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Finally. The time has come for us to discuss this form of Gezel on YWN. This phenomenon has been going on ever since and to my dismay has been largely ignored. I am deeply hurt about a story I had with one making claims about an “illegal driveway.”
It was about two years ago when I wanted to unload something from my car into my garage when I saw a car parked in front of my driveway. The heavy piece of furniture was to be stored in the garage at the very end of my driveway. I had planned to back my car into the driveway and easily hoist it from my car into the garage. Obviously, the luxury my driveway presented to the fellow with no ethics, got me to change my plans. I had to park at a pump down the block (as, it was the closest I could find) and carry the heavy piece down to my house and down the entire driveway. As me and my sons completed the task, that fellow (visitor) came out of a neighboring house with a luxury he afforded himself by ‘stealing’ my driveway. When one of my sons mentioned to him that he had parked in front of a private driveway, he flared up and threatened my son that he will call 311 and complain about the driveway, which he claimed was illegal. After my teenager came to repeat his ‘threat’, I went out to the fellow and told him that we can settle for a deal. You call 311 and I call 911. My home was built more than a century ago on a block that has a driveway near almost every home, I wasn’t concerned of any Mesira. What bothered me was the way people can justify their evil acts (yes, it is one) by maintaining presumptions. Claiming an “illegal driveway” is offending to one that maintains the law, only if you know for a fact that the curb was made without a permit can you charge that charge.
The OP mentioned Misaskim. Let’s put the Gezel of parking in front of a private garage aside. I’m appalled at those people who freely park in front of a garage that explicitly state that it has Life-saving equipment stored therein. Can you imagine if something would happen to your loved one but his life would be lost because someone is blocking Misaskim’s driveway? Would any of those people running into the Cafe to have a coffee or work/daven nearby decide to park a block down, in front of Hatzolah, at their convenience? Every time I pass that garage, I cringe.
Homeowner:
So, are we to understand that your driveway is in fact contrary to city law?
Hilarious. What makes you think you can reserve a spot by making a cut in your curb?
I would block an illegal driveway without a moments thought. Even if the car was inside and there were other places to park. You damage my car, I’ll break the windows of your house.
The following is all taken from NYC.gov:
Curb cuts require both a DOT and a Department of Buildings permit.
Curb cuts must not be located in bus stop zones or too near fire hydrants, trees, utility poles or parking signs.
Installing a curb cut without a permit may result in court appearances and the imposition of fines. Initial fines can be as high as $2,500.
Proposed curb cuts must comply with regulations from the Department of Buildings, Department of Transportation and the Department of City Planning.
In most zoning districts, [private property] parking spaces must be at least 8.5 feet wide and 18.5 feet deep, and must be fully within the property lines.
In most zoning districts, [private property] parking spaces are allowed only in the side or rear yards.
Curb cuts must be at least 10 feet wide, including the splays (slopes).
The following minimum distances are required between the edge of the driveway splay (slope) and the items listed below:
— Five feet from NYC right-of-way lines and utility easements in residential zones
— Seven feet from trees, light poles and street signs
— Ten feet from fire hydrants, telephone booths and utility poles
— Sixteen feet from the edge of an adjacent driveway.
popa
he said his neighbor
oops. sorry homeowner.
I have seen people park 3 feet or more into a driveway space, blocking the homeowner from moving his car. Their reasoning, ” I thought you had enough room to get out.” Are these people just dumb or just plain rude?
My neighbor called the police when his driveway was blocked. The police told him he could now have the car towed away.
Sigh. From the comments here, I see a whole lotta people that could stand to move (and stay) out of town.
Gosh, people. Get a grip. What are we talking about… 5-10 minutes? A whopping 20 minutes? And for this, we’re gonna take it to the streets like gangstas?
