Home › Forums › Bais Medrash › For PF to Vicariously Rant Endlessly About the Over-Emphasis of Iyun through PAA
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July 15, 2014 10:57 pm at 10:57 pm #1045880Patur Aval AssurParticipant
So for anyone who is still reading this, I think it’s time for another updated list:
Shabbos 63a with Rashi
Eruvin 48a with Rashi
Sanhedrin 42a with Rashi
Avodah Zara 19a with Rashi
Avodah Zara 19a with Rashi (there are two different gemaras on 19a which I quoted)
Medrash Mishlei 10
Orchos Tzadikim Shaar Hatorah
Maharal Tiferes Yisroel Perek 56
Maharal Nesivos Olam Nesiv Hatorah Perek 5
Maharal Chiddushei Aggados Sanhedrin
Maharal Gur Aryeh Parshas Vaeschanan
Maharsha Bava Metzia 85a
Shelah Maseches Shavuos 22, 25-35
Vavei Ha’amudim 5:14
Maadnei Yom Tov Hakdama
Kli Yakar Amudei Shesh Amud Hatorah
Chavos Yair siman 124
Yaavetz
Sifsei Yeshanim
Chayei Adam Hakdama Acharona
Pri Megadim
Even Shlaima 8:2
He’aros ??
Even Shlaima 8:7
Shulchan Aruch Harav Hilchos Talmud Torah 2:1
Pele Yoetz Asupa
Pele Yoetz Girsa
Pele Yoetz Yesod
Ohr Yisrael Iggeres 27
Dor Revii Hakdama
Chofetz Chaim Likutei Amarim perek 4
Chofetz Chaim Likutei Amarim perek 5
Lev Aryeh hakdama
Seridei Eish letter
Shu”t Mishneh Halachos 8:247
Shevet Halevi 2:57
R’ Eliyahu Feinstein
R’ Baruch Ber Leibowitz
R’ Yaakov Kamenetsky
R’ Moshe Feinstein
R’ Elazar Menacham Man Shach
R’ Berel Soloveitchik
R’ Moshe Chevroni
R’Aharon Yehuda Leib Shteinman
R’ Michel Yehuda Lefkowitz
R’ Yosef Shalom Elyashiv
July 18, 2014 4:22 pm at 4:22 pm #1045881Patur Aval AssurParticipantToldos Adam Perek 3:
??? ???? ????? ????? ????? ???? ??? ??? ?????? ??????? ???? ????? ????? ??”? ?”? ???? ??????? ??’ ??”? ??? ?????? ??? ???? ?????? ??? ????? ??? ??????? ?? ???? ??????? ????? ????? ???? ????? ????? ??????? ??? ?? ????? ?? ????? ????? ???? ?????? ????? ??????? ???? ???? ????? ????? ????? ??? ??? ???? ???? ?? ?? ?????? ?? ???? ????? ???? ?? ???? ??? ???? ??? ??? ????? ??? ???? ???? ?????? ??? ???? ?????? ????? ???? ????? ??? ?? ????? ???? ?????? ???? ?????? ???? ????? ??????
July 18, 2014 6:10 pm at 6:10 pm #1045882Patur Aval AssurParticipantToldos Adam Perek 3 continued:
??? ??? ????? ??? ???? ?? ???? ??? ?????? ???? ?? ??? ??????? ???? ???? ??”? ???? ????? ??????? ?????? ??????? ???? ??? ???? ?? ???? ????? ????? ????? ?? ??? ??? ???? ???? ???? ????? ????? ??????? ??? ??? ???? ????? ?? ?? ???????? ??? ???? ???? ?? ??? ?? ???? ???? ?”? ????? ???? ??? ???? ???’ ???”?
July 20, 2014 2:44 am at 2:44 am #1045883Patur Aval AssurParticipantToldos Adam Perek 3 continued:
??? ?? ???? ?? ??? ???? ?? ????? ?? ???? ??????? ??? ??? ?????? ??? ??? ??? ???? ???? ???? ??? ???? ????? ??? ?? ??? ?? ??? ??? ??? ??? ???? ??”? ?????? ????? ????? ????? ????? ??? ??? ??? ???? ????? ??? ?? ????? ????? ??????? ?? ?? ??? ?????? ?????? ???? ???? ????? ?? ???? ????? ??? ???? ???? ??? ???????? ????? ??????? ???? ????? ????? ???? ???? ??? ??????? ?????? ??????? ?????? ?? ??? ??? ??? ???? ??????? ????? ???? ?? ????
