Empirical data: Does systemic racism exist?

I am not familiar with the studies you mentioned but I would venture that systematic bias, assuming it exists, varies in degree from place to place. If one study finds systematic bias in a small town in Georgia, another may tell you it doesn’t exist in Queens.

As for Chanaya, in my professional career I have found that there is most certainly a strong anti-frum, systematic bias, most often committed by the frei jews, r”l.

There is far more anti-white racism in America than anti-black racism. Both in policy (i.e. affirmative action policies not only permitting but enforcing discrimination against whites) as well as in violence (i.e. violent anti-semitic attacks perpetrated by members of minority communities.)

“Surely there would be a good study that proves one way or the other.”

No there wouldn’t be becasue it isnt just one issue. It is a deep history with effects that linger until today and manifest itself in many different ways. One excelent example that you cite.

“The issue with this is that Jamal & Lakisha are a specific kind of black (urban ghetto poor).”
That isnt an issue with the study. That is the point of the study. Even once theyve made it having grown up in an “urban ghetto poor” neighborhood makes it less likely to get a job. Arguably it should be MORE of a reason think of all the struggle Lakisha urban ghetto poor) overcame to get the same GPA as Karen, Lakisha should be MORE likely to get the job
I am not sure why you dismiss this very real problem so fast.

“thoae last names are only used by Blacks”
Are you being serious?

“Is there a different study that I missed?”

sure there are plenty
One of the biggest tickets to prosperity is home ownership. for decades minorities were deprived of this via redlining
As recently as 1980’s Banks were still more likely to lend to a lower income white family than a middle blacvk one.
So you have a group more likely to grow up in poverty poorly educated parents in poorer neighborhoods where property taxes generally fund schools, with worse teachers and worse access to tutors and extra help.
those that overcome all this are less likely to get a job thus perpetuiating this cycle, and you have a recipe for “systemic racism”

Bravo, Ubiquitin! It’s nice finally to see a somewhat honest discussion, instead of the usual self-serving, racist drivel in these pages.

“As recently as 1980’s Banks were still more likely to lend to a lower income white family than a middle blacvk one.”

That is very not recent.

Today, is there is any evidence of systemic racism against the black community?

“Bravo, Ubiquitin! It’s nice finally to see a somewhat honest discussion, instead of the usual self-serving, racist drivel in these pages.”

Wow, so we now discussing data and facts are racist?

You have no clue who most of the commenters are, I personally work with a number of humans that happen to have black skin on a regular basis and I have a lot of respect for them.

Of course the black community has a lot of challenges, but if your only open to the idea that this is the whites man’s fault, and by having some sort of black supremacy in which the white man needs to kneel and wash the black persons feet, that IS racist!

By the way, there are racist policies already in place, what about affirmative action, by definition, it is a racist policy. It favors one group of people based on their skin color against other people.

The basis of this policy is due to past discrimination against one group of people, therefore we will now discriminate against another person.

Does systematic anti-Semitism exist?

When you see a group of poorly dressed (apparently) African American young males walking down a dark street in your direction, do you get nervous?

Do you feel surprise on encountering an African American profession who seems to be highly competent?

akuperma

“When you see a group of poorly dressed (apparently) African American young males walking down a dark street in your direction, do you get nervous?”

Lets say that yes, I do get nervous. What if not only do I get nervous, but my friend that is African American also gets nervous.

Does that make anyone a racist?

What if I am also uncomfortable if its a group of poorly dressed white people, with large tattoos who seem to be rowdy and using profanity at passerby’s.

Am I still a racist?

“Do you feel surprise on encountering an African American profession who seems to be highly competent?”

Not at all, I see it all over, there is opportunity all over and everyone can climb the ladder.

