“Frum” female singers on YouTube

I wouldn’t think a public Jewish figure, how much more so a female singer where things are more complicated, would do anything big such as releasing music videos on YouTube or CDs etc. without having advice and had guidelines established by THEIR Asei Lecho Rav, in case you were wondering i think the position is already taken. The real question is with YOU! If you end up in a vulnerable position where you may be listening to something Assur for YOU then the question is on YOU! Should Avraham Fried not put his music videos on YouTube because some Jew might be “have a natural tendency to be attracted to” authentic Jewish music and thus watch Avraham frieds music on Shabbos. In order to avoid this Avraham Fried Has it written on his CDs not to watch on Shabbos similarly the female Jewish singers whom I am referring to have it written in the titles of their videos clearly “For Women and Girls Only”. I don’t find it right that Self proclaimed TJW (Tznius Justice Warriors) Namely men whom involve themselves in all matters of tznius with women despite a lack of rabbinical approval in their “Expert” area, keep making threads in Lace sheitels, short skirts, and other areas which should only be addressed by someone who is rabbinically approved in this area and is the “Asei Lecho Rav” of the women or girls he is addressing.

The idea here is that women don’t live in a man’s world. Rather, men and women share this world and need to learn how to give each other the privacy and respect so that each gender has an opportunity to enjoy it.

Women like to remember the good times they had at a wedding and they like listening (and creating) music and would like to participate in these healthy kosher activities without being encroached upon by men. So if men would kindly give women the privacy and respect we can share this planet without abusing each other’s rights.

There is no prohibition of women signing. The prohibition is on men listening to them. On YouTube, no one makes you listen or watch anything – you have to click on something to make it play.

On one hand, it isn’t so bderech tznius. On the other, it can give a bas yisroel a positive influence on YouTube. Would you rather a Jewish girl watch a video of a goyish singer on YouTube or her to watch a video of a Jewish female singer that can bring her inspiration? We’re not in the vilna ghetto anymore.

There is a lot of good stuff on youtube as my son’s wedding searched by lipa macarena where lipa schmeltzer is singing Aishes Chayil to them. The kalever ztz’l singing Szol a kakas mar. People who are not here anymore live on in their performance.

I don’t understand the logic to say that “men will anyways hear female singers” –
I assume we are discussing a frum singer who dresses tzniusdik. Why must she dress tzniusdik? People will anyways see immodesty!

Obviously, every person is responsible for themselves to behave tzniusdik in public. The same should seemingly apply to singing –
“קול באשה ערוה, שנאמר כי קולך ערב ומראך נאוה” (Brachos 24a).

The comparison between a CD and YouTube is ridiculous.

On the other hand, @lakewhut has a very important point: Jewish female singers can be a good influence for Jewish girls instead of the other shmutz on youtube.

Of course, like everything in the life of a frum Yid, every singer must consult her personal rov who can inspect the pros and cons and rule accordingly. I assume that they do so, and therefore there is really no need for us to tell them what to do.

ujm:
I wouldn’t say that it’s “usually not the case” that there is a separate female photographer for the women, but it depends on the social circle, sect, etc.

Rav Moshe in Even ho’ezer 62 uses the “tarud bemelachto” heter to allow women to swim with a male lifeguard, while saying that wives of talmidei chachamim should not do so. Does he mean to allow a man to have such a job? Possibly not.

Avira, what if the man’s only professional achievement were in swimming and this is an only legit job he could get? I know someone who got a psak to work in a ballet studio. Decided not to use it, though.

As a frum woman, I have hard time justifying men complain at the lack of tznius in public areas. While they are technically right but lower the volume, men! Are we to expect a frum man to be so fickle as to have no control of where his eyes roam?! Maybe learn self control to a degree.

