- This topic has 17 replies, 9 voices, and was last updated 3 years ago by .
-
Posts
-
Please post a Dvar Torah that you’ve heard regarding the famous question of why the holiday is 8 days even though the miracle itself seemed to have only been for 7 days.
heard from Harav Hillel David. we celebrate for eight nights as hakoras hatov for finding the pach shemen.
heard from Papa, if you make a staute to commemorate the worlds tallest person, who stood almost 9 feet tall. You don’t say, “well 6 feet is regular height so lets makea 3 foot tall statue”
heard from Maccabees II it was a delayed celebration of Sukkos. This also explains Beis Shamai’s shita that we count down like “parei hachag” what does Sukkos have to do with anything?
heard this from Bnei Yissoschar too.Many, many years ago I heard severa explanations from a Rav. The one that stayed with me (perhaps because it was the most intuitive) is that because it was assur to replicate the keilim used in the Beis Hamikdash, and the Menorah in the Beis Hamikdash had 7 lights, the rabbonim paskind that the Chanukah menorah should have 8 lights. (I’ve never confirmed where chazal bring down that is is assur to make copies of the keilim used in the Beis Hamikdash).
Ubiq, that’s a very nice vort – i had a different explanation of why beis shammai go by parei hachag (pashtus there’s no kasha because they’re not deriving or even necessarily comparing n”ch to sukkos, they’re answering the taanah of beis hilel that we usually say maalin bakodesh…)
Chazal say that the number of parim decreased because it was being machchish the koach of the Umos haolam(while at the same time giving them chius), and pn chanukah, the shem mishmuel explains that we were machchish the koach of the yavanim…there were no new philosophers after the neis, he says, and we also used the nitzutz of kedushah that was “yaft elokim leyefes”, and used it for a mitzvah that is personified by “mehadrin min hamehadrin”
I’m sorry, but I don’t see why chazal would have us make a bracha on something just to distinguish it from the menorah in the beis hamikdash…
I heard several explanations.
1. They put in a little oil each day and it still lasted even though it was an 8th of what they really needed
2. they didn’t even have enough for one day and the little they did not only lasted 1 day but also another 7.
3. Beating the yevonim is commemorated by the first day and the other 7 are in addition to that day (I don’t really understand this one)Another explanation which might not go so well here is that 7 is within the bounds of Teva as it represents a week which is teva while 8 is beyond the limits of teva, the miracle of chanukah was a miracle that was higher then nature which is represented by the 8th day.
The Beis Yosef asks the question what was the neis the first day as there was enough oil to burn? The Shiltas Rav Ache (a Gaon) has the girsa לא היה בו ‘אפילו’ להדליק יום אחד there was not enough even for one day. The mefarshim explain that if we have an exact pitcher amount, something is left over when poured in the menorah. The Meiri Shabbos om Mai Chanukah Shabbos 21,2 answers the above that the finding the pitcher was itself a neis. When we are mechadesh in the Torah is a neis of siyata dishmaya see the Or Hachaim Hakadash in the beginning on Parashas Tetzaveh on shemen zayis zach pure oil, lishma, kasis lamaor, break himself in learning Torah. The Beis Yosef has two answers, one it refilled itself with itself oll, but ehat happened the last day? Two, they divided the oil into eight parts, so the first day was also a neis. They realized that when the oil became tamei, they needed eight days to produce new oil, but ein somchim al haneis, can we rely on a neis?
The Ksav Sofer Shut O;CH 132, that the argument if kavsa zakik lo, do we have to relight it when it went out before the time is dependent on these two answers, When divided into eight parts, an eight part can burn a little so the neis was that it burned long, so to commemorate the neis, we must relight it but otherwise not.
The Pnei Yehashuah explains that the argument to increase or decrease the number of candles every day also depends on this. When the oil was divided into eight parts the amount of oil left in the pitcher was seen to diminish day by day by an eight, so the neis was realized through diminishment.