I’ve had my driveway blocked more than once and been blocked in by a double parked car when I returned from shopping. And yes, it is maddening. But to become gaas mentchen? PLease
Squeak. In your reply to Helpful you say that “it’s out and out Mesirah”. But if the homeowner has an emergency. should he go ask the Ruv a Shailah. the ruv will look up the answer in Shulchan Aruch and SHu”t and after 20 minutes (average.) will give him permission to call a tow truck. Homeowner goes home, looks in the Yellow Pages for tow company. Calls tow company, who tell him that all trucks are out. Call back in 20 Minutes. Finally, company tells homeowner, truck is on the way. As the truck pulls in front of the house, driver comes back and pulls off without saying a word, after having a pizza & coffee and a good schmooz.
Sigh. From the comments here, I see a whole lotta people that could stand to move (and stay) out of town.
Grass, trees, space between homes….
Doesn’t sound so bad. 🙂
Now if we could only open up a KD…..I would get really fat 🙁
No way, GAW. You need to stay right where you are, as your neighborhood cannot afford to lose you.
I’m willing to bet you’ve been blocked before, and have circled and circled looking for a spot (as have most of us)
But take it to the street? Na, that’s not your style.
I know this thread is specifically about blocking driveways, I just wanted to add something about blocking parked cars.
On days of alternate side parking one side of the street has to be completely cleared for approx 2 hours. Officially its illegal to double park on the other side. However, for those 2 hours its overlooked and u will not be ticketed.
Very often I see people who want to drive off, but they CANT because they are parked next to the curb, and they are blocked by a double parked car.
Please practice some mentchlechkeit. If u will temporarily double park your car due to alternate side parking, and your blocking in another car, leave a telephone number on your car where u can be reached so that u can move your car if necessary.
Jam – true. But you should only double park those times in a manner that you are not completely blocking someone from leaving. Otherwise what if you are in shul with your tefilin davening when he calls?
thats because the 66th precinct is the lazy mans NYPD, come in from the Verrezano talk to Tony, Mario and Carmine give your ticket quota for standing by a dubious no standing sign and wait to get your $60,000 pension and move to Sarasota.
“But you should only double park those times in a manner that you are not completely blocking someone from leaving”
Helpful – That would be another form of mentchlechkeit.
BP Totty:
Once a neighbor parked in my driveway.
Then he had to leave his car.
It was a mistake, he apologized, Vaiter.
Was I annoyed? yes. But know what, he is 99.9% of the time a great neighbor and a good friend (and I’m happy to have a frum neighbor as well).
P.S. I like my grass and trees; why should I move?
homeowner is right; calling a tow truck is dina l’nafshei, not mesira. still complicated, especially in light of dubious property right.
Click below for information on filing a complaint:
–> NYC.GOV File an Illegal or Painted Driveway/Curb Cuts Complaint <–
Homeowner, from your post it seems that you are claiming to be a Rav. A piece of friendly advice to you, don’t claim to be something you are not. You could get into trouble for it. Are you really a homeowner? I sure hope so….
PBA- I was kidding with myfriend Helpful about mesirah. I had no idea that the tow truck company has nothing to do with the city. Obviously, if it is not the government then “moiser” doesn’t apply in that sense.
“It was a mistake, he apologized, Vaiter.”
My point exactly, GAW
Homeowner –
All the senarios you list are true. But is it possible that SOME OF THOSE exact things happened to the person who parked in your spot for the 5-10 minutes? Not saying that it did, but what if the person had to run upstairs with his 5 year old, to reach the bathroom in time, and comes back to slashed tires? Or a sticker on the windsheild?
All I’m saying is, we need to back off a bit, that’s all.
people block my driveway all the time. i always call 311 and my local precinct right away, because to tow it, the car has to first be ticketed. since the cops really dont care, and its low on their priority list I can be stuck without my driveway for hours, so I keep a gluestick and signs saying DONT BLOCK MY DRIVEWAY waiting by the front door :-)why shouldnt i have some fun with it?
Wolf, when i glue signs on the cars, i place them only on windows, and with a gluestick not crazy glue. this is similar and a lot easier to remove then those annoying yellow department of sanitation stickers. it is a nuisance to remove, but not as much of a nuisance as being stuck without my – legal – driveway
Wolf, when i glue signs on the cars, i place them only on windows, and with a gluestick not crazy glue. this is similar and a lot easier to remove then those annoying yellow department of sanitation stickers. it is a nuisance to remove, but not as much of a nuisance as being stuck without my – legal – driveway
But is it right to create a nuisance for someone else just because they did for you? I’m not convinced that it is.
