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Looks like so far the vote is heavily leaning towards Flatbush as the best place.
qwerty, you told asdf you live in flatbush (and asdf was shocked yesterday when you said you didn’t).
areivimzehlazeh: not a bad theory there buddy!!! remember when BYM actually got up from her chair on new years eve to ck out the comotion out there, after brookly19 said everyone look out your window-fireworks???!!!!
qwertyuiop: your in the BMG CR, not just in the YWN CR!!!
Joseph: please refresh my memory, i don’t remember ever saying that i lived in flatbush.$
The Big One:
You’ve never been to Boro Park? 🙂
Also it does not answer the question of why there are no big yeshivos for bochrim after EY in NYC.
I like flatbush, my hometown because everything is near you, you don’t have to travel far for schools, shuls, stores, etc. It’s great. Ma shein kane in OOT
hey, torahtziva we might be neighbors ;o)
ooiish!
Just been to Baltimore – it’s a healthy, refreshingly outta-town place. The ppl i met were SO outta town – they wouldnt been able to ‘survive’ 3 1/2 minutes in Flatbush or most anywhere in Brooklyn for that matter. It was such a healthy place, Yiddishkeit-waise, values-wise etc.
Now if you’re talking abt a place to live for convenience and proximity to things that are imp to you, looks like ppl answered your question for you. But, do yourself a favor and define yourself by YOURself and your views and values, and NOT by a projected place. See what place fits into your worldview and plan accordingly.
Above all else, Consult your Rabbi.
ashreinu its 5:10 am this is what youre doing now? please tell me youre in Israel
From my experience, I have TWO good things to say about Flatbush.
1) Large selection of shuls and schools
2) 24/7 access to kosher food and conveniences like crazy. Kosher supermarkets that have EVERYTHING, open really long hours, esp as Shabbos approaches…
Here’s something i just learned today that i’d like to share with the olam. The maharsha says on daf 49b in kidushin that some people are happy living in the big city and some r happy with a small city the rashash and the atzmos yosef explains this people like “OutOfTown” because people have more derech eretz there!!!
I’m from a small city- what i guess most people would call out of town. but I strongly disagree with that labeling. For me intown is where I come from. NY is out of town for me!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Who is anyone to categorize me as out of town? I might be out of YOUR town but its all based on point of view!!!
I totaly agree! I think its so ignorant to label someone else as out of town. But I do think that “out of towners” (I dont know any other term to call them)are awesome! Im one and Im proud of it!!!!!
thanks alot wxyz. commradeship is appreciated and well deserved. Why is there so much controversy about being from out of town or from in town? Who really cares? Why can’t we get along as good friends or even brothers and sisters? Thanks for the support!!
“Why would bochrim want to learn in Lakewood when they have Brooklyn?”
. The grass is always greener on the other side of the fence
. It became the “in thing to do” if you want a shidduch
(I personally have been to Lakewood less than 5 times in my life. I know many such people. B”H we are not lacking places to learn torah or people to learn from, neither are our children.)
“Also it does not answer the question of why there are no big yeshivos for bochrim after EY in NYC.”
See above.
Heard from a friend: He was in Baltimore for a Shabbos, and some of his chaverim decided to make an early maariv minyan motzaei shabbos at a big shul. One of the baalei batim came over and said (jokingly) these guys come from out of town and try to tell us how to run the shul. My friend said, What do you mean, I’m from NY, you’re from out of town.
I thought people went to Lakewood because the rent is cheaper than in Brooklyn.
mybat they do, brooklyn is just to expensive for the newlyweds.
Would you explain to me where all of this is coming from? As I said previously who really cares where you’re from? I have lived in out of town all of my life up until a few years ago where now I live “in town” and the animosity that I live with just because I am an “out of towner” Now where did all of this rivalry come from? Is it fair do subject my children to such pain just because thier mother isn’ from what you would call “in town” (whatever that means) Well thats all I have to say for now, hope this opens people’s eyes and brings a little more sensetivity to people.
Thanks for the thread
MaKesher
When I first bought a house in Brooklyn in a frum block you can imagine the neighbors were freaking out. “A mexican” bought a house in the block. lol
mazca, that sounds really sad, Who would say such a thing? I feel really bad for all the out of towners who live in brooklyn
afterwards we became very good friends..
Mazca why didn’t you write that in the end of your story? It was kind of misleading.
MaKesher – “I feel really bad for all the out of towners who live in brooklyn”
Please don’t. We’re fine.
cherry, That’s because you now are living in a Makom Torah.
Afterall, why else did you move to this great Yiddish’ neighborhood? All the thousands of former out of towners now living in area with Shuls, Beis Medrash’s, Yeshiva’s, Rabbonim, Rebbeim, and Rebbe’s literally every few feet testify every day they live there after having moved in!
Mezonos Maven – “That’s because you now are living in a Makom Torah.”
A Makom Torah is where you make it so.
