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I thought most people agreed that you should learn in kollel. But I was reading the Shulchan Aruch (246:21) and the Rama has a long comment in which he says learning for a living in a kollel is a desecration of Hashem and an embarrassment for the Torah. What’s going on?
That is one of many examples where our minhag is not to hold like the Rama. Learning in Kollel is the ideal for every religious Jew. With so much pressure from within the Jewish community shaped from outside influences against learning in Kollel, we must hold strong and continue the Mesorah of our forefathers.
Its not so simple,but in our times we need it to perpetuate the existance of Torah
If learning in Kollel is against the Chazals about Melachah and Derech Eretz, then so is being a Rebbi or a Rav. See the Rama YD 246:6. He brings your Chazals and says that therefore nobody can be a paid Rebbi or a Rav either, since he relies on the congregation. But then he brings dissenting opinions, and rules that the custom is that Torah scholars do benefit from their learning, by support from the community.
Then he brings other opinions that the community should support its Torah scholars even to the point of affluence.
The Rama then says it is a Midas Chasidus – praiseworthy – for someone who can become a Gadol B’Torah and make an independent living, but continues that not everyone is capable of this. It is clear that he is saying that if you have a choice between becoming a Godol B’Torah or making a living, becoming a Godol B’Torah comes first.
As an aside, the Halachah is that you are nowadays allowed to live off Tzedakah to learn (see the Ramah and Shach in Hilchos Talmud Torah.)
The Halchah as expressed by the Rambam which states that anyone who so chooses may learn in Kollel. See also YD Laws of Talmud Torah 246:21 and Shach ad loc. Also, Shulchan Aruch Hilchos Toalmud Torah, in the Shach ad loc, says that nowadays learning all day is the ideal, and that if someone has the ability to do it, he should. The Shach adds that regarding learning all day in general, nowadays we cannot reach our potential in learning the way the Rambam etc. did, since we are not on that level. Therefore, we should learn all day if we can.
truthsharer
I think Obaminator did my job for me.
Please explain the following to me
A Kollel Man has 10 Children 5 Boys and 5 Girls
All are married. He is supporting the 5 Girls families (The boys are supported by their father-in-laws)
Each of the 5 girls (and their husbands) has 5 children each for a total of 25 grandchildren. So he is supporting 37 people (Himself, His wife, his 5 daughters and son-in-laws and 25 grandchildren)
He has to pay 25 yeshiva tuitions at $3000 each (OK this is a low amount)
He also has to pay for 6 Apartments at $1000 a month each (Also a low amount) (His apartment and apartments for his 5 daughters)
And he has to feed 37 mouths…
Learning in Kollel is the ideal for every religious Jew.
Huh? what about all(most) the Tanoim, Amoraim, Rashi, and others who worked for a living?
What about Rav AL Stienmean was for the creation of working and army opportunities for people who cant/dont want to learn all day forever.
With so much pressure from within the Jewish community shaped from outside influences against learning in Kollel, we must hold strong and continue the Mesorah of our forefathers.
A bit of historical honesty(or if your ignorant, then knowledge) would be in appropriate.
The mesorah from our forefathers is NOT to learn in kollel. The Kovnah kollel (created by the alter of slabodka {Rav Noson Tzvi Finkel}) had a limit on how long you could learn there(I think 3 years) and it was only for people planning on becoming rabbis rabeim etc.
Historically NO SUCH THING EVER EXISTED. To say it has become necessary is a statement worthy of discussion/ debate /stating outright etc. But to say
“we must hold strong and continue the Mesorah of our forefathers” is to lie and counterfeit the menorah that we have.
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