- This topic has 156 replies, 29 voices, and was last updated 4 months ago by .
-
Posts
-
In the early days of YU the leadership came from litvish stock. Today as they go on to study in Israel they pick up interests in Chasidus. It seems that those who aren’t drawn to the gemara are looking to breslov and in general Rebbes to fill the spiritual void that often exists in American MO communities.
lakewhut,
Perhaps,, but given the growing numbers of yeshivish-born kids who are drawn to chasidus, sometimes to a lesser and sometimes to a greater degree,, there’s a spiritual void in that community needing to be filled.
Meh. There’s no “void” within Modern Orthodoxy and no sizeable segment of Modern Orthodox youth who become Chasidic. YU did make Rabbi Weinberger, i.e. The Woodmerer Rebbe, its Mashgiach, which is a joke as RIETS was founded as an anti-Mussar yeshiva of the non-Salanter Litvish mold. Yes, there are some Lubavitchers at YU as well as some Breslov-esque Neo-Chasidic types, but they are a very small minority.
The knowledge of Chassidic texts and Kebalah is absolutely amazing . Both gushniks and jbniks are exceptionally well read. The YU sefarim sale proves this.
“Meh. There’s no “void” within Modern Orthodoxy…”
Rav Schwab noted decades ago, even then, that “Modern Orthodoxy” was stale, stagnant and fossilized. Rav Aharon Kotler noted that its founder was responsible for “all the tuma in America”. Given that it adds idolatrous and heretical appendages to the Torah, like but not limited to Zionism, there is very much a “void” in “Modern Orthodoxy”, which is why many “Modern Orthodox” kids go to Israel and “flip out” and become frum rather than “Modern”.It is not fair to attribute heresy to the YI movement . The great and amazing Dr DS was referred to as the CC of America. He was Rav of YI ES. I think.
Is it really only the Modern Orthodox who suffer from a “void” that they need to fill?
In out times, we have: no prophets [neviim], no Torah-based Jewish Supreme Court
[Sanhedrin], no Rabbis with real smichah, no Temple [Beth HaMikdash],
no Kohanim and Leviim who perform their Avodah, and no unity among Jews,
not even among the Orthodox Jews (15%), and certainly not with the non-Orthodox Jews (85%).Until the secular year 1967, we Jews did not even enjoy free access to the Kotel
in Yerushalayim; and if all Jews would have listened to the anti-Zionists,
then we would still not enjoy free access to the Kotel, even now.Last but not least, our prayers [tefilot] seