- This topic has 35 replies, 13 voices, and was last updated 3 years, 4 months ago by .
-
Posts
-
People have the custom to do it on shabbos when they are not busy. If it cannot be done, one should step on them. Underware is not really necessary.
Reb E- I think people need to check with their rov before following that advice!! We don’t do heichin lchol on shabbos just cuz you have more time! I am surprised you would even suggest such a thing. And walking on clothes is not a widely accepting loophole so people should PLEASE not accept these ideas without checking with their rov.
Above should be underwear.
I say that as a maasei rav, a halacha lemaaseh in our yeshivas.
In order not to be a hachana for shabbos, wear it a little while. I suggested before, if being a CR for CR, to validate my suggestions with your LOR.
Syag, what will a person do if they forgot to wear it?
How can wearing weekday clothes on shabbos ever be seen as not preparing for chol.
If you forgot you shoulf ask your specific rav what you specifically should do in this specific case. Isn’t that how it works with things?
I know it’s not the same thing but if i forget to tear open the pockets of a new suit before shabbos i can’t just do it shabbos. If i forget to tear paper towels before shabbos, i can’t just tear them on shabbos. I know those are different but that may effect the heter, not the obligation to ask.
Since the RMA says to wear weekday cloth on this shabbos, even though we don’t do it, is our option and therefore, I think, it is not a hachana.
>Since the RMA says to wear weekday cloth on this shabbos even though we don’t do it, is our optuon, therefore I think it is not a hachana.
I believe that is only for Shabbos Chazon, which this is not.
Wearing shabbos cloth every shabbos is in public but in his house he can do what he wants.
See SA O’CH 262,3 and the Biur Halacha there, kelim naim.Wearing clothes so that they become “unlaundered” is only for Shavua shechal bo, which didn’t happen this year.
Yabia Omer, your comment is for sefardim or also for ashkenazim?
I am not sure how much clothes you all guys are blessed to have prepared for the next week that you can’t find time to wear them all before shabbos (there are still a couple of hours left where I am). If the core idea is to not wear clean/new clothes, why not continue wearing next week whatever you are wearing now before shabbos?
on another note:
>> I say that as a maasei rav, a halacha lemaaseh in our yeshivas.Just heard someone noticing how much we_all switched from learning masorah from our own parents and communities to generic approaches taught at schools and written up in books .. The unattributed story about a student questioning the shiur of a kiddush cup at a Rabbi’s house according to the “halakha” and response – it is my zeidy Brisker Rav’s cup, or something like that.
So, I say, if RebE’s zeidi jumped on his clothes on shabbos, gezunte heig .. does not mean that others outside of the family should do that … there is, as menioned, an issue whether this was b’dieved when someone forgot.
Stepping can be done on a weekday in 9 days when not worn before.
Stepping can be done on a weekday in 9 days when not worn before.
B’dieved
As far as wearing weekday clothes on Shabbos, you are mistaken. It’s hachana.
The only heter is clothing you really could wear on Shabbos (such as a white shirt) and on Shabbos morning, instead of putting on your shirt from Friday night, you out on a fresh shirt, that’s okay. Same when waking up from a nap.
But stam trying on clothes that you don’t need to put on is hachana.
As a child I remember Oberlander Yidden who would not change clothes. Not the suit and not the shirt. They sang לכה דודי toאלי ציון.Any memories past or present?
“Stepping on clothes” doesn’t seem to have any identifiable source. It could be that on a dirt floor, stepping on them would make them not “fresh”, but the common practice of wearing clean socks and stepping lightly on clothes placed on a clean floor seems untenable…
In camp we always just wore our shirts and pants for a few minutes, sometimes 2 shirts at a time
The prohibition of freshly laundered clothes does not apply to those that are worn to absorb sweat. Some even apply this to shirts (Piskei Teshuvot 551:17). I once read that ordinary slacks are also not a problem.
These are minhagim, that is nedarim taken by our fathers and grandfathers. So, RebE’s grandfathers took on different observances than someone else’s. No need to argue…
What about Sephardim, who exchanged wine in av for selichot in elul. As this year a week before tisha bAv is same as rosh hodesh, do you have shorter selichot? Or you still need to atone for rice on pesach?
So, RebE’s grandfathers took on different observances than someone else’s. No need to argue…
There’s no minhag to allow blatantly preparing for chol on Shabbos.
Besides, my grandfathers had the minhag of pointing out when someone tries to peddle false halacha, so there’s no point in arguing with me
DY, did you see the Biur Halacha mentioned above. So as I can wear at home on shabbis any clothing why be a hachana? You might be a Daas Yochid as your name indicates.
DY, there’s halachik discussion about tochacha r Tarfon v r Akiva, seforim written about it. Tisha bAv are minhagim. I agree that shabbos might be an issue that is legit to argue.
DY, if something is only used for weekday, it is a hachana on shabbos otherwise it is not as you are using it for shabbos.
Avi – the shirts you’re referring to are probably undershirts.
Piskei teshuvos isn’t a source; it’s a compilation of sources, so would you mind posting which source he brings? Also, if shirts and pants aren’t required to not be freshly laundered, then that just leaves…suits? Clothing that is meant to protect against sweat, like socks, underwear and undershirts, are not a problem because they’re not worn for their own sake, nor are they “choshuv”, but pants and regular shirts? They most definitely are.
Rev E, if someone is davka changing into weekday clothing to be able to wear it during the week, it is hachana. It’s clear that he’s not doing it because this is what he wants to wear now.
See SA O’CH 262,3 and the Biur Halacha there, kelim naim.
You are taking that completely out of context. He is not talking about the 9 days there.
DY, I used a savoro which is min Hatorah, I did not see you abfregen, making a difference.
See Piskei Teshuvas O’CH 551,115 who brings an argument about it. After plag mincha one can daven maariv, without melacha, and for a mtzva be machshich al hatchum. If stepping on is not good, then bideaved this is an eitza.Okay, here’s the drill (at least this is what I do):
1) Wake up on the 27th of Tamuz.
Get dressed in fresh clothes.
2) At noontime (or at some point during the day, whenever it’s convenient) change your clothes. Put on a fresh outfit and put what you’ve worn until now in a secure location.
3) Before bedtime, remove the second set of clothes and put them with the first set.
4) Repeat the above procedure on the 28th and 29th of Tamuz.
You now have six changes of clothes that can be worn during the nine days.
The nine days consist of 7 weekdays this year (8 in other years).
You will be just fine!@goldilocks
you got the drill wrong. there are supposed to be 3 sets of clothes. before taking off the first set u say “this one’s too rough.” before taking off the second you say “this one’s too soft.” and when u put on the third say “this one’s just right.”DY, I used a savoro which is min Hatorah
What sevara?
See here where the באר משה says it’s okay when taking a nap
https://hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=14711&st=&pgnum=421
https://hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=14711&st=&pgnum=422
DY, The sevara is that you can wear weekday cloth on shabbos at home according to that Biur Halacha, therefore it is not a hachana.
Before one rants about what the halachah is and determines with no hesitation that a given halachic opinion offered here should be disregarded, one should consider the following:
1. Have I ever learned the halachos of hachanah from the primary sources?
2. Do I know how to look up the halachic sources in order to offer a halachic opinion?
3. Is the responder possibly a Rav or halachic authority himself, and if so, who am I to berate him?
4. Am I qualified to determine what is a widely accepted halachic loophole?
Sometimes a bit of self awareness helps.
- You must be logged in to reply to this topic.