Inviting Non-Jewish Co-Workers To A Simcha?

wolf

a sandwich doesn’t make it mutar, ask a real rov.

and for g-ds sake stop using your corrupt logic to pasken shalos!!

ppl that are reading this posts don’t realize how little you know, which is OK if you would understand that, and stop talking as if you know what you’re talking about.

everywhere from gemara to ALL poskim say a goy on yom tov is assur! get it through your head, what you’re doing is WRONG, assur, and someone that does something wrong on purpose is called a rasha.

i know you’ll say OK I’m rasha I’ve been called worse, but that attitude deems you an apikoros, and you’re opinions don’t belong on a jewish/hemish website.

there is nothing wrong with a question, or not knowing a halacha, but when you’re arguing with basic undisputed halacha, it’s a real problem.

inviting a goy on yom tov is assur!! period.

Is it?

You’re SURE that if I invite a non-Jew to a Yom Tov meal and DON’T COOK ANYTHING (i.e. serve deli sandwiches) that it’s assur?

It’s clearly not. The issur is in cooking, not inviting. All your yelling and protesting to the contrary doesn’t change that.

As for the actual cooking, I clearly recommend you ask your LOR. You may well get a different answer than I got.

The Wolf

a sandwich doesn’t make it mutar, ask a real rov.

I’ll tell you what… why don’t you show me a source that says that having a non-Jew over for Yom Tov where there is no cooking is assur?

Do you even know the reason why it’s a problem on Yom Tov and not Shabbos? The reason is SOLELY because of the cooking!

And, for the third time, I’m not advising anyone to follow what I do. I clearly told everyone and anyone to contact their own LOR.

The Wolf

i know you’ll say OK I’m rasha I’ve been called worse, but that attitude deems you an apikoros

Doesn’t matter. I’ve known for a long time that many people deem me to be an apikores for lots of reason unrelated to the ones discussed herein.

So one more issue doesn’t seem to be a problem. You want to call me an apikorus for my self-image issues, go ahead. I don’t care.

The Wolf

EDITED

Mod80, I’m not sure that’s true. I think the “assur” cries are becoming more and more of a problem in the Jewish community in general. People aren’t properly educated and if they hear something that is different from what they specifically know, they don’t question “could it be ok” but rather say “assur, treif” etc. Each Rav paskens differently, so it may be assur for you, but it doesn’t mean its always assur.

And the truth is, if something isn’t assur, it usually is muttar. The question is if its appropriate…and that’s more of a case by case basis.

You know something, chesed… I don’t care to argue this with you anymore. Since you’ve already decided that because I don’t always view myself favorably that I’m an apikorus, then you probably shouldn’t argue with me anyway. I might further corrupt your soul or something like that.

I think we’ve hijacked this thread long enough. How about we return it back to the topic at hand — inviting non-Jews to affairs (that don’t happen on Yom Tov)?

The Wolf

overmutaring

Heh. I read this as “overmaturing” on the first read. 🙂

The Wolf

Mod80, I’m not sure that’s true. I think the “assur” cries are becoming more and more of a problem in the Jewish community in general. People aren’t properly educated and if they hear something that is different from what they specifically know, they don’t question “could it be ok” but rather say “assur, treif” etc. Each Rav paskens differently, so it may be assur for you, but it doesn’t mean its always assur.

To SJS and Mod80:

Rav Gifter always had a shita that one should look up the question, chances are someone has asked it and we can at least base ourselves off that.

It is a lost art, to find out what the Halacha is Vs. assuming Assur or Muttar.

Look it up at the source, and learn the Halacha.

Check with your Rov that you are correct. I have been told by my rov on a number of times that I was correct, but still should not do it for other, not necessarily pure halachic reasons (and yes, I listened).

Don’t just follow the “Kol Korei” or the latest fad (either for Issur or Heter), be knowledgeable.

That is what worries me. Not the Assuring (which is easy) or Mattering (which is more difficult), but the Am Haratzus and the inability to learn and think independently.

I think the question here is – Did Chazal say that it is ossur to cook for a goy on YT (which the wolf maintains) or did they say It is ossur to invite a goy for yom tov as you may come to cook for him (as chesed is stating but not really explaining properly). If it is the former than serving deli sandwiches will make inviting a goy muttar. If it is the latter then it won’t help because once a gezeira is made you can’t necessarily say – well that won’t be the outcome in this case so it’s OK.

