know any frum vegetarians or vegans?

And none of your so-called “counterarguments” could be viewed as justifying refraining from eating meat entirely. At most it is to limit the amount or time when meat is consumed. But all agree meat should be consumed on various times or occasions.

What if someone doesnt like meat or Fish, Its that Apikorsus too?

After all it says ain Simcha eleah Dag v’Basar

Personally I dont care for Chicken or Gefilte Fish and I wont eat it unless there is nothing else to eat and I wont eat the Gefilte Fish unless its totally drenched in Chrain.

It should be a chiyuv to tell your shidduch date if you’re a vegetarian.

Would you want a your /a wife to not cook meat?

Sam2 I was totally joking.

I completely failed on the italics there… Kept pushing edit and trying it differently until it was too late. Could anyone please explain or link me to a thread that explains how to use the code in this forum for italics and bold? I know basic coding in Java, HTML, and C, but I just can’t for the life of me figure this one out. The coding instructions on the bottom are just confusing me.

Curioisty: Italics is <em > and bold is <strong >. They’re underneath the place you post in.

Kozov: I’ll look again, but I thought the Shach over there said that Im Yirtzeh applies to any normal Shabbos and Yom Tov as well.

I don’t understand the whole concept of saying Ein Simcha Ela B’vasar by Simchas Yom Tov anyway. Doesn’t the Gemara immediately say that that was only referring to Basar of Korbanos?

Ah Sam2, I don’t really deserve your “its ok” approval. It is a halachic issue. From the little I have seen and the great deal I have read, I don’t feel correct in relying on any shechita that is not absolutely local and managed transparently. Non factory raised and backyard shechita is the gold standard I hold to. It is somewhat easier here in EY where you can go and pick up a b. daka, and engage a neighbor shochet to do the processing. Its just a risk of near total loss if found treifa.

When you add vegetarianism and veganism to Judaism, it seems like you are making a statement that the Gedolim of the past were somehow not complete in their observance. I say this as someone whose family Minhag is not to eat meat on Tuesdays and Thursdays.

Reducing the amount of meat for health reasons is certainly commendable, but I don’t think our Gedolim overlooked a huge ethical issue which is only now coming to light.

I am a lifelong vegetarian. My mother always was (got it from her parents) and my father became vegetarian when he met my mother. So me and my sisters grew up without meat/fish.

I’m completely healthy, as are they. And I don’t take any food supplements at all.

Reasons? As Sam2 says, I find the treatment of animals in the meat industry apprehensive. But even without that – I simply grew up like this and will never change it. The thought of putting something in my mouth that was once walking around and had a brain, eyes, ears and bones, makes me totally sick. I will never in my life eat meat, and I don’t care what anyone thinks about that.

By the way, it’s interesting to know that on the same piece of ground on which you could put animals to get meat to feed 50 people, you could grow vegetables to feed 200 people (not sure of the exact ciphers, but I know the principle is true). It is a fact that if the entire world would cease eating meat, there would be no hunger and starvation in the world, and every person in the world would have plenty of food, even if the world had not 8 but 20 billion inhabitants.

Sam2: Bad comparison. Rav Moshe Shternbuch never said not to do kapporos with chickens. He was simply promoting treating the animals properly — and then using them.

TCG: Your vegetarian defensive logic that the animal was a living, walking, creature and therefore you cannot eat it is the antitheism of the Torah, whether you do or do not care or change.

It is pure sheker and l”h to assert that the yiddishe shochtim today mistreat the animals.

@2scents (and shein):

“The activists have a point, they are right! according to logic man has no right to kill animal. However, Hashem has told us otherwise that is why Jews have permission to kill animals for food.

IN other words, an atheist or anyone that does not believe in the Torah, has no permission to kill and eat animals, it is only the word of Hashem that permits us to do so.”