‘Are we to expect a frum man to be so fickle as to have no control of where his eyes roam?! Maybe learn self control to a degree…”

The author of the OP here (and literally dozens of others on the same theme) is apparently a poster-child for the lack of self control among a segment of the male frum tzibur who has projected his weakness and lack of self-discipline on everyone else. You don’t originate 183 threads on variations of your tzinius adiction without some really perverted agenda.

You Tube always asks you “Do you want to see this (almost) naked lady” or “Do you want to hear a woman signing”. If fact, almost all sites with “inappropriate” materials ask you if you want to see them, or are set up so you have to go looking for it. It’s really no different from the real world (unless a man makes an effort to see a naked lady, he won’t just see one walking down the street).

Avira > Perhaps he should work for the sanitation department.

I am glad that you support the work for yidden rather than taking tzedoka. Warning though: these jobs are lucrative and are often run by mafia. Also there are two guys there and it is not clear which position is more hashuv: the guy upfront thinks “at least I am not actually throwing garbage” and the guy in the back says “this front guy is a slacker while I am really doing the whole job”.

Ujm has quite an imagination. Women see a huge difference between singing and swimming even if men don’t.

@Shmiras Haloshon, ujm obviously has only seen wedding videos on VHS tapes, hence the ignorance.

“What does that have to do with the soul-destroying power of pritzus in the eyes of a jewish man….”?

When obviously misogynistic trolls are cloaked in an obsessive concern for tzinius and triggers broad hyperbolic generalizations, its a big concern. “Pritzus”, as broadly defined by the
“tzinius police” encompasses both real socially destructive forms of addictive behavior and borderline criminal activities that are incredibly harmful from both a physical and spiritual perspective. However, when otherwise “normal” activities such as hearing a woman’s recorded voice or seeing a short clip of women dancing at a simcha are equated to porn addictions etc., it often becomes an effort to rationalize subordination of women in the name of protecting the neshama of some guys who need to work on their own issues.

Gadol – my point is that there’s no comparison between a non-addicted, healthy man’s yatzer hora, which can be triggered by women singing and dancing, and the “ew, gross” reaction women have to men not being tznius. The two are completely different. One is “lo yinakeh midinoh shel gehinnon” if one looks at the small finger of a woman for pleasure, and the other is a nuisance like seeing dead rats on the street.

As for equating all shmiras aynayim/kedushah inyonim to addictions – so what? What does that have to do with my points in this thread? I never once brought up addiction or more extreme behaviors.

Saying “this is “normal” not like X behavior which is criminal (any aveirah is a crime against Hashem)” is reductive. You’re trivializing the nisyonos of ehrlich jews around the world and making it out to be as if it’s only a problem if it goes to a certain extreme that you arbitrarily decided. As i said, etzbah katana is enough to land a jew in gehinnom; that can’t be reduced by the contrast to *bigger” sins.

ujm – even live, if you are given a choice between having to walk down a street that has women singing, or one where they are dressed inappropriately, the choice is very clear. Not all erva is the same. The same way there’s a difference between a woman in short sleeves and one in a swimsuit, even though both are exposing erva. It’s a davar pashut.

Gadol; how in the world does “greater adherence to tzinius guidelines” have anything to do with degradation or subordination? It’s the opposite; by dressing more tznius, a woman is more dignified and less objectified, and seen as merely a vehicle for lust for men.

When feminists say they want to dress provocatively “for themselves” and champion pritzus as a means of “liberation,” what they’re saying is that “don’t objectify and sexualize us, but….look, we’re going to be super provocative, right in your face, in ways that we know are designed around men’s preferences and desires….objectification is only a problem if it’s forced upon us”

Lets be clear. No one here has been arguing in support of women dressing “provocatively” (or at least I’m not). My concern is that there is a spectrum of tzinius concerns (aka “not all ervah is the same”) and there seems to be a tendency to push the limits where musavr over an inch or so around the elbow or knee has become a more frequent rant

I really don’t understand people complaining about whats available on YouTube. If you’re on unfiltered YouTube then you are not a victim to whatever you choose to watch.