July 20, 2014 6:19 pm at 6:19 pm #1045884Patur Aval AssurParticipantToldos Adam Perek 3 continued:
???? ????? ?????? ??? ???? ?????? ??”? ?????? ????? ????? ?????? ???? ??????? ?????? ????? ??????? ?? ??? ??????? ?????? ???’ ??? ???? ???? ???? ?? ?? ????? ?? ?? ?????? ?? ?????? ?? ????? ??? ???? ???? ?? ??? ??? ?? ??? ??? ???? ????? ?? ??? ?????? ?????? ??? ????? ???? ????? ?? ?? ?????? ??????? ?? ????? ?????? ????? ????? ?? ?? ????? ?? ????? ??? ???? ?? ???? ?? ??? ????? ???? ???? ??? ??? ??? ??? ???? ?????? ?? ?? ?????? ?? ????? ??? ?????? ???? ????? ????? ???? ?????? ?? ?????? ??? ??? ???? ??? ????? ???? ?????? ??????? ????? ????? ????? ????? ????? ???? ???????? ????? ?????? ?? ??? ?? ?????? ?? ??? ???? ???? ??? ??? ???? ??? ???? ?? ??? ?????? ???? ??? ???? ?????? ???? ???? ?? ?????? ?? ???? ?????? ???? ???? ???? ??? ??”? ????? ????? ?? ??????? ??? ??? ???? ???? ???? ?? ???? ???? ?? ???? ????? ????? ?? ???? ??? ??? ???? ???? ????? ????? ?????? ????? ??? ????? ?? ??????? ??? ?????? ????? ???? ???? ???? ????? ??? ???? ???? ???? ????? ???? ??????
July 20, 2014 9:34 pm at 9:34 pm #1045885Patur Aval AssurParticipant???? ???? ???? ?????? ?? ???? ??? ?????? ?? ????? ??????? ??????? ?? ??? ???? ??? ?? ???? ?? ???? ????? ???? ?? ??? ???? ???? ???????? ???? ??? ????? ??? ???? ???????? ???? ???? ?? ???? ?? ???? ?? ?? ???? ??????? ???? ??? ???? ??? ???? ??? ????? ???? ??? ?????? ?? ?? ??? ????? ????? ??????? ?????? ????? ????? ???????
July 20, 2014 9:45 pm at 9:45 pm #1045886Patur Aval AssurParticipant?? ?????? ?? ??? ???? ???? ?? ???? ??? ??? ???? ??? ???? ???? ????? ???? ?? ??? (?????? ????”? ??’ ??”?) ??”? ????? ???? ??? ???? ??”? ??? ???? ??? ?????? ??? ??? ???? ??? ??? ??? ??? ?????? ??????? ???? ????? ??? ?????? ?????? ?? ??? ?? ???? ??? ??? ?????? ??????? ???? ???? ??? ?????? ??? ???? ????? ????? ??????? ??? ??? ???? ????? ?? ??? ?????? ??? ??????? ??????? ???? ?????? ?????? ????? ????? ??? ???? ??? ?? ?? ??? ?? ?? ???? ?? ????? ???????? ????? ??? ??????? ???? ?????? ?? ?????? ????? ???? ??? ??? ???? ?????? ????? ???? ????? ??????? ???? ?? ???? ?????? ??? ???? ?????
?? ?? ???? ??? ?????? ??? ?????? ????? ????????? ???? ?? ??? ???? ????? ???? ??”? ??? ?? ?? ???? ?? ???? ?”?
July 20, 2014 10:27 pm at 10:27 pm #1045887Patur Aval AssurParticipantThe last two posts are also continued from Toldos Adam Perek 3
July 21, 2014 2:56 am at 2:56 am #1045888Patur Aval AssurParticipantToldos Adam Perek 3 continued:
?????? ???? ??? ???? ???? ??? ???? ???? ?????? ????? ????? ????? ??? ??????? ???? ???? ??? ????? ???? ??? ???? ???? ??????? ??? ???? ??? ?? ???? ??? ???? ????? ???? ????? ?????? ??? ????? ????? ?????? ???? ?????? ?? ??????? ?????? ??????? ??? ??? ???? ???? ????? ?? ???? ??? ??? ?? ??? ?? ???’ ??? ??? ?????? ??? ?????? ?????? ????? ??????? ???? ?????? ??? ??? ????? ?? ?????? ??? ?? ???? ?? ??? ????
July 21, 2014 3:04 pm at 3:04 pm #1045889Patur Aval AssurParticipant???? ????? ??? ???? ???? ????? ?? ??? ???? ???? ???? ????? ???? ??? ??? ????? ???? ??? ???? ???? ?? ?? ???? ????? ???? ?????? ?????? ?? ???? ???? ?? ??? ????? ???? ??? ??? ???? ??? ????? ????? ???’ ??? ???? ??? ?????? ??????? ??? ???’ ??? ?’ ???? ??? ??? ???? ?? ???? ???? ?????? ?????? ?????? ?????? [??? ??? ?’ ???? ???? ????] (?? ??? ?????? ???? ???? ???? ???? ??? ???? ???????) ?? ????? ??? ???? ????? ??? ?????? ?????? ????? ??? ??? ?’ ???? ???? ???? ??? ??? ???? ???? ?? ??? ????? ???’ ??? ?? ????? ???? ??? ??? ???? ????? ??”? ????? ???????? ??????? ??”? ??? ??? ???? ??? ?? ?????? ??? ??? ??? ???? ?? ???? ?????? ??? ???? ??
????? ????? ??? ?? ??? ??? ??? ?? ?? ?????? ???? ???? ??”? ????? ???? ?? ?? ???? ?’ ??? ?? ??? ???? ????? ???? ?? ???? ????? ?? ???? ???? ??”? ?? ????? ??????? ???? ???
