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The whole notion that we free murderers to jump-start the peace process does not make any sense.
If they were serious about living peacefully with us, they would not want us to free those people.
Brilliant point. The whole situation boggles the mind. It’s mamash what the gemara describes as happening before mashiach comes… that common sense will disappear and things will not make sense anymore.
I think the basic idea is that they don’t consider them murderers. They would view them more as soldiers/POWs. And you always free the POWs when the war ends.
It is very clear that the minimum the Arab Muslims will accept is that there be one state between the desert and the sea, and in that state Arab Muslims will be first class citizens – the official language being Arabic, Islamic law being respected and follow to the extent they want to follow it, and the rulers being Muslims. Anything else is temporary. This is unacceptable to virtually all Israelis other than a small number of hareidim (which might become “most” hareidim if the Israelis serious attempt to implement conscription of hareidim). The only possible peace solution would be for the Jews in Eretz Yisrael to settle for autonomy and rights while respecting that they are in the Arab middle east (and while they might insist on a nuclear equipped milita and right to use Hebrew in dealing with the government, they couldn’t insist on things that Islam opposes such as gay rights or liberal abortion laws).
From the Arab perspective, they have no “peace partner” since the minimum Israeli demand (a zionist state with boundaries the Arabs will respect) is totally unacceptable.
This arguing over the West Bank is silly, as most Muslims (and many Jews) to not distinguish between East and West Jerusalem, or between Hevron and Haifa.
Given that an increasing number of Israelis are unwilling to bear the burden of perpetual warfare (and note the number of non-frum draft evaders and non-frum Israeli Jews who fled the country and live abroad), the Israelis would be well advised to negotiate a peace agreement now, from a position of strength, rather than wait until one is imposed on them.
PBA: I completely agree. I’m just saying why they themselves and the world don’t think these requests are insane.
Actually, I don’t think the United States or anyone else is fooled. I think they don’t care. Nobody has a realistic vision of Yeladim Viyelados… Every new administration feels pressured to show that they are making progress in Peace in the Middle East. The Israeli government knows it will make no peace but are pressured to show that they are not the obsticle to peace. The trick is to try to talk more that you act and to procrastinate. I think Bibi is a great procrastinator, at least when it comes to giving away land.
The question is, who is everyone trying to impress? The Navi mocked us for trying to impress our neighbors in vein. The Medrash says that all those who tried making peace with the Bnei Keidar landed up with Bizyonos. The Rambam also mentions that you can’t speak peace with these people. I doubt anyone thinks you can.
Halevai there were a real war and we could wipe them out.
They are not terrorists. They are “freedom fighters.” Didn’t you know that? And much as I hate to be violent in thought or deed, I have to agree with WIY (except that I really DON’T want there to be another war).
There cannot be peace because they hold all life, including their own, very cheaply. When a mother can raise her baby to blow himself up, and be proud of him for it, that is as skewed and immoral as a person’s thinking can be.
There should be instated automatic death penalty (without death row) for all Arabs convicted of terrorism against civilians. No more freedom for those scum. It’s the only thing Bennett ever said right.
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