Correct. We have *permission* to eat meat. However, we do not *have* to. I freely choose not to eat meat. As for those who consider it a requirement to eat meat, it’s generally the same kind of people who consider davening without a hat to be avodah zarah. Ie, very closed mindset.

I never said we’re not allowed to kill animals. The Torah clearly says we are allowed to. As for me personally however, I simply see absolutely no need to eat meat. I don’t need it, my body is completely healthy without it (and without any supplements also). So since I do not feel any need to eat it – on the other hand, I find meat repulsive – then why should I try and convince myself to suddenly start eating eat?

My wife eats meat, every frum person I know eats meat. I am most definitely a rarity. But I’ve always been rare, so that’s nothing new.

TCG: There IS a halachic requirement to eat meat sometimes. (See the discussion here earlier for one current example. Korbon Pesach is another historical and future example.)

Tcg m

Sorry for misunderstanding your earlier post.

@yytz: thanks for the tip. Honestly, I have a hard time believing this is serious – I mean, he’s probably about as chassidish as I am. (When I was living in Yerushalayim I was more part of that world – now I am just myself.)

Regarding vitamin B12 – I’ve had a few tests throughout my life to check whether I have some deficiency, but each test has shown that I don’t need any supplements – not for that, nor for iron or any other vitamins. I’m glad with that, since it proves that being vegetarian is perfectly normal.

I had a teacher who was a vegan, and I know his wife was also.

Also we had a woman eat at our house one Shabbos who was vegetarian.

I know a handful of others… maybe 7?

All the ones i know happen to be Balei Teshuva. Does that have any signifigance??

I try to do the vegan thing during the weekdays, but I’m not 100% strict about it. It’s more for health reasons. I was diagnosed with high uric acid in my blood, which is a precursor for gout. My grandmother had that. I try and avoid plant protein as well.

Really, there is no need for any protein intake other than the Omegas: Omega-3, Omega-6, & Omega-9, since those are the only proteins that the body needs, but can’t manufacture. For those of you who want to comment about the need for protein, unless you send me a scientific study that states proteins are a necessity, don’t bother with your uneducated mythologies. I try to loosely follow the Pritikin Program.

I definitely eat fish, poultry, & red meat on Shabbos & Yom Tov, but I try to keep the protein intake to a minimum.

yytz: I know Dovid Sears personally. He’s a very sincere, pushute Breslover, and former Mendy the Golem comic book author.

“It actually says Elah baBasar and baYayin. And, that’s talking about YomTov, not Shabbos, when it is a Chiyuv to eat meat and drink wine…

Y”D 341:1? See the Pischei Tshuva who is michalek between Shabbos and YomTov where there is a Chiyuv mitaam Simchas YomTov. And on Shabbos TishaBav and for an Avel there is a Chiyuv to eat meat, see Magen Avraham 13 in O”C 552 (and Machatzis Hashekel). And even from 341:1 I’m not sure it means that you *should* do what you want, maybe just that you could. See Tur O”C 242 where he says “Tzarich Liharbos” (and “Yesh LiAdam Lizarez Atzmo”) and Shulchan Aruch 250:2.

So sometimes there is a Chiyuv to eat meat.

Even according to the Biur Halacha, not only is there a Mitzva *if* you eat Basar, there is a Mitzva *to* eat Basar. See Mishna Brura 529:11.”

by Kozov

iced:

Being a vegetarian entails being a baal aveira.

In your own not very humble, and admittedly wrong opinion. The two rabbeim my wife and daughter spoke to about this didn’t seem to have the same opinion as you; in fact, they both paskened that they are fine with being vegans.

We all know where that leads.

Mixed dancing?

@iced – you must be a very nice person. So open-minded and able to understand that there are people with different opinions.

yytz said everything I would say – his words are my words.

Did I share my recipe for vegetarian liver here?

Chopped Liver

If you are vegan, you can substitute that, and take out the eggs.

I think your confusion stems from the fact that you forgot to substitute the vegan for the vegetarian. Try it again, and see how it tastes.