July 21, 2014 5:34 pm at 5:34 pm #1045890Patur Aval AssurParticipantThe last quote and this one are further along in Toldos Adam Perek 3:
?”? ???? ??? ???? ?? ???? ???? ????? ?? ??? ???? ???? ???? ????? ???? ???? ???? ???? ??? ????? ????? ??????? ??????? ??”? ???? ???? ?? ????? ?? ?? ??? ?? ??? ????? ?? ????? ??? ?? ??? ???? ??? ???”? ???? ???? ???? ?? ????? ???? ??? ?????? ???? ???? ??? ??? ???? ?? ??? ???? ????? ?? ??? ???? ????? ?? ???? ??? ?????? ???’ ??????? ?????? ?? ??? ???? ??????? ???? ????? ????? ???? ?????? ??????? ??????? ???? ????? ????? ?? ??? ???? ????? ??????? ????? ??? ??? ???? ???? ???? ???? ???”? ??? ????? ????? ?? ????? ??? ????? ????? ?? ?? ?? ???? ????? ?? ?????? ?????? ???? ?????
??????? ?????? ???? ?????? ???? ????? ?? ????? ?? ?????? ????? ????? ????? ?? ??? ???? ??? ??? ????? ?? ????? ????? ??????? [??? ?? ?????? ??”? ?? ???? ???? ?????] ?? ?? ????? ????? ????? ????????
July 21, 2014 10:28 pm at 10:28 pm #1045891Patur Aval AssurParticipantContinued:
???? ???? ????? ?? ?? ??? ??? ???? ???? ???? ???? ?? ???? ?????? ???
????? ??? ?? ????? ???? ??? ?????? ??? ?????? ???? ??? ????? ???? ????? ??? ????? ?????? ???? ????? ??????? ??????? ????? ?? ???? ??????
July 21, 2014 10:48 pm at 10:48 pm #1045892Patur Aval AssurParticipantContinued:
??? ?? ?????? ?????? ?????? ?????? ?’ ???? ??? ????? ??? ????? ??? ???? ???? ???? ?? ??? ???? ??? ????? ?????? ???? ?????? ???? ????? (??? ????? ????? ??”?) ?????? ???? ??? ????? ???? ????? ?? ??? ????? ??? ????? ?????? ?? ?????? ???? ??? ????? ?? ??? ???? ??? ???? ???? ???? ????? ????? ???? ?????? ??????? ????? ?????? ?????? ???? ????? ??”? ???? ???? ?? ??? ?? [???? ?? ???? ???? ?? ??? ???? ???? ??? ??? ??] ??? ?? ????? ???? ?? ????? ?????? ?? ??”? ?????? ?????? ?? ??? ???? ??? ????? ???? ????? ????? ??? ??? ?”?
July 21, 2014 11:39 pm at 11:39 pm #1045893Patur Aval AssurParticipantContinued:
??? ????? ????? ????? ?? ??? ??? ?????? ???? ???????? ???? ?? ?????? ??”? ??? ???? ????? ?? ?”? ?? ?????? ?? ???? ????? ?”? ????? ????? ???? ???? ?????? ???? ???? ????? ????? ???? ????? ????? ???? ?????? ?? ?? ??? ????? ?? ?”? ?? ???? ???? ?????? ????? ???? ??? ??”? ???? ???? ???? ??”? ?????? ?? ??? ???? ????? ??? ??? ???? ????? ?? ????? ???? ???? ?? ??? ??? ????? ?????? ?? ??? ??? ???? ??? ????? ???”? ?”? ????? ??????? ?????? ???? ????? ?????? ?????? ????? ????? ???? ?????? ????????? ????? ????? ??????? ???
?????? ????? ?????? ??? ???? ??? ???”? ?????? ????? ??? ????? ????? ????”? ?????? ???? ??? ????? ?? ????? ??????
July 22, 2014 11:36 pm at 11:36 pm #1045894Patur Aval AssurParticipantBinyan Ariel Parshas Haazinu:
??? ???? ?????: ??? ???? ????? ??? ???? ?? ??? ???? ???? ?? ???
???? ????? ???????? ????? ????? ???? ???? ?? ??? ????? ???? ??????? ????? ????? ????? ?? ???? ????? ???? ??? ??????? ???
????? ??? ?????? ?? ???? ???? ????? ???? ???? ???? ?????? ???? ????? ???????? ????? ?? ???? ??? ?? ??????? ??? ?? ???? ?? ??? ??? ???? ????? ??”? ????? ????”? ????? ??’ ??? ??????? ???? ??? ????? ????? ???? ??? ???? ??”? ????’ ???’ ???? ?? ??’ ?”? ???? ????? ????? ?????? ????? ??? ???? ???”? ???? ?????? ?”? ????? ?? ?? ?? ????? ????? ??? ???? ????? ?????? ???? ???? ????? ?????? ???? ????? ??? ????? ??? ????? ?”? ???? ????? ?????? ?? ???’ ??? ???? ???? ?? ??? ???? ??????? ??? ????? ?????? ??????? ????? ????? ??? ???? ??? ?? ???? ?? ????? ????? ??? ?? ???? ??? ????? ????? ???????? ?? ?”? ?”? ??? ????? ?????? ????? ??’ ??? ???? ??? ???????? ????? ???? ?? ???? ???? ????? ??? ????? ?????? ???? ??