However as I am not a Rabbi or poseik I won’t comment. Although even in the later case there may be a way of getting around it if necessary. So back to the LOR

It seems like many people in the CR are trying to shove their kulos down everyone’s throat. I know what’s coming next. “It’s not a kula, it’s blatant halacha.” If that’s the case, provide a source and discuss it. But to say its okay because you do it is just stupid.

Another interesting observation is that some people say don’t pasken when someone mentions a halacha that something is assur, yet the same person has no problem promoting something that is assur, essentially paskening that they can override the issur.

I was told that its the cooking that is assur. I would think that a seudah on Y”T wih uncooked food might be M”A but how would people know they are goyim.

mikehall12382 and arc

it’s beneath me to respond to personal attacks.

I’m not a rasha and to call me names or insult me, puts you in the category of one.

“as far as inviting a goy for yom tov meal, wolf is that heter your own, you didn’t see it in a sefer, or did you ask someone?”

I asked a Rav/Posek if it was permissible to invite a goyish in-law into a sukkah for a meal with the family. The answer was that it was a Kiddush Hashem. I don’t know how he would have paskined concerning any stam goy.

CN:

Even if you are correct (which you are, it is an outright MB 512:3), you go to far in your Kannoiness.

Besides, Wolf did say he discussed it with his Rov. Perhaps having Yiddishe Nishamos at a Yom Tov meal overrides the Gezairah?

I surely would think so, but I am not a Rov (and neither are you, obviously).

and for g-ds sake stop using your corrupt logic to pasken shalos

Oh, and chesed… I know you’re not going to listen to me because I’m an apikorus and all that, but it’s still proper and respectful to use a capital G in “G-d.”

The Wolf

gemara Baitzah 20:b you can’t cook for a goy

baitzah 21:b, and s”a o”c 512 you can’t invite a goy to a yom tov meal

Mishna Brurah 512 you can’t invite a goy even if the food was made before yom tov

now wolf, please do tell the name of the rav that said you can invite a goy for the yom tov meal??

BHTWIA

and cherrybim

well said

tb believe me if i wrote better, life would be easier. i don’t write much as my employees do it for me, so what you see is how i dictate it to them, not used to correcting it.

one thing for sure if i wrote like wolf, he wouldn’t stand a chance 🙂

arc stop wasting your breath and my time.

If more people would do the proper thing, and sit shiva and cut off these intermarrieds, you wouldn’t have these issues.

im more concerned with overmutaring

and you are more concerned with overassuring “

I want to over-assure you that I never been over-mature. 🙂

And if there is NO specific issur told to Moshe m’Sinai and written down in the Torah sheh b’al peh, then it is NOT an issur d’Oreisah. Even d’rabbanan, we have to be careful to differentiate between actual halacha and its gedarim, versus the gedarim ON the gedarim, which are chumros, and which every rov may hold differnetly. At least, let’s not be so quick to judge, and not to deride kulos that are within halachic guidelines. Hashem does not ask us to refrain from enjoying life – to the contrary. When we appear before Him after 120 years, He will ask us outright if we enjoyed the life He gave us and made use of the beautiful things in this world.

wolf

i find it interesting, you rant and rave how you outsmarted the torah. you made sandwiches before yom tov.

i kept saying it’s still not allowed.

you claimed to ask a rav, and asked me for proof it’s not allowed, i proved that proof. why the secret who the rav is?

and if you have nothing to back up your claim, you shouldn’t be posting non existent halachos on line.

if you would have formed it as a question that would be fine, but not well i serve sandwiches so that’s OK

Dealing with non-Jewish relatives is a complex issue and this should be dealt with your LOR who knows the whole situation.

I know many people who have had non-Jewish relatives over for holidays after consulting with their Rabbis. All Orthodox.

chesedname

i admire your kanois

i did not hear wolf either ranting or raving.

wolf did not claim to have outsmarted the Torah, he claimed to have acted within it’s bounds.

no one here needs to be pressured to discuss the name of their Rav.

and not only is it proper to capitalize G-d, certainly respect demands to capitalize Torah.

Thanks Mod80.

am i the only that cares of the hypocrisy here?

wolf says what he wants, you disagree, he says prove it, when you do he says ok enough of this conversation.