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I just read a wonderful article about what is happening in one high school. You can google “Grammarians in Hoodies” to read the entire article. Here is a wonderful excerpt:
“‘In the work force, grammar will be as important as this training of analyzing literature,’ says Ms. Bassett. ‘[These students] are not going to be paid in 20 years for analyzing literature.
“Her colleagues list several benefits that come from grammar instruction: clear cover letters, stronger writing skills, and an easier understanding of a foreign language, to name a few. If there is a bias toward one ‘correct’ way of speaking, well, they want their students to learn it.”
**Happy Dance**
dont worry, ill be waiting with a 12-gauge to make sure it doesnt.
I’d much rather see more time spent on other things, such as math. Asians may not have the best English grammar but that’s not stopping them from taking over.
I don’t dislike grammar due to it’s difficulty. I dislike grammar because in school it was the most boring subject out there. Math made sense. Spelling was important. Grammar was simply arbitrary and had tons of nonsensical rules and exceptions with complicated names for everything. My favorite game to play when someone was asking grammar questions was to ask them to use a participial as a dangling modifier in a sentence. Maybe one out of twenty even knew what that meant. Not to mention the fact that my grammar teachers were just plain awful. I remember Mr. G. from eighth grade who used to make us sit down with our grammar books for an hour straight every week and just “do the work”. Never learned a thing from that class (except for the fact that Mr. G. has high blood pressure and is prone to outbursts when he finds out that everyone who wasn’t Yitzi L. basically just shmoozed the entire hour every week for months in a row and that Rabbi Yaakov Horowitz of Project YES is actually a very kind and understanding person and will actually be able to convince the class to apologize to the teacher even when it’s obvious how wrong he was)
Grammar in one’s native language should not be a very difficult subject in school. Sure, there are names of grammatical concepts, (prepositions, interjections, etc) but if proper reading and speaking skills are developed, the proper following of grammar rules should follow almost naturally.
Applause for Haifagirl.
You know what haifagirl you are correct everyone should use proper grammar all the time, they should also exercise daily and eat all their vegetables but sometimes its okay not to do everything that is proper, we are after all human we are not perfect I don’t know why it is so hard for you to accept that not everyone is as concerned about this as you are.
Your constant criticism of every single grammar error is very tiring, you should be a bit more tolerant of those who are not as perfectly proper as you are.
I’m going to defend Haifagirl now, because I’ve seen less of her corrections than previously, and this was about a news article, not directly at a poster.
(Yes, I know, fewer. 🙂 )
im actually quite happy with her, shes never here anymore.
The intolerant issue I definitely hear, but if haifagirl would like to scrutinize her OWN posts 50 billion times before entering, I definitely don’t see a need to stop her. Although, it is a rather ridiculous waste of time.
C’mon, guys, it’s one thing to criticize her when she interrupts a discussion by scolding someone for poor grammar, but in this context, the attacks are unwarranted .
there is a typo in the OP
In your previous post, you omitted the “b” from “bother”.
You might still have time to fix it.
Edit: Good, you did have time.
DY +1
HG – Thanks for the ‘replacing him with whom’ tip. I don’t think I’ve ever gotten that right.
So when you see ‘to whom it may concern’, does that really mean ‘to him/her who it may concern?’ yikes…
On the treife internet, bad grammar exposes your lack of education and makes you sound like an idiot in general. It’s very hard to take someone seriously who can barely spell or use grammar.
I talk to people from all over the world on the web. The worst thing you can be is a “grammar Nazi” because you can’t expect everyone to be native English speakers.
Godwin’s Law!
WC,
Not applicable here; “Grammar Nazi”, as offensive as it may be, is a recognized expression.
The reason grammar as taught in school is so boring is that it’s usually taught as a series of inscrutable rules. If you’re interested in a more accessible method, check out Arthur Whimbey’s prototype-construction approach.
So that gets me off the hook, at least.
By definition, it gets anyone who writes as they speak off the hook.
Well said.
I agree that clear communication is very important.
Many people use impeccable grammar but still don’t communicate.
It’s interesting (tangential thought alert), I work with an Autistic boy whose language is very poor. Mostly quotes from videos and an occasional yes/no of his own. But he can complete reams of grammar sheets where he has to re-write sentences correctly, choose appropriate tenses, convert singular to plural based on context of the sentence. It is really amazing.
Many people use impeccable grammar but still don’t communicate.
thisthisthis
Syag – True but efshar l’kayem shneihem.
Haifa, obviously, some grammar is necessary for communication, but not nearly to the degree that you insist upon. Almost every correction I’ve seen you make was on a comprehensible post or article.
Honestly, I have learned over the years that one can communicate without grammar and even without language. It is all in the ‘hands’ of the listener. We develop our ability to hear and listen based on many things, primarily, how well we can work through the static. For you, static is poor grammar and it effects your ability to hear. For me, static is in the tone. Rude and haughty tones make it difficult for me to hear. The texting mode is also static for me and I just avoid it altogether. Others can handle the grammar mistakes and the tone, but their static is about how long the sentences are or how often the person says, “ya know?” etc.
Communication means giving over from one to another. It is put out there. The ability to receive/decipher it is in the power of the receiver. Whether the giver has the means or interest to resend lost messages is another thing to add to the pot, but as far as your original question is concerned, yes, one can communicate without grammar, but not all of us our prepared to received those messages.
*are
😉
(Sorry!! It’s like scratching an itch!!)
If that’s all you got out of that post than I, too, am sorry.
😉
haifagirl, we have found you a friend…her name is wanderingchana. Go have a chat about catching grammar booboos :P.
Alright, alright. I checked out the English Page site, noticed that my grammar needs work and am now working on my verb tenses.
“The mural is going to have been being painted by the famous artist for over six months by the time it is finished.”
ugh…
I’ll be POLITE and POLITELY say that perhaps it needs a bit of work.
Very good.
I try.
Who said anything about a comma? 🙂
Nobody did.
Are you sure you’re not feeling woozy? You’re a bit delusional at the moment.
Yes, Ari-free,two can play the same game.
(And if this goes on any further, our entire conversation will soon be erased. That could get interesting. It could also get quite repetitive.)
I thought I had written an very nice post that deserved more than just a self serving grammar correction. It just reinforces the impression I sometimes have that everyone here likes to talk, but very few bother to listen.
Self-serving, no; more like, diversionary in the traditional style of the CR.
Haifagirl knows that I am a fan of correct grammar, spelling, etc., but I think it makes her slightly uncomfortable. LOL…
Hmmmm. Is that because only one of you is polite? Does that make her nervous? (Not that I’m specifying :P) Go make friends! It’s up to you.
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