July 24, 2014 10:19 pm at 10:19 pm #1045895secretagentyidMemberIn your next list, include the two gemorrahs in brachos— has veachar kach kesses(very explicit rashi there i think i remember) and sinay kodem
July 24, 2014 11:07 pm at 11:07 pm #1045896Patur Aval AssurParticipant“In your next list, include the two gemorrahs in brachos— has veachar kach kesses(very explicit rashi there i think i remember) and sinay kodem”
I didn’t quote the first gemara because I already had quoted a Rashi who quoted that Gemara so it would be cheap to then quote the gemara. Similarly I already mentioned sinai vs. oker harim and that it is a machlokes between the Pri Megadim and R’ Shlomo Kluger if it still applies nowadays with the proliferation of seforim.
July 28, 2014 2:58 pm at 2:58 pm #1045897Patur Aval AssurParticipantTzava’ah of the Shelah’s son R’ Sheftel ??? ??:
??? ?????? ????? ????? ?????? ??? ???? ??? ???? ?????? ????? ?? ??????? ?????? ?? ???? ?????? ??? ????????? ????? ???? ???? ??? ???? ??? ????? ?? ???? ??? ??????? ????? ?? ????? ??? ?? ??? ??? ??? ????? ????? ???? ?? ????? ????? ??? ?????? ???? ????? ????? ???? ????? ?? ????? ?? ????? ?????? ????? ????? ?? ??? ?? ???
July 28, 2014 3:23 pm at 3:23 pm #1045898Patur Aval AssurParticipantcontinued:
?????? ???”? ?????? ??? ???? ?????? ???? ?? ??????? ??? ??? ????? ?????? ???? ?????? ??? ?? ?? ??????? ??? ?????? ????? ?????? ?? ??? ???? ????? ??? ???? ??? ?? ??????? ??? ???? ???”? ???? ????”? ?????? ?????? ????? ?????? ??? ????? ??? ??? ?????? ???? ??”? ???? ???? ?? ????? ????? ??? ????? ??? ???”? ????? ???? ????? ?? ?????? ????? ???? ?????? ?????? ????? ?? ?? ???? ??? ????? ???? ???? ???? ????? ?????? ?? ???????? ??????? ?? ???? ????? ?????? ?? ??? ????? ?? ????????
July 28, 2014 7:12 pm at 7:12 pm #1045899Patur Aval AssurParticipantcontinued:
????? ??? ??? ?????? ????? ?????? ???? ?????? ????? ???? ???? ???? ??? ???? ????? ???? ?????? ???? ?? ????? ???? ????? ???? ?”? ????? ??? ??? ???? ?????? ???? ??? ?? ??? ?????? ?????? ???? ???? ??? ??? (????) [????] ???? ??? ???? ??????? ?????? ???? ?? ?? ??? ?????? ??? ?????? ??? ??? ?????? ???? ????? ?????? ???? ???
July 29, 2014 11:37 pm at 11:37 pm #1045900Patur Aval AssurParticipantTzava’ah of the Shelah’s son R’ Sheftel ??? ??:
???? ???? ???? ??? ????? ???? ????? ???”? ??????? ?? ????? ??????? ??? ???? ???? ?????? ??? ????? ?????? ?????? ????? ????? ????? ????? ????? ???? ???? ????? ??????? ????? ??? ??? ????? ????? ???? ?????? ?? ???? ?? ????? ???? ????? ????? ?????? ???? ???? ???? ????? ?????? ??????? ??????? ????? ???? ?????? ??? ????? ??? ?”? ??”? ??? ????? ???? ??”? ???? ???? ???? ???? ?”? ????? ????? ?????? ????? ?????? ??? ?? ???? ??? ?????? ?”? ?????? ???? ??? ????? ????? ?????? ??? ??? ?????? ???? ??? ????? ?? ??? ????? ????? ?????? ??? ??’ ???? ????? ???? ???’ ????? ???? ???? ???? ????? ????? ?????? ?? ???? ???? ????? ???”? ??? ?????
July 30, 2014 3:22 am at 3:22 am #1045901Sam2ParticipantPAA: So what’s your secret for all of these Mareh Mekomos? I’m guessing there’s an extended series of Seforim Blog articles on this topic?
July 30, 2014 3:50 am at 3:50 am #1045902Patur Aval AssurParticipantAlthough I do read seforim blog, I haven’t seen any articles there specifically on this topic. The only sources that I posted here that I have seen on seforim blog are the Lev Aryeh and the letter from the Seridei Eish.
July 30, 2014 4:22 am at 4:22 am #1045903Patur Aval AssurParticipantCorrection:
I did not see those two sources on seforim blog. I saw them in an article by Dr. Marc Shapiro.
July 30, 2014 9:44 pm at 9:44 pm #1045904Patur Aval AssurParticipant????? ???? ??? ??
???? ????? ?? ??? ?”? ?????? ????? ???? ?? ??? ?????? ?????? ??
????? ?????? ?”? ????? ??? ????? ???”? ??? ??? ??? ???? ????? ????? ?? ??? ??? ???? ???? ??? ??? ???? ???? ?? ????? ????? ??????
????? ??? ????? ????? ?? ?????? ?????? ???? ???? ??? ??? ??? ??? ????? ????? ?? ?? ?? ???? ???? ????? ??????? ????? ???”? ??? ?????? ???? ??? ???? ???? ????? ???? ??? ?????? ??????? ???? ?????? ?????? ????? ??? ???? ?????? ????? ??????? ????? ???? ????? ???? ?? ???? ?????? ???”? ??? ??? ??? ???????? ???? ????? ???