In fact, our last president was African American, he was afforded the top job in the country for 2 terms.

ubiquitin

“It is very recent and it is still felt today.
I have a leg up thanks to a home my parents purchased in the 80’s A black person my age does not have that advantage. I will IYH be able to leave more to my children thanks to that home.
It is an advantage that I have today, it doesn’t get more recent than that”

No one is saying that minorities have some disadvantages. My parents that immigrated to the USA had zero, they were subject to a lot of discrimination.

However, if you are going to rely on 45+ old data that suggests that there was some discrimination against minorities as a basis for systemic racism, then you would have to also have current data that. a) this still exists. b) there are other forms of racism.

The fact that your parents, for example, were able to purchase a house that a minority in the exact same financial situation had a slightly more difficult time obtaining, is a very subjective argument as to the condition of the black community.

You see, you actually have parents that purchased a home, statistically, from every 100 black babies born in the USA, 72 are from single mothers. Explain that on the banks. That puts the average black child at a huge disadvantage.

“ great I love when we agree”

I think most disagreements really boil to small differences.

I dont think anyone disagrees that black people were discriminated against, or that they were aves (property) of other people or that they were sold by their own native people as slaves and brought to the united states.

You mention that what happened in the past is a cause for the current disadvantage of the black person.

That may or may not be, but we may disagree if this now means that people as a group were not exposed to this disadvantage, should kneel, beg for forgiveness and wash the feet of the black person.

Furthermore, the average american today is not really at a greater advantage if they are white.

Dear Curiosity,
The four things you mentioned are not opinions. They are not facts either. It is how you relate to ideas/concepts/movements/fact. That is called feelings. The case can be made, that is a truer sense of self, and more applicable to social problems. Still, it is not the truth of itself.

Dear Akuperma,
Yes. Maybe a little. Not at all. Did I miss or mess your point?

There is NO evidence that the criminal justice system is racist. The “proof” is always the same — the irrational assumption that people of all races commit all crimes at the same rate, so any disparity in arrests and convictions is down to racism. I am simply not going to bother reading yet another social-justice-warrior’s attempt to square this circle.

Taxi drivers OF ALL RACES don’t like to pick up black passengers for three very valid reasons, none of which make them racists.
1. Fear for their safety.
2. It is very well known (ask any taxi driver, of any race) that black people tend to be poor tippers.
3. Black people are likely to want to go to a neighborhood where, even if the driver is not mugged (see item 1) he is unlikely to pick up a fare on the way back. This problem could be solved, and thus black people could stand a higher chance of catching a cab, if drivers were allowed to refuse destinations they didn’t like.

All three of these reasons are completely rational, and therefore not racist.

Schnitzel says that people who are afraid for their safety shouldn’t be taxi drivers. Why on earth not? That makes no sense at all. What is it about taxi driving that makes it suitable only for those who are reckless and don’t care if they are robbed or raped or murdered? On what grounds do you presume to dictate that a normal person should be denied such a livelihood? It’s purely arbitrary. Or, if you’re relying on the law, then it’s circular. And it violates a person’s 14th amendment right to pursue a livelihood. (The immunities and privileges clause, before the supreme court unjustly gutted it.)

And here we have the radical left-wing troll “n0m”, exposed as the enemy of humanity and civilization that he is. What is rational is by definition the right way to act; what other definition could there be? But he subscribes to the anti-rational and anti-Torah religion of leftism, which has its roots in ancient paganism.

Dear Milhouse,
My best wishes to my most loyal supporter! A nuclear arms race is rational…… I hope you win one!

n0m,

I agree with a lot of what you wrote.

Given the high percentage of non-whites in police forces around the country, I would suggest that 2004 is somewhat outdated. Also, one needs to understand the definition of “systemic racism.” The true meaning from what I have read is that it is official policy of an agency to act in a racist manner. Can anyone show any government agency on any level that has such policies that burn racism into their policies? It seems the expression has been hijacked to mean any individual acting in a racist manner suggests that somehow the entire agency is racist. But of course that fits the narrative a lot better that the U.S. is racist.