Trust me, I understand your plight… and inwardly I can appreciate what you’re trying to do and can understand the sense of satisfaction from doing it. But nonetheless, I’m not at all convinced that it’s the right thing to do.
The Wolf
Wolf,
Can you not agree with the simple proposition that one who is inconsiderate towards others would possibly learn from being on the receiving end, and thus might possibly change their behavior? I am not asking you to agree that he “deserved it”, rather that sometimes you have to be obnoxious to obnoxious people to get them to see the effects of their actions.
Can you not agree with the simple proposition that one who is inconsiderate towards others would possibly learn from being on the receiving end, and thus might possibly change their behavior?
Yes, he would. He would also learn if the homeowner slapped him in the face or did any of half-a-dozen other things to him too. That doesn’t necessarily make it right.
Look, I really understand his position… and in his shoes, I’d probably be *highly* tempted to do the same. And furthermore, I agree there is some form of “justice” to it. But in the end, as my mother always taught me, two wrongs don’t make a right.
The Wolf
Do you then disagree with the Department of Sanitation’s program of yellow stickers on the windows of alternate side violators? I am not asking if you like having to scrap it off your window, but do you disagree with their program?
Do you then disagree with the Department of Sanitation’s program of yellow stickers on the windows of alternate side violators?
As a matter of fact, I do. But don’t expect me to fight City Hall on this. 🙂
The Wolf
Sanitation is government and when they do it, it’s legal; like a fine.
Regarding the issue of mesirah:
Does it make a difference in determining whether it is mesirah, if all factors being the same, the only difference is in once case the homeowner calls a private tower to tow, or in another case the homeowner calls a government tower to tow?
Is it mesirah to call the local precinct to have the vehicle ticketed (for blocking your driveway)?
Is it mesirah to report that a curb-cut (in front of the homeowners driveway) is illegal?
If a homeowner is responsible for fixing cracks (wear and tear) on the public sidewalk in front of his house, is it mesirah to report it to the city, if the city’s only action would be to enforce the homeowners obligations, with no other penalty (assuming the homeowner complied upon demand)?
“so I keep a gluestick and signs saying DONT BLOCK MY DRIVEWAY waiting by the front door”
Probably just putting the note under his windshield wiper with a statement that his license has been recorded would serve the same effect.
My friends and I accidentally parked on somebody’s “airstrip” in the middle of Alaska, 250 miles from the nearest town. The guy said if we do it again, he’ll cut a trench around the car.
A couple of months ago, I was in Boro Park for a function at Ateres Chyna. We parked six blocks away. My friend was careful to park his SUV midway between two driveways so that neither party would be inconvenienced. We saw a lot of cars on this and other streets parked so that it would have been possible but a bit tricky for the homeowner to enter or leave via the driveway.
To me, the illegal driveways don’t matter. They take one or two cars off the street, and so improve the parking situation somewhat. I also don’t think that I have a right to park carelessly because I am in a hurry or I don’t know the Yid whose house I have my car in front of.
Homeowner, have you tried parking your car blocking in the offender? If you’ve been inconvenienced for 20 minutes, leave your car there for 20 minutes so he understands. Its not about revenge, its about understanding.
The only time I would block a driveway is if I was staying in the car and needed a place to pull over. Then I could move if the homeowner came back.
The other night someone parked in my driveway (one that I pay to use, and I have seen the permit that states it is 100% legal) with a placard in the front window that claimed the car was on official police business. I called the local precinct and asked if they were aware of any official police business on my block that required someone to block my driveway. They were unaware of any. I was prepared to go into the simcha hall across the street (which this person was likely at) and was going to ask the musician to announce that Grey Oddesey license plate number xxx is about to be towed, but my wife decided the best course of action would be to make it impossible for him/her to pull out. So with the help of a neighbor I parked up on the bumper in the front and he the same in the back and we waited for this person to come back. I told him I already reported his license plate to the local precinct (I didnt) and how he is abusing/misusing this placard which he probably has illegally to begin with, of course he is free to call them back and explain the official police business at the bar mitzvah. He didnt look very happy. Let him sweat a little.