????? ??? ???? ?? ??? ???? ??? ???? ???? ??? ??? ???? ????? ??????? ??? ????? ?? ???? ??? ????? ????? ????? ????? ?????? ???? ??? ??? ????? ??? ?????? ?????? ???? ???? ???? ??? ???? ???”? ??????? ????? ????? ?????? ??? ???? ????? ??????? ???? ?? ??? ?? ??? ?? ?? ??? ?”? ???? ????? ????? ??? ????? ??? ???? ???? ?? ???? ?????? ????? ??? ????? ???? ???? ??? ???? ????”? ??? ???? ????? ?????? ????? ?? ???? ???? ?? ????? ?? ????? ???? ???? ???? ?????? ???? ????? ??????? ??????? ?? ?? ???? ????? ???? ????? ????? ???? ?? ???? ????? ?????? ???? ???? ???? ????? ?? ??? ?????? ?? ???? ?????? ????? ??? ??? ???? ?? ???? ???? ???? ??? ??? ???? ??? ???? ?? ???? ????? ???”? ??? ???? ???”? ?? ????? ?????? ???? ????? ??? ????? ???? ????? ??? ???? ??????? ???? ???? ??????? ???? ???? ????? ??”? ??? ???? ????? ?????? ???? ??? ????? ????? ???? ?????? ?????? ??? ????? ???? ???? ????
July 31, 2014 3:53 am at 3:53 am #1045905Patur Aval AssurParticipant???? ???? ??? ?
?????? ????? ????? ??? ????? ???? ??? ?? ????? ???? ?????? ?????? ?????? ????? ??????? ?????? ???? ?? ???? ??? ????? ??? ????? ?????? ?? ??? ?????? ????? ???? ?? ??? ????? ??????? ???????? ????? ????? ???”? ????? ?? ??????? ?? ???? ??? ?? ???????? ??? ????? ?????? ??? ?????? ?????? ????? ???? ?? ???? ???? ??? ??? ????? ?”?
August 1, 2014 3:30 am at 3:30 am #1045906Patur Aval AssurParticipantOk I just noticed that someone added endlessly into the title. I may set a record for the most title changes.
Unlikely to change again. I’ve hit the character limit. 🙂 -100
August 1, 2014 5:03 am at 5:03 am #1045907Sam2Participant100: A title change does not necessarily have to add words.
August 1, 2014 6:18 am at 6:18 am #1045908YW Moderator-💯ModeratorI didn’t say it’s impossible. 🙂
August 1, 2014 12:52 pm at 12:52 pm #1045910Patur Aval AssurParticipantIt’s ok, I like the title changes. It adds an element of surprise.
August 3, 2014 4:00 am at 4:00 am #1045911Patur Aval AssurParticipantYalkut Hagershoni Chagiga 5a:
???? ???”? ???? ????? ?? ?? ????? ????? ????? ????? ???? ??? ?? ??”? ?? ????? ????? ????? ???’ ????? ????”? ??”? ??? ??”? ???’ ?? ??? ??? ????’ ?????? ??”? ????? ?? ?? ?????? ???? ??”? ?”? ???”? ???”? ??’ ?”? ????? ????? ????? ???? ???? ????? ?????? ???? ???? ?? ???? ???”? ???? ?????? ???? ?? ????? ??? ??????? ????? ????? ?”? ??? ???? ????? ???? ????? ???? ?????? ????? ?????”? ?????? ???????? ???? ????? ??? ????? ?? ????? ???? ???? ???? ????? ??? ??’ ??? ????? ?? ??’ ????’ ????? ??? ??”? ?????? ???? ??? ???? ????? ?????? ??? ??? ????? ??”? ????? ???”? ?? ?? ??”? ?? ????? ????? ??? ????? ???? ???? ?? ???? ?????”? ???? ????? ???? ???? ???? ???? ??? ????? ??”?
August 3, 2014 4:31 am at 4:31 am #1045912Patur Aval AssurParticipantWhen I first started quoting sources, I wasn’t going in any particular order. Therefore it happened that there were a couple of Gemaros which were quoted by some of the sources which I had already posted and therefore I didn’t bother quoting the Gemaros themselves afterwards. But since some people didn’t realize this and since I am compiling a list, I will now quote those Gemaros and then I can add them to the next list.
Berachos 63b:
??? ??? ???? ???? ????? ?? ???? ?? ??? ????? ???? ??? ????? ????? ??? ???? ???? ?? ????
Rashi there:
?? ???? ?? ??? ???? ??? ???? ??? ???? ????? ??????? ?? ???? ????? ???? ??? ?? ?? ????? ?????? ?? ???? ?? ????? ????? ???? ?? ??? ?? ?????? ???? ?????? ?? ?????? ??
Horayos 14a (as well as in other places):
??? ??? ????? ????? ?? ??? ????? ?? ?????? ????? ?? ??? ???? ???? ??? ??? ???? ???? ???? ?? ???? ???? ??? ???? ???? ???? ???? ???? ??? ???? ???? ??? ???? ???? ???? ?? ??? ?????? ???? ????
