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January 15, 2013 11:16 pm at 11:16 pm #607814moshe hamelechMember
I remember being taught by my at least one Rebbi that a goy can not keep shabbos. First, I’m looking for a makor and second, what are the details to the Halacha.
January 15, 2013 11:23 pm at 11:23 pm #9201585fivetownsParticipantAvrohom Avinu wore tzitzis outdoors on Shabbos even though he had no obligation of tzitzis, thus he was “carrying” and not violating the prohibition (upon penalty of death) against a Goy keeping Shabbos.
January 15, 2013 11:24 pm at 11:24 pm #920159MorahRachMemberI in no way am educated enough in this to answer but, I know that someone going through the process of conversation cannot fully keep shabbos. I know of a story that goes something like this . A woman was in the process of converting to Judaism and decided that she would fully keep shabbos because she was converting anyway and she felt it was the right thing to do. One time when she met with the Rabbi she confessed that she had been trying so hard to fully keep shabbos, but as a smoker she just had to have one cigarette everyday including shabbos. He laughed and said something to the affect of it being good and you shouldn’t 100% keep shabbos until you are a Jew.
January 15, 2013 11:35 pm at 11:35 pm #920160em0616MemberSee: Gemoroh Sanhedrin 58B, and Rambam (Melachim 10:11)
January 15, 2013 11:39 pm at 11:39 pm #920161em0616Member5fivetowns: Maybe Avrohom Avinu was a Brisker and did not wear tzitzis on shabbos?
January 15, 2013 11:42 pm at 11:42 pm #920162popa_bar_abbaParticipantThat’s why this is also the answer to the riddle of “how do we know Avrohom Avinu was not a Brisker?”
Other answers include that edited
January 16, 2013 12:07 am at 12:07 am #920163moshe hamelechMemberCan anyone find the text from the Rambam? I can’t find it online and I’m several hundred miles from the nearest yeshiva or shul
January 16, 2013 12:19 am at 12:19 am #920164popa_bar_abbaParticipantJanuary 16, 2013 12:26 am at 12:26 am #920165em0616Member?? [?] ??? ???? ?????, ???? ????; ?? ????? ??? ???? ????? ???? ????. ??? ??? ????–????? ???? ????? ????–?? ??? ???? ????? ??? ???, ???? ????; ???? ???? ???? ?? ??? ???? ?????.
January 16, 2013 12:28 am at 12:28 am #920166moshe hamelechMemberI looked at melochim 10:11 and it seems to be about the chukim of beis din. Idk if I’m looking in the wrong place but can someone help me out here?
January 16, 2013 2:16 am at 2:16 am #920167OdAmiChayMemberThe Halacha is that a goy who keeps shabbos is chayiv misa a goy who learns torah is also chayav misa. This halacha is disscussed in the gemara is sanhedrid.
The reoson a goy who learns Torah is chaya misa can be found in a drasha. The passuk calls the torah a “Morasha” or inheritence(for lack of better word) the gemara tells us – al tikri morasha ela meorasa. The torah is a meorasa a women who is engaged but not yet married. She is set aside for her husband and only him. So to the Torah is set aside for the Jewish people alone.
Similarly Shabbos is also just for the Jewish people and not for the non Jews. There is a machlokes however what the nature of “Shavas” is. It either means regular shabbos like we have which is just for us or it may also mean take a day off from work. The reoson according to the latter sevara is that a jew’s purpose is to serve hashem and learn… a non Jew is supposed to work, contribute to society not to take off random days and so nothing – like every sunday 🙂 However I believe the common understanding is that the prohibition stems from the former reosons.
Additionaly the umos haolam have 7 mitzvos if they violate any of them there is a din of misa – that is the standered punishment. This is if they do not set up there own set of Dinim if they do maybe not. ALso not clear if dinim is on the 7 mitzvos or rile of law in genaral.
Ayein the gemara sanhedrin and the RAMBAM
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