I’ll say this much Homeowner; If I ever get into legal trouble, you are the esq I want leading my dream team (assuming you handle criminal law).
But as a neighbor or mechutin? Uh, maybe not.
We lived next door to a dentist. My father a”h was a baker and worked evenings. He was a very menthliche man and gave rides to everyone. Even went out in storms with only an hour or two sleep in the morning to pick up kids from bus stops and drive them to school and drive people to work. Then went back to sleep. My neighbor didn’t let his tenant put their big carriage in his garage so my father let them use ours. He would come home early mornings like 4:00am pull the carriage out drive his car in and put the carriage back in all seasons, all types of weather. Just so you know he was a mentch.
Anyway, people often blocked the driveway and he was a stickler for being on time. So he would go out and honk the horn for the person to move their car. In most cases the person would come running out full of apologies and my father waved him/her off no problem. One time that I remember, he kept honking and honking and no one came out. He went next door to the dentist and no one claimed to be the owner of the car. Neighbors started to gather and he got very upset. It was getting late and he had to get to work. He let the air out of the car’s tires and called the police to ticket the car, then a neighbor gave him a ride to work. I don’t know how he got home that morning.
Homeowner, you have valid reasons for being upset. As a former BPer I understand completely. It is overcrowded and people do not have the respect for others that was once part and parcel of the neighborhood a generation and two ago.
Many years ago, I was in BP Erev Shabbos. A car in front of me just stopped blocking traffic to empty out his carload of passengers and items. There was a space, be it a driveway, hydrant or whatever a car space or two ahead but he did not pull over. The cars were lining up behind me all the way to the corner of the block but he did not seem to be bothered. I put my car in park and got out to tell him to pull over. He looked at me like I was nuts and yelled at me “NU, its Erev Shabbos!” I yelled back “Nahr, just for you???? Its Erev Shabbos for me and the other 15 people behind me as well!! Are you deaf and blind as well as dumb?”
Then he looked passed me to see the line up of cars behind me, turned purple, closed his doors and pulled over. Haoloam nivra bishvili! The world is created for me! The problem is they forget there are millions of “me’s” out there that Hashem created the world for.
“Is it mesirah to call the local precinct to have the vehicle ticketed (for blocking your driveway)?”
Yes its mesirah. Its mesirah to call the police for anything involving another yid unless there is real sakanas nefashos like if hes attacking you right now.
Homeowner, do you think it is mesirah to call the cops on a HEFKER car? Can a car be a yid or a goy? Would it then be male or female? Would it matter then if it had a Hebrew name or a Yiddish name? In that sense would 4 flat tires be considered four broken legs c”v? At least they weren’t slashed, they might have bled to death!! B”H, a little CPR and techias hamesim!!!
Homeowner, I like your attitude, if you can’t get through just sing their song.
Homeowner, thanx, I needed a good laugh!
I agree with the above posters that calling the cops to ticket a car is mesira.
It is also mesira to report the homeowner has an illegal driveway.
Its mesirah to call the police for anything involving another yid unless there is real sakanas nefashos like if hes attacking you right now.
I actually once called a cop to quickly adjudicate a case where someone* stole something from me. I was able to pretty quickly prove that it was mine, but he wouldn’t surrender it until the cops forced him to.
While I didn’t press charges, I guess I am a moser according to the definitions above. I called the cops and I wasn’t in any physical danger.
So, for all those who feel its a mitzvah to kill a moser, come and get me.
The Wolf
* Yes, it was a Jew.
…and what’s with Dina Dimalchusa and Chilul Shem?
Theres something very wrong here. One would think from the title of the thread “Driveway Blocking In Borough Park” that this only goes on in Boro Park which is absolute baloney. It goes on in all neighborhoods so dont pick on BP!
WIY:
When you say all neighborhoods, you mean also Flatbush and the rest of Brooklyn. It does not go on in Queens, and certainly not out of town.
It does go on in Queens and elsewhere.
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