August 3, 2014 4:31 pm at 4:31 pm #1045913Patur Aval AssurParticipantPanim Yafos Genesis 22:1
???? ??? ?????? ???? ???’ ???? ????? ?????? ??????? ????? ???? ?????? ??? ????? ??? ?????? ???? ?????? ????? ?????? ???? ???? ???? ???? ????? ?????? ???”? [??????? ????? ?”? ?”?] ???? ?????? ????? ????? ???? ?? ????? ???? ?? ??? ???’ ?????? ?????? ??? ????? ??”? [??? ?? ?] ???? ????? [???????] ????? ???? ????? [?????] ??? ???”? ?? ???? ?? ?? ???? ???? ???? ????? ??? ???? ??? ????? ?????? ??????? ????? ??? ?’ ????? ???? ????? ??? ????? ???? ????? ??????? ?????? [????? ???, ??] ??????? ????? ???? ???”? ???? ?? ???”? ????? ???? ???? ??? ?? ????? ?????? ???? ????? ??? ?? ????? ????? ??? ???”? [??? ?? ?] ?????? ????? ???? ?????? ????? ??? [????? ?? ?] ???? ???? ?? ???”? ??? ??? ????? ?????? ????? ???? ??? ???? ????? ??”? ????? [??”? ?, ??] ????? ??????? ????? ??????? ?????? ???? ?????? ???”? ???????? ????? ???? ??? ??? ?????? ?? ????? ????? ????? ??????? ?????? ???? ????? ??? ????? ?????? ????? ??? ??? ?? ???? ???? ?????
August 6, 2014 3:47 am at 3:47 am #1045914Patur Aval AssurParticipantKesubos 50a:
??? ??? ??? ?? ??? ????? ?? ???? ???? ??? ??? ?? ????? ?? ??? ???? ???? ??? ?????
(This is more of an implication from the lashon of “??? ??? ?????” than an explicit source.
August 6, 2014 4:28 am at 4:28 am #1045915Patur Aval AssurParticipant????? ????? Pesicha:
???? ????? ??? ????? ???? ?? ?????? ????? ??? ?????? ?????? ??? ???? ???? ??? ??? ??? ??? ???? ????? ???? ?????? ????? ?????? ?? ????? ????? ??????? ???? ?”? ?? ?”? ???? ?? ????? ????? ????’ ??”? ????? ???? ????? ?? ??? ?”? ??? ??? ???? ??? ???? ????’ ????? ???? ??? ?? ????? ???? ?????? ?’ ???? ??????? ???? ???? ???? ??? ?????? ???? ????? ??? ????? ???? ????? ?????? ????? ???? ????’ ??? ???? ????? ??? ???? ????? ???? ?????? ????? ?? ???? ????? ????? ??? ?? ??? ?? ????? ??????? ????? ?? ??? ???? ????? ????? ?????’ ????’ ?????’ ????? ??????? ???? ?????? ??? ???? ???? ??? ??? ????? ??? ???? ??????’ ???? ?????? ??????’ ??? ????? ?? ???? ??? ?’ ??????’ ??? ???? ?????’ ???? ??? ????? ???? ?? ????’ ??? ??????
continued in next post…
August 7, 2014 1:05 am at 1:05 am #1045916Patur Aval AssurParticipantContinued from previous post:
???? ?????’ ???? ?’ ???? ????’ ??????’ ????? ??? ???? ?????? ?????? ??? ????? ?? ???? ?? ??? ?? ???? ???? ????? ????? ????? ?????? ?? ??? ???? ????? ??? ?????? ????? ???? ?? ?? ??? ?????? ??? ?????? ???? ????? ????? ???? ???? ?? ?? ????? ?? ???? ???? ????? ?? ????? ????? ???? ????? ?????? ?? ??? ????? ?? ?? ?????? ?? ???? ????? ??? ???? ??? ??? ?? ???? ?”? ???? ???? ?????? ??? ???? ??????? ???? ??????? ???? ??????? ????? ?? ???? ???? ??? ????? ???????’ ???? ??? ?? ??? ????? ????? ??????’ ????? ???????’ ???? ??? ?? ??? ????? ????? ??????’ ????? ????’ ????? ??? ?????’ ?????? ???? ????? ???? ?????? ?? ???? ??? ????? ??? ????? ????? ?? ????? ???? ????? ????? ???? ?? ????? ??????
Continued in next post…
August 7, 2014 3:58 am at 3:58 am #1045917Patur Aval AssurParticipantContinued from previous post:
??? ?? ?????? ??? ?????? ?????? ?????? ???? ????? ??? ??????? ??”? ???? ???’ ???? ???? ????? ???’ ???? ?????’ ???? ????? ????’ ???? ??? ???? ????? ??’ ??? ????”? ????? ??? ??? ???? ??? ?? ????? ???? ?? ??? ??????? ???? ???? ???? ??? ???? ???? ????? ??? ???? ???? ?????? ????? ???? ???? ?? ????? ??? ???? ???? ??? ???? ?????? ?????? ??? ?????? ?????? ??????’ ??”? ?? ???? ??? ????? ?? ????? ?????? ????? ?????? ??? ??? ?????? ????? ??? ??? ??? ????? ??? ????? ??? ??????? ???? ???? ????? ?? ????? ?????? ????? ?? ??? ??? ????? ????? ?????? ?????? ?? ???? ????’ ??? ???? ??? ???? ?????? ?????? ?????? ???”? ???? ??? ???? ???? ???? ?? ??? ????? ??? ?? ??? ????? ??? ???? ???? ??? ?? ???? ??? ???? ???? ??? ??? ????? ????? ???? ????? ?????? ????? ??? ??? ????? ????? ????? ???? ?????? ??? ???? ????? ???? ??? ???? ?? ???????? ???? ?????? ??? ??????? ????? ??”? ???? ???? ????? ?? ????
