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Zehavasdad: I never looked at religion that way… sad that you do…..
Always here: You were asked to post what you would give up NOT what you wouldn’t! Let’s be respectful of Leiby ZTKL”
a mamim~ I am absolutely respectful of Leiby, A’H.
my point is that I don’t feel deleting my acc’ts is relevant to his memory, may it be a blessing.
This is an opinion driven website, be prepared when u start a thread that there will be those who disagree with that viewpoint, if you just want to spout your own position and not listen to any detractors then start a blog.
“bad websites are good”
the website is as bad or as good as one makes it.
Things aren’t always black & white, good /evil. There are shades and choices.
“thanks again mr. editor. aren’t you supposed to edit, not prove that bad websites are good”
He didn’t prove anything, He just provided us with some facts.
LBJ: You have made your point. We are all adults and free to choose in which way we will or will not honor Leiby’s A’H’ memory. Read that sentence again – some people will feel no need to do anything. That is also their choice. Your method of presenting your idea makes it seem that it is “your way or no way”. I hope that you aren’t a teacher because this type of method used by a teacher could be dangerous. Using Facebook or the internet or reading magazines does not make anyone a bad person – it is what they choose to look at or read and how they use that information. Give us some credit for being able to make our own decisions. I wish you well in your choice of honor – let us choose our own way.
Dear LovesbeingJewish,
I rarely post in coffee room only when I connect with something. I so agree with your take about Facebook! By some responses it is clear how we all like to rationalize our taivos.
Facebook is opening yourself up to all kinds of narishkeit. It is NOT a place for someone that wants to guard themeself and their family from the garbage that is out there. What is the conversation about? Leiby a’h was never on Facebook? Cmon.
The point is what happened to our community is tremendous and it has shaken us all up. I am not the same person — but if we wouldn’t have needed this wake up call, this situation would never have happened. Has there ever been a crime like this within klal Yisroel?
Facebook is just one kind of nonsense. the point in my humble opinion is not about facebook only, but to wake up from our slumber and understand taht we are Yidden and we have work to do in this short time in this world.
Ribono Shel Olam is waiting for our chessed, tefillos, learning, growing, changing our nature for the better…. etc etc etc. not more nonsense. If there are friends on facebook that you want to keep in touch with, there is a great invention called a telephone! I am not saying it is simple or easy and sometimes it is easier to seek distractions, but if we continue to distract rather than talk to Hashem (and cry to Hashem) then R’L our precious time to DO what we came here to do will be wasted.
lbj:(Mrs. Johnson? Is that you?) I’m just curious what gave you the idea that anyone who has a facebook account is a fallen person.
I smell Joseph 😉
Feif Un
why would one delete a YWN account?
how dare u compare YWN to treifa facebook?
LBJ- sorry i wasnt here to back you up all day, and I agree with you, but at the same time you don’t have to speak harshly to others because they have facebook accounts- they arent horrible people. yes facebook is horrible, and unfortunately as you can tell it is like any other bad thing- when you are in it, it is really hard to see the faults.. but once you step back, you can see how bad everything is.. (happens with relationships a lot…)
I am making an assumption that all of the people who are disagreeing with you/us are the people who have facebook and don’t see how bad it really is (if you are controlling your business’s facebook for parnasa it is a different story- I am talking about personal facebook account)..
i think i should tie Leiby in to this since the thread is about him… i saw ppl posted that what does facebook have to do with Leiby? Well something I wanted to personally work on was how I laugh in public (my laugh is usually really loud and it is not so tznius) so I decided to work on that seriously in Leiby’s memory.. did Leiby laugh really loud also? I dont know and it really doesnt matter- it is just something that I was doing wrong that I need to fix and Leiby pushed me to do it. This facebook idea is something that all of Klal yisroel needs a push to get rid of, and LBJ was taking this oppurtunity to help give a push to people who still have one, bc getting rid of it will ultimately gives a person’s life so much more meaning,spirituality and holiness. I have so much more to say about all the other comments but I think this post is long enough. Just to repeat- I AM NOT saying that anyone who has a facebook is bad Jew, I am just saying that if you are trying to become a better Jew, then deleting your facebook is a pretty easy and great way to do it- especially in Leiby’s memory.
mike: I don’t. I think it’s just another pair of sock puppets. Make that a triplet.