The Taz explains that the first day oil was left over for other days, מנותר קנקנים נעשה נס, from what was left over the neis materialized.There are Rishonim who explain that it is asser lehishtamesh leara, not to use the light as the commemoration of the menorah of the Mikdash remembering the neis, so we cannot make a menorah of seven, as the halacha there. To distinguish whether to increase or decrease we must not light seven because on the fourth day would not be a difference in how we light. 1 2 3 ‘4’ 5 6 7 or
7 6 5 ‘4’ 3 2 1.The Chasam Sofer explains that they had to light outside in the chatzar, in the yard because everything was tamei, so it used more oil. The Maharsha in Chulin (54,2) explains that in order the menorah should not become tamai they took a big earthenware container (kli cheres) and broke it into small pieces that holds less than a half a lug, so teves nights when the night is longer, was not enough even for one day.
Reb Moshe says to remember the first day the fact that oil burns is also a neis. The Chasan Sofer says that the Yevonim went into the Beis Hamikdash and were not metamei from outside having the Beis Hamikdash become chulin (uvou bo peritzim vechuleliho) was a neis. The Pri Chadash that we commemorate the victory the first day.There is a minhag that women don’t work at the time the candles are burning. The Chasan Sofer explains that they commemorate the eight yamim tovim min Hatorah (2 Pesach, 1 Shevuos, 2 Rosh Hashanah, 1 Yom Kippur and 2 Sukkos) that women light candles and don’t work and the men commemorate the neis of Chanukah with oil.
The Olelos Ephraim explains, do we look at the hatzalah, salvation of the Jews the elevation of the spirituality or the mapalah of the goyim, the destruction of our enemies, the diminishment of gashmiyos, of material things. The Beis Hilel’s view is that we increase in kedusha as the elevation of ruchniyus automatically destroys the gashmiyus. The sur mera, turn away from bad emanates from the asei tov, from doing good. We say Arur Haman and Baruch Mordechai. They both have the same gematria. Arur has a bigger gematria than Haman decreasing in material things, whereas Mordechai has the bigger gematria than Baruch increasing in kedusha,
One of the three things (Shabos, Milah and Rosh Chodash) that the Yevonim wanted to destroy is Rosh Chodash in order not to know when to keep the yomim tovim, so the women who light the candles commemorate them in the eight days by not working at the time when the candles are burning as above. The sefer Chagvei Haselai by Rav Yonah Tzvi Horowitz explains that they are against our three basic emunas, Emunas Hashem, Shabbos, Bechira, Milah and Hashgacha, Rosh Chodash.
Can I come up with a new one? Greek philosophers defined the world built out of 4 components. So, we doubled that! Either to point to Olam Habo (although not clear why it will be divisible) or just to raise the stakes!
Seriously, note the difference between Purim, and earlier malchuyot, and Chanuka: in Purim, we deal with a drunk Emperor who changes his wish every day. In Chanuka, we are dealing with _laws_ that prohibit things, a way more advanced civilization.
Why are we increasing candles? One big point of contention between Greeks and Jews is of statics v. dynamics. Greeks observe the world and accept it as is. Jews see history as a way forward and up, starting with sulam Yaakov and “chachamim yodea eitim” in Megilla. Jewish idea prevails in this debate, with Christianity, being a mixture of Greek and Jewish thought, accepting the history progress view, and so does modernity, including Marxism and all other isms that at least talk about improving human condition in some way.
So, increasing candles shows that we are always aiming higher.
The Greeks respected the physical as the human body whereas by the us the spiritual is more important. וישם את אפרים לפני מנשה the Chasam Sofer explains that Yaakov Avinu placed Ephraim, the spiritual before Menashe, the physical.
The Greeks worshiped the body. They invented the Olympics and other sports as a way to further enhance the physical body to accomplish more and to show the beauty of the physical body.
In order to counteract this, we eat doughnuts, Latkes, and other fatty foods…..
mendyonline, who says that allows you to endanger your health by destroying your body? The Taz says that Chanukah no sudah is required but lehodas ulehalel, thanking and praising, as they were endangered spiritually and not physically whereas on Purim they were saved from getting killed. We eat those foods for the oil by emphasizing the importance of oil. Also, cheese blintzes is eaten as their salvation came through cheese. The salty cheese caused the Greek general to get thirsty, drink wine thereby getting drunk and falling asleep, allowing Yehudis to behead him.
- You must be logged in to reply to this topic.