’t more important? Appearance is obvious sooner, so it may be the most common grounds for stopping a shidduch, yet not the most important characteristic.
A shadchan told me that many boys do not want girls who are too slim. (Probably because he didn’t have anyone appropriate.)
He should tell them that they’ll gain weight when they have kids anyway.
But yes, your perception of his reasoning is correct.
DY- I will blame the system, because the yeshivas and seminaries do not teach values to their students on a person to person basis. It is also unfair to only blame boys because there are plenty of unreasonable expectations among girls. Why is height a huge factor,when choosing to marry a guy? why do many girls with middos that leave alot to be desired think that they are entitled to marry only the biggest ben torah? Why do girls try desperately to marry the biggest masmid ,only to complain that she cant manage to run the house and raise the children on her own. My point is is that yeshivas and seminaries should guide their students what to do on a personal basis rather then say that one lofty lifestyle is ideal for everyone. This would cause people to begin looking for what they really need to be happy in life instead of trying to impress others with the top bochur,rich father-in-law,attractive wife, without their spouse possessing the qualities they need to be happy with their marriage.
My story is the only one where a shadchan could possibly cause weight gain. All of your stories / opinions / arguments will result in weight loss.
What will happen if there is a famine, and girls die, because they have no fat storage? It will be your fault.
GS,
You’re confusing the shidduch system with the chinuch system (which you’re almost entirely wrong about, but I’ll leave alone for now because it’s off topic).
I have lost over 20 pounds in the past year and am now a size 14. Recently, I got engaged. I met my chosson several months ago when I was still about an 18. My weight didn’t matter to him then and it doesn’t matter now. (Incidentally, we did not meet through a shadchan). I’m losing weight in order to be healthier and feel better, not to look good for him, although of course I’m happy about that part of it as well.
When I called a gemach to ask about borrowing a gown for my wedding, the woman who runs it told me that she mostly had size 4s and 6s and a very small selection of 12s and 14s. I ended up buying a gown and taking it to a seamstress for tznius alterations (expensive, but what else can you do?)
I was seriously involved with someone last year (B”H both parties moved on, she is engaged, and I am furthering my education and not rushing dating until I make at least $50K a year), and ironically, I felt like my weight was made an issue. There were no shadchanim involved, but when dealing with the family, I felt like that was an issue they held against me. There is a great deal of bias against heavier people, and the negative perceptions further a lack of maturity on the issue.
rebdoniel
“There is a great deal of bias against heavier people, and the negative perceptions further a lack of maturity on the issue.”
You do not say how overweight you were and I really hope you have made efforts to lose weight.
All I would say that there is a huge difference of being say 15 lbs overweight as opposed to anything over 30lbs. with the latter being a serious state that another party might recognize as being a serious health hazard.
Well, I personally am a pretty skinny guy, so I’m looking for a girl that’s not so chunky myself and that’s my reason. In any case, I think both many men and women are very superficial, unfortunately. I had a very good friend of mine (who’s a great guy) be turned down twice because he’s not tall enough (he’s like 5’6″ which I think isn’t too bad). BH he’s engaged now, but that did mess him up a little. Similarly I know people who are also GREAT guys and great learners, and the girl rejected him because he isn’t “yeshivish” enough. Her definition of that- he doesn’t have payos and beard, doesn’t go to the store in his black hat, and doesn’t learn in the “mainstream” yeshiva that her teacher’s husband learns in (which is not so mainstream, and is significantly lower in learning than the yeshivah he learns in). So we see that superficiality is all too common and spreads over a vast area of pratim. If it’s something like weight which you can do something about, why not? It’s healthy anyway. I nonetheless apologize on the behalf of the shadchanim (menuvalim) who spoke so mean with you.
I wonder what these people would say about R’ Yochanan, who would be considered morbidly obese by today’s standards, and was known as the most handsome talmid chacham of his dor.
That’s simply untrue and “feel good” teenage pseudoscience. Find me a single girl who is considered very overweight that did not trim her weight down when she goes on a diet and sticks to it.
Diets and weight loss/gain are about one thing and one thing only: self control. It’s not your “metabolism”, it’s the jar of cookies that you keep sneaking into for comfort food!