It is wrong to permit the forbidden and wrong to forbid the permitted.
I rarely post here but just had to respond to this conversation.
I wonder how many posters here that are proclaiming facebook as treif have ever been on it! I have facebook and am a member of various other online “boards” and I have seen more loshon hara, being hurtful and disgusting to others, and things that can be considered inapproriate in this very coffee room than on facebook or any other sites I visit!
Thank you ItcheSrulik, Thats exactly how I felt but didnt know how to say it to get past the moderators
ItcheSrulik:
“It is downright evil to usurp the death of an innocent child to push your own personal agendas.”
True. However, it is not evil to use the death of an innocent child to urge others to improve what they are doing. If yid4life honestly believes that Facebook is spiritually harmful, she is perfectly justified in urging others to (as she sees it) improve. However, if somebody is just pushing an agenda (lbj?) then that would definitely be wrong.
mikehall12382:
“I smell Joseph ;)”
I don’t. Joseph may think that anybody who has a different hashkafa then him is not frum, but at least he’s sincere. This sounds like somebody who is just looking for opportunities to insult people (a troll).
Facebook is opening yourself up to all kinds of narishkeit. It is NOT a place for someone that wants to guard themeself and their family from the garbage that is out there.
You could say the exact same thing about the internet itself. Instead of calling for people to delete their Facebook accounts, why not call for everyone to stop using the internet completely? Where are you going to draw the line?
I myself am not deleting my Facebook account. I have undertaken to learn an extra mishna a day until the shloshim in Leiby’s memory. To each his own.
why are the mods permitting all of lbj insults to go through. he/she is entitled to their opinion, but it should be stated politely.
A few years ago my whole family had facebook! A few months (6-8) after we signed up for facebook my parents heard a very powerful speech from R’ Wallerstein denouncing facebook. Since my parents are big fans of R’ Wallerstein, it was then that my parents told everyone in our family to delete our accounts. Anyone who is having a problem deleting their account should listen to R’ Wallerstein’s anti-facebook shmuz and they will delete it promptly! Additionally, besides as mentioned above if all the hours and time it steals away it also dirties up your mind. I personally know many (at least 20) teenagers whose factor in going towards the wrong derech was facebook! Ladies and Gentleman, it’s time for everyone to go delete their facebook accounts. Now!!!
I also wanted to say that don’t think R’ Wallerstein is a very chamur person beause he hates facebook. On the contrary R’ Wallerstein is pretty lenient. Facebook is just one of those touchy things for him that he thinks is plain out wrong.
I try to use it for good, for example, spreading Jewish links and videos
lovesbeingjewish:
when i saw your original post, i thought, wow what a beautiful idea. but when you started bashing others for disagreeing with you, it completely soured the taste. please keep your posts to the positive so you can continue to convey your original message. please understand that different people are different and you cannot judge others by whether or not they have an FB account. Just because FB wasn’t good for you does not mean that others cannot use it in a kosher way. if you continue in the way you are doing, you will just turn more people off to your idea.
I am against facebook unless it is really needed for business.
However, generally it is v hard to get someone else off it lzchus Leiby. Try speaking to someone who smokes and explain to them how bad it is.
If it helps even to discourage anyone from joining or to reduce the time wasted on it then that is also a zchus!
Whoa some people are judgmental. If you think Facebook is a horrible tool and can’t control yourself on it, by all means, don’t use it. There are people in this world who can log on without doing anything they shouldn’t. Don’t go ahead and tell them it’s their yetzer hara talking…maybe this was the case for you when you had an account. If you deleted your account because you truly felt it was wrong, good for you! But as for people who use it as a networking tool, in my humble opinion it’s no different than any other tool (such as phones, skype, etc as mikehall mentioned). I don’t either think the comparison is extreme.
coffeeaddict
Member
WHAT SOMEONE TOOK MY SCREENNAME!
anyway my two cents is that in this weeks parsha we learn how tools can be dangerous if used improperly (killing someone with an ax when it’s used for cutting wood, albeit by accident) facebook is a tool for some people to connect with old friends just some people go overboard and talk with people who aren’t friends and then it spirals out of control
personally I don’t have an account though I thought it’s a shtickle Ba’al Gayvish
scratch that it seems that he was on since January way before I changed my name (the question is why didn’t he take the one with a space between coffee and addict and instead left it for me?) (unless coffeeaddict is really joe)
I think everyone should do a little something to help elevate Leiby’s and all others who have passed Neshamas…I also think it’s not our place to tell others what that “little something” is…
I also feel that it is not right to call someone who doesn’t agree with you a “lost cause”…I’ve been very clear that I use Facebook for both personal and professional reasons and I personally see no problem with it…
I also respect those who do not feel it is right for them and choose not to have one…Within the Orthodox world, there are many Derechs…I don’t know for certain which is the right one or even if there is a “right” one…I guess we’ll have to wait for the Moshiach to find out…
Until then, I will try very hard to improve myself. Right now it is my choice to increase my learning and Tzedakah, to help me accomplish that….
And just so I am clear, this is not my Yetzer talking, it is me and what I feel…
shlishi:
a- I didn’t read that thread.
b- Child safety is relevant. Possibly you can make the case that the issue of reporting abuse is not, because he wasn’t abused that way, but it’s nowhere near the same thing as bashing a site you don’t like and saying “you have to listen to me because look a dead child”
Take a look to the upper left of the page, I see a Facebook Logo promoting Yeshiva World News’s Facebook Page 🙂
Take a look to the upper left of the page, I see a Facebook Logo promoting Yeshiva World News’s Facebook Page 🙂
Go YWN!
And 470 people “Liked” the page!!
this has been said before, and I dont mind saying it again but the fact that all of these organizations and companies use facebook as a tool to advertise is because many people around the world have Facebook, not necessaraly because they approve of it, and even if they do approve- okay so they don’t realize how harmful it could be. Yes I agree that internet and cell phone and skype and everything could be used for the bad, but for those things you have to go out of your way to do bad.. ex: go on bad websites,etc. but for facebook- do you know why it was even created? definitely not to keep in touch with family. I believe it was because mark zuckerbraun wanted to see all of the pretty girls in his college and then it expanded to other colleges and then to the public. Maybe now you use it to keep in touch, but that isnt what it is meant for and why majority of the users post pictures. Everyone who is saying they are using it for the good- like Rabbi Wallerstein said- “Even if you put a mezuzah on a bathroom doesnt make the bathroom holy.” Facebook is made for being used to judge other people and see if you think they are good looking or not, you cant justify it and say that since I am doing kosher things on it, it is a kosher website. (I am just rephrasing R’ Wallerstein..)
I challenge all of you who still have your facebook’s and dont plan on deleting them that whenever you look at pictures of your friends, family, or a random person you dont even know who is a friend of a friend of a friend, be aware of what your thoughts are…… (She looks so pretty, ugly, weird, not tznius, her outfit is ugly… Why was she invited to that simcha and not me?.. they are going out? she deserves better than him.. ive seen cuter babies.. why did he make tht his status? not everyone has to know about that..etc etc) If ALL of your thoughts are pure and innocent, then not only will I stop bothering you about this topic (which I am only doing because I care about all of your precious neshamos) but I will idolize you and consider you on the level of Gedolei Hador, because they are probably the only people who can see every single thing as good and giving the benefit of the doubt and not being judgmental, other than them- not even sure if they can do it- but we all have a lot to work on… Anyway- if any of you are still reading this, and you have facebook- get back to me in a few weeks and let me know if you’ve succeeded this challenge.
yid4life
Come on! So one should never look at other people’s pictures because heaven forbid they might think someone isn’t pretty? Or shouldn’t go to a friend’s house because they might hear that someone was invited to a wedding and they weren’t. I’m trying to understand how one goes more out of their way on the internet for bad than on Facebook. I really just don’t get it.
And for the record, it’s Mark ZuckerBERG.
Vote:
Which Facebook user here never saw a non-tzniusdik/prtizusdik picture on FB?
(If anyone is embarrassed to answer ’tis okay; we’ll count all non-responders as a nay.)
“I’m trying to understand how one goes more out of their way on the internet for bad than on Facebook.”
Are you able to please rephrase that? I don’t really undersatnd what you are trying to understand…
You could look at whoevers pictures you want- I’m not saying you can’t- by all means have your friends or cousins show you them through e-mail or in person. What’s wrong with that? Does it take any longer or is it harder to email it? Definitely not. In high school I used to upload pictures on facebook and it would take a long time, longer then sending a mass email to my cousins with the pictures attached…
obviously it is really hard to never look at pictures and find out about simchas you werent invited to, but it is clear that facebook was established and is used primaraly for gossip- even though bH i am sure nobody on this site uses their facebook intentionally for that purpose- that is what it is for! I know! I’m not making this stuff up. I had one, members of my family have them (immediate and my aunts uncles and cousins), and many of my friends ! (None of whom are bad people and I love them all..)
If you watch videos on Youtube (chas v’shalom 🙂 ), then type in- “so you want to close your facebook account” – pretty good sum up of my feelings (minus the C word he uses..) even goyim realize how fake it is – (just a disclaimer- i also think youtube can be used for good and for bad- and I really try not to go on.. that is what I am working on now… Even though I still use it, I am acknowleging the fact that it is bitul zman and it definitely has an impact on my neshama even though I don’t realize it and i only watch videos rarely.. )
I hope this helps..
Chein
Which INTERNET user never saw a non-tznius picture?
yid4life
I don’t have time to read your post now but will try to tonight
lovesbeingjewish
some pepole have facebook in order to bring money home!
yid4life
Sorry. Switch around the words facebook and internet (really tired today). I very much don’t agree with you but I guess you’re entitled to your own opinion.
Got it. Yea also really tired… You don’t have to agree with me.. I don’t agree with you, but its all good! You sound like a great person and yid, and it seems like if you thought facebook (or anything) wasn’t good for yourself, you wouldn’t use it.. and if you don’t think it’s bad for you, then I trust you that you are doing the right thing by keeping it.
I have been reading this Thread since Yesterday and I feel shocked and sick about what we are supposed to do to honor Leiby. I went to Arutz Sheva and typed the word Leiby clicked on the mouse, and do you know what I saw- it was a statement isued by Leiby’s Parents. There were four points on unity and acts of lovingkindness that people can do in the memory of Leiby:(1) act(s) of kindness toward your neighbor and people less fortunate than yourself; (2)Gratitude when one wakes up in the morning and says Modeh Ani-Thank Hashem for giving us life; (3)Light Erev Shabbos give money to charity and light the Candles before Sunset with Leiby in mind;(4)Memorial Fund-there is a Memorial Fund to help people in dire need to show the lovingkindness to his parents shown their son Leiby toward many many in need.
This is how (according to the statement appearing in Arutz Sheva) how Leiby’s Parents would like people to remember him. There was nothing about Deleting your Facebook Account in honor of Leiby’s Memory, just non judgemental ways that we could do individually and in our own way to show Leiby Kavod and Derech Eretz he deserves. I think I would personally want to honor the wishes of Leiby’s Parents.
Yep!! Learn some torah l”n him much more important!
quark2
I agree to you! Its crazy what pepole put in their head!
Do you people have any idea how many marraiges were RUINED because of face book accounts? Maybe you think I’m going to far…. I think todays’ society has gone too far!! Way too far….
The relationships started on facebook and then… do I need to get more explicit?? WAKE UP AND SMELL THE COFFEE!!! This thread going too far for you? Where are you holding??
a mamin
If you would make money on Facebook you would also have a account
Can I find Rav Wallersteins anti-Facebook shiur on Facebook?
How Many Marriages WERE ruined from facebook?
I am sure alot less than office romances , perhaps one should give up working because of this problem
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