‘??
Continued in next post…
August 7, 2014 2:50 pm at 2:50 pm #1045918Patur Aval AssurParticipantContinued from previous post:
??? ????????? ?? ???????? ????????? ??? ??’ ?? ?????? ?”? ????? ?????? ????? ???? ?????? ???? ????? ?? ?? ?????’ ?????? ??? ?????’ ?????’ ?”? ??? ???? ??”? ?”? ????? ???? ?? ????? ????? ???? ???? ??????? ???? ??? ??? ???? ?”? ???? ????? ?????”? ??”? ??? ??? ??? ????? ??????’ ?”? ???? ??-? ??????? ??’ ???? ?????? ????? ?? ??? ?????? ??? ??? ?????? ?? ?? ?? ?? ????? ?????? ??? ??? ?”? ??? ??? ????? ??? ?? ?? ??? ???? ???? ??? ??? ??? ????? ??? ??? ??”? ???? ??????? ??? ???? ?? ??????’ ????? ????? ??????’ ?”? ????? ??? ??? ??? ????’ ?? ???? ??????’ ????? ??? ?????’ ????’ ???? ??? ?????? ??? ????? ??? ????? ?? ???? ???? ?????
Continued in next post…
August 7, 2014 3:31 pm at 3:31 pm #1045919Patur Aval AssurParticipantContinued from previous post:
??? ?????? ????’ ???? ?????? ??????? ???? ????? ???? ??? ?? ?????’ ??????? ?? ???? ???? ???? ????? ????? ?”? ?? ???? ??? ?? ????? ?? ??? ???? ?????? ??????? ??????’ ???? ?????? ?”? ???????’ ?????’ ?????? ????? ??? ??? ??? ???? ?????? ?????’ ?? ??? ?”? ?????? ??? ???? ?????? ???? ????? ??????? ??? ??”? ?????’ ?? ??? ????? ???? ??? ????? ??’ ????? ??????? ????? ????? ?????
August 7, 2014 3:35 pm at 3:35 pm #1045920Patur Aval AssurParticipant???? ???”? ???? ??????? ??? ?’ ?:?:
??? ???? ???? ??? ??? ???? ??? ?? ???
August 7, 2014 4:05 pm at 4:05 pm #1045921Patur Aval AssurParticipantBerachos 8a:
??? ????’ ???? ?’ ???? ???? ??? ?????? ???? ???? ?’ ????? ????????? ???? ???? ???? ?????? ????? ?????? ?????? ???? ?’ ???? ?? ??? ????? ????? ???? ???? ??? ????? ??? ?? ????”? ?????? ??? ???? ???? ?? ???? ????
Maharsha there:
????????? ????? ???’ ?????”? ???? ????? ???? ????? ?? ??? ??? ???? ?????? ???? ?? ???? ?????? ?? ???? ??? ?????? ?? ???? ??? ??? ???? ???? ?????? ?? ?????? ??????’ ?”? ??? ?????? ??????? ????? ??? ????? ??? ????? ??? ??’ ?????? ??? ?? ??? ????? ??? ??”? ????”? ?????? ????? ???????? ????? ????? ??? ?”? ???? ???? ??????? ?????? ?????? ?? ???? ?????
August 7, 2014 5:40 pm at 5:40 pm #1045922Patur Aval AssurParticipantShu”t Beis Ridvaz Hakdama:
[Interestingly the subtitle of the sefer is ???? ??? ???? ??? ?????? ?????? ?? ???? ?????]
(The Hakdama is long and it is geshmak in it’s entirety, but alas I can only quote a little bit of it)
?? ?????? ???? ????? ???? ????? ????? ????? ????????? ?”? ??? ?? ?????? ????? ?? ??? ????? ??????? ??????? ?????? ??? ????? ?????? ????? ??? ???? ??? ??? ??? ?? ??? ??? ??? ?? ???? ?????? ?????? ???”? ??? ?? ??? ????? ?????? ??? ???? ??? ?????? ?????? ????? ??? ??? ??? ?????? ?????? ??????? ??? ??’ ???? ?????? ???? ??? ???? ???? ?? ???? ???? ???? ???”? ????? ?????? ????? ??? ??? ??? ????? ???? ???? ?? ??????
and a few lines later he writes
???? ??? ????? ????? ?????? ??? ??? ???? ??? ??? ?????
and in his tzava’a he writes
?????? ???? ???? ????? ???????? ?????? ????? ??? ?????? ???? ?????? ?? ????? ????? ??? ??????? ????
(Sam2, this one is also from the article by Dr. Marc Shapiro which I mentioned before.)
August 7, 2014 6:05 pm at 6:05 pm #1045923Patur Aval AssurParticipantMishnah Berurah Hakdama:
???? ????? ???? ???? ????? ?????? ????? ???? ????
August 7, 2014 6:09 pm at 6:09 pm #1045924Patur Aval AssurParticipant???? ??? (?????) ???? ?? ??? ???? ?? (there are slightly different versions in other midrashim):
?”? ??? ?”? ????? ?? ???? ?? ??? ?? ?????? ??”? ???? ??????? ?? ????? ??? ???? ????? ???? ??”? ????? ??????
August 7, 2014 6:10 pm at 6:10 pm #1045925Patur Aval AssurParticipantUpdated list:
Berachos 8a with Maharsha
Berachos 63b with Rashi
Shabbos 63a with Rashi
Eruvin 48a with Rashi
Kesubos 15a
Sanhedrin 42a with Rashi
Avodah Zara 19a with Rashi
Avodah Zara 19a with Rashi (there are two different gemaras on 19a which I quoted)
Horayos 14a
Shemos Rabba Ki Sisa Parsha 41
Medrash Mishlei 10
Piskei Riaz Kiddushin Perek 1 7:8
Orchos Tzadikim Shaar Hatorah
Maharal Tiferes Yisroel Perek 56
Maharal Nesivos Olam Nesiv Hatorah Perek 5
Maharal Chiddushei Aggados Sanhedrin
Maharal Gur Aryeh Parshas Vaeschanan
Maharsha Bava Metzia 85a
Shelah Maseches Shavuos 22, 25-35
Vavei Ha’amudim 5:14
Tzava’ah of the Shelah’s son R’ Sheftel Ose 26
Maadnei Yom Tov Hakdama
Kli Yakar Amudei Shesh Amud Hatorah
Chavos Yair siman 124
Yaavetz
Sifsei Yeshanim
Binyan Ariel Parshas Haazinu
Chayei Adam Hakdama Acharona
Pri Megadim
Panim Yafos Genesis 22:1
Even Shlaima 8:2
He’aros ??
Even Shlaima 8:7
Shulchan Aruch Harav Hilchos Talmud Torah 2:1
Teshuva Me’ahava Pesicha
Toldos Adam Perek 3
Pele Yoetz Asupa
Pele Yoetz Girsa
Pele Yoetz Yesod
Ohr Yisrael Iggeres 27
Dor Revii Hakdama
Mishnah Berurah Hakdama
Chofetz Chaim Likutei Amarim perek 4
Chofetz Chaim Likutei Amarim perek 5
Lev Aryeh hakdama
Hachana Deraba Ose 6
Yalkut Hagershoni Chagiga 5a
Shu”t Beis Ridvaz Hakdama (and tzava’a)
Seridei Eish letter
Bihyos Haboker Ose 42
Shu”t Mishneh Halachos 8:247
Shevet Halevi 2:57
R’ Eliyahu Feinstein
R’ Baruch Ber Leibowitz
R’ Yaakov Kamenetsky
R’ Moshe Feinstein
R’ Elazar Menacham Man Shach
R’ Berel Soloveitchik
R’ Moshe Chevroni
R’Aharon Yehuda Leib Shteinman
R’ Michel Yehuda Lefkowitz
R’ Yosef Shalom Elyashiv
August 10, 2014 9:31 pm at 9:31 pm #1045926Patur Aval AssurParticipantDerashos Chasam Sofer:
??? ????? ????? ???? ????”? ??? ????? ????? ??? ??????? ??????? ???? ???? ?? ????? ???? ??? ??????’ ???”? ????? ???? ???”? ?????? ??? ????? ????? ???? ???? ??? ?? ???? ??? ????
Although perhaps one can claim that this is not such a raya because the Ch”S might just mean that our pilpul is not as good as in the olden days, not necessarily that the pilpul is inherently bad.
August 11, 2014 1:46 am at 1:46 am #1045927nem621Participantfrom what i have heard from people who know more than me is that it isn’t yiun is better than bekius or that bekius is better that yiun rather every one has a chelek in torah and H’ made it so that i am natuarally attracted to say… halacha so to me i should focus more on halacha. that being said i read in the book “in their shadow” (thats what i think its called) that the chazon ish held everyone has to do yiun.
a lot of this quotes that say things about “pilpul” it isn’t what we call pilpul rather a much more complicated probably not emesdik way to learn that people just did to sharpen their minds. not because they thought it was emes but because it would make them sharp R’ Yaakov Pollak took this type of learning to poland i don’t know how many 100s of years ago
August 11, 2014 3:03 am at 3:03 am #1045928Patur Aval AssurParticipant“rather a much more complicated probably not emesdik way to learn that people just did to sharpen their minds. not because they thought it was emes but because it would make them sharp”
Walk into any Yeshiva and go over to a guy who is pilpuling and ask him if he thinks his pilpul is emes. If he doesn’t think that it’s emes then ask him why he is doing it. He will probably tell you that he is becoming a lamdan. I daresay that the objections to pilpul of old still apply to the way that many people learn today.
August 11, 2014 3:31 am at 3:31 am #1045929nem621Participantwhen i say a pshat i think it may be emes if not unless it is very gishmak there would be no point in saying it
August 11, 2014 4:38 am at 4:38 am #1045930Patur Aval AssurParticipant“i think it may be emes”
But you don’t “think that it is emes”
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