You can be living in Brooklyn your entire life with a kosher pizza shop down the block and a Rebbe as your neighbor on one side and a bais medrish on the other; and still be not frum.
So it’s basically my opinion that Hashem has a large cheilik in who is chosen to be a candidate for frumkeit.
cherry, I am just curious what your reason as a former out of towner was to move to Brooklyn (like thousands of others)?
Mezonos Maven: How do you know he wasn’t living in Lakewood, Manchester or EY?
gavra, Read the above dialog and the answer will be clear to you.
Mezonos Maven 🙂
MaKesher I didnt want to mislead anybody. In the beginning it was hard specially those days when people thought that if you were not born in Brooklyn you were probably a goy or somebody from Mars, I had many neighbors some we became very friendly some we didnt.
MM, I met my Rav about twenty years ago, one of the best things that have ever happened to me. I wish it occurred 30 years ago. I have a two tiered family which reflects when the Rav entered our lives.
Anyway, to answer your question:
When I came to Brooklyn, there were huge populations of young people, male and female, with basement apartments in Boro Park. That was the “with it” place to be. Although I had learned in a renowned “out-of-town” yeshiva, as did my roommates, I transferred to Brooklyn College and learned in one of the local smaller yeshivos.
The local Boro Park custom was that after the seuda Friday night, the entire length of Thirteenth Avenue was crowded with frum people walking, greeting, schmoozing, meeting, very innocent and relaxed. The same scene was transferred to Fourteenth Avenue the next day after the seuda.
There was no hanky panky and yeshivos did not issue restrictions and no one ever heard of a kol korei in those days.
Hashem ways don’t always coincide with a sudden spiritual happening; many times it evolves into the eventual hashgacha.
Why do people think that if you lived outside of NY or NJ or even Baltimore that you must be frei or a BT or not as frum? There are tons of frum people in other areas and I am tired of people asking me the craziest questions! I come to NY and people think I came from the moon!!
As someone who as never been to NY, I am frequently amazed by what I hear coming out of New Yorkers’ mouths. They seem not to know anything outside of NY. (Notice I said “seem” not that they really do not know. I’m sure some do.)
A woman I know who is from Chicago, said when she was a girl at camp, a girl from NY asked her if she and another girl went to school together. She said, “I live in Chicago, she lives in Cleveland.”
To that, the New Yorker replied, “Right. So do you go to school together?”
(For those of you “in-town,” Chicago and Cleveland are a 5-hour or so drive apart.)
Ha Ha haifagirl, not funny. Its actually pretty sad. I geuss its the out of towner’s job to teach the in towner aboyt the outside world and not just that out of towners are from a different planet. But they actually live right next to just a little farther outthan NY.
Lakewood is just another NY neighboorhood like Monsey!
HAIFAGIRL: sorry, most “intowners” do know that Cleveland and chicago are hrs away from each others. Such an incident can happen anywhere.
Most pple I know from brooklyn are VERY openminded including myself.
And I’m sure you can find enough out of towners that live in a box too.
I live in Brooklyn(born & raised) and I constantly get asked if I am from out of town. Anyway, what does it mean to be from out of town anyway? Does it mean that I don’t talk with a brooklyn accent??(I’ve been told I have a mid-western accent)
Many years ago, I went to seminary with girls from other states & countries, and from what I understood from them was that New Yorkers(in-towners) seemed less friendly, and they don’t say Good Shabbos. Is it because I do say Good Shabbos/Shabbat Shalom, that I am considered like an of out of towner?? I always thought that it was the proper thing to do, to wish another jew, a Shabbat Shalom, no matter where you lived or what shul they went to/ or had different minhagim. A Jew is a Jew. Say “Good Shabbos”/”Shabbat Shalom”, and do it with a smile!!
Having lived out of town for a number of years, there is much to be said about the warmth and achdus you’ll find in many places. The Lakewood Kollel would regularly bring avreichim to speak at the Young Israel, and vice versa, distinguished frum professors would speak at the Kollel. Each would walk a long way to the other one’s simchas. Nobody judged you by the way you dressed. The Kollel guys focused only on learning, and not on politics. Teachers of many different backgrounds taught in each of the schools, Chareidi, Chabad and Modern. You would be hard-pressed to look at any of the teachers and match them to the school they taught in.
I actually thought I was Chareidi myself. It was only once I began reading the Chareidi news sites that I realized there are some very unpleasant political views that I could not agree with.
Out of town there is no scene. Everybody is just a sincere individual yid and everybody greets everybody warmly.
Keeping Entertained: You mention the impermanence of community. This is the makas medina of our times. Our zeidys and bubbies often were born, lived and died in a twenty mile radius. There was no confusion of minhag hamakom, or what was expected of a Jew, no dysfunctional wandering unless it was from outside hostility. I left a community in which I spent 32 years of my adult life, to go up to EY. Such a feeling of achva and connectedness is very difficult to reconstruct. The disconnect remains painful, and this is one of the yissurim with which EY is earned.
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