Yserbius123- maybe saysme isn’t talking about very overweight girls. I personally think the weight issue it taken to extremes. Girls that are size 10 are considered overweight. Even when they’re 5’6″. A girl who’s 5′ and is a size two has the same proportions but is considered acceptable… When I was in high school girls would starve themselves for shidduchim. I don’t see any reason a girl shouldn’t be able to live normally and find a decent shidduch…
@scrisis: I understand exactly where you are coming from. I am overweight and when I was dating guys would tell me to MY FACE that I was too heavy for them. Meanwhile they were so fat they looked like they were 13 months pregnant. I just looked at them like the social retards that they are and said nothing.
Also, don’t put your trust in shaddchanim. HaShem is THE ultimate shaddchan. I got married about 6 weeks ago to a wonderul man who said he likes his woman on the “chunky” side. My husband sees me for who I am, not the fat that is hiding who I am.
The rabbis, rabaim, shaddchanim, etc. had better wake up and tell these “boys” that they are in dreamland. One day these “boys” will wakeup and be the alter buchers of their shuls/shteibels/synagogues. Nothing more pathetic than to see an “old” man without a talis because he’s an older single.
As for the wome/girls. Live your lives the best way you can. Your basherts will come and they will love you for who you are.
*applauds walton*
Pretty and skinny girls also get criticized for their looks by shadchanim. Usually by people who think that they control shidduchim, and if they don’t marry you off, no one will ever marry you. It’s not true and shidduchim can come from anywhere that Hashem wants. Do your best with what you have and don’t take it personally.
yserbius- i ain’t a teen. Maybe ‘she’ was very overweight, did diet, lost 30 lb and is STILL overweight, so you assume she hasn’t tried. Maybe she has a health issue that causes either weight gain or difficulty losing weight. Maybe she was morbidly obese and now is down 150 lb and you’d never know, but label her lacking self-control. Maybe we really can’t judge others, or what they have tried, succeeded in, or failed in, behind closed doors.
Gamanit- i SERIOUSLY hope size 10 at 5’6 isnt considered overweight! And thankfully haven’t encountered anyone who thought so yet irl.
SaysMe- unfortunately it is. I worked really hard to become a size 10 only to still be considered overweight…
gamanit- by who???? Thats disgusting, crazy, ridiculous.. Ok i’ll stop ranting. I guess it depends also on how every individual holds their weight, but still. And then people wonder why eating disorders and unhealthy diets invade our communities…
By shadchanim, aunts, girls that I knew who were size 2. No, they didn’t say “you’re so overweight.” What they did say is “wow, you look so good! If you lose a little bit more you’ll be a perfect size.” Relatives would tell me to continue to lose weight until I’m a size 6. If not for some really good friends that made sure that I ate three meals a day every day, I probably would have. It wouldn’t have been healthy for me to lose more weight.
gamanit- there’s a big difference between someone telling you you could use a single (or 2) dress sizes, and thinking you are overweight. but i agree its not always healthy to lose weight.
We have a big problem these days. We have wonderful, beautiful, amazing girls, who have good middos, are tzanua, are pleasant, and sweet, who have good jobs, and looking forward to raising a family,, and their only apparent (visible) fault is that they are not a size 2,4,6 or 8. Because they are not skinny or thin, they are viewed to be deficient in some way.
And I find it amazing because these girls could have everything going for them, but they will be turned down and not even considered before a boy dates a girl with half of the fine qualities who is thin. Its so fascinating how today we support girls starving and dieting in order to get a date! What kind of unhealthy habits are we promoting? Is there something INHERENTLY wrong with the person because she isn’t skinny? Of course there is a line where being too heavy is unhealthy, but being to skinny is just as unhealthy if not even more dangerous.
People assume that overweight people are impulsive and grotesque, where really many of them are sweet amazing girls who try so hard, diet 24/7, excercise all day, and they just can’t get the weight off. Why are mothers teaching their sons to be weary of the dress size of a girl? I find it amazing that mothers have the audacity to ask what size a girl is. Girls who are not “fortunate” enough to have a small build feel like less of a person because of something so superficial and so physical.
I know of a girl who was 20 years old. and was overweight. A shadchan redt her a boy who was hashkafically NOT for her, he was divorced, and he had a child from his previous marriage… The shadchan told her that because of her circumstance (being heavier) she would have to compromise… Not only are people not redting these girls to normal boys, but they are also insulting them, degrading them, and offending them.
I just think we need to think about the message we are sending when we hold physicality to be such a priority, and we downplay some important things that boys should be looking for in a wife like good middos and menschlichkeit. I also think the message we are sending to our children is that you are only worth something if you are thin and beautiful. This is chukas hagoyim, which is basically saying the more emaciated you are the more beautiful you are the more you are worth to someone else.
I know that this is the world, and there is not much to be done about it, I just don’t think it is right, and many times you should not judge a person at face value, by appearance alone, and if you look a little beyond surface deep you will find something beautiful you weren’t willing to give a chance before.
you make it sound like weight is the only reason people can’t find a shidduch…
When people ask someone’s size, i don’t answer. I’ve said on a previous thread, there are better ways of answering, especially since dresssize and appearance don’t often directly connect. Build and height play in too.
I do think any shadchan(te) who puts down a girl or boy for their size should be put in their place, and not be allowed to work in a sensitive area like shidduchim, for which they clearly lack tact and sensitivity.
0utoftowner
You are a living example of why daas torah is so important. You are wrong from your opening sentence to your closing argument….. and you also happened by chance to completely miss the point. Now, I may grant that you will never want to face the truth, but I feel the need to point out your absurdity to anyone willing to face logic even if they don’t like it.
You begin by saying that “We have a big problem these days.” Really? We have a big problem these days? This is a new problem that just came up that you did not know about when your children were young and you gave them all kinds of candy at every opportunity? When you were young ugly people were pretty and let me guess the guys would only marry girls older than them. Right. OK.
And I quote your last point:
“I just don’t think it is right, and many times you should not judge a person at face value, by appearance alone, and if you look a little beyond surface deep you will find something beautiful you weren’t willing to give a chance before.”
You seem to feel that it is definitely true that just because a guy won’t marry her then it must be true that he is only looking “surface deep”. I would say that it is very possible that he knows all about the stuff under the surface and he’s not judging her at face value and if there was only one thing necessary in a marriage(that being “wonderful, beautiful, amazing girls, who have good middos, are tzanua, are pleasant, and sweet, who have good jobs, and looking forward to raising a family”)then he would marry her, BUT there are other things that might hold him back. Maybe she’s 44. Is that looking skin deep? Maybe she’s got no arms. Is that looking skin deep? Maybe she’s not jewish. Is that looking skin deep? Maybe she’s fat. Is that looking skin deep? Maybe she’s 22 but divorced with newborn triplets. Is that looking skin deep? Maybe she smokes like a trucker. Is that looking skin deep? Maybe a combination of the above. That doesn’t mean that she’s not “wonderful, beautiful, amazing girls, who have good middos, are tzanua, are pleasant, and sweet, who have good jobs, and looking forward to raising a family” It just means that the average guy is not going to marry her.
Finally, you completely missed the point. We’re talking about a person’s life here. We’re talking about choosing a person to become a part of oneself to form a whole. Is someone expected to even consider thinking about how other people will feel about their decision? Should a person marry someone just to help a crisis? If you will answer yes, I suggest you insist that all fat girls and smoker boys should marry each other.
serious question (mods didn’t seem to like my last post for some reason, ignoring its profound nature): are there any from girls who smoke? i have yet to see one. maybe this explains the weight thing.
inappropriate terminology
are there any from girls who smoke? i have yet to see one. maybe this explains the weight thing.
That is a good point. We all know that many smokers gain a lot of weight when they quit. So there is a clearly a correlation between weight and not smoking.
We have wonderful, beautiful,, amazing girls, who have good middos, are tzanua, are pleasant, and sweet, who have good jobs, and looking forward to raising a family
Why do you consider beautiful to be a factor? Isn’t that superficial?
Why get offensive? If a guy doesn’t want to marry you then he’s clearly not right for you. This thread makes girls seem desperate that they need to date every guy they can get their hands on. Not every guy will wan to date you just like you shouldn’t want to date every guy. Have some pride women!
This thread has taken a fun turn. If outrageously inappropriate. Mods: you should delete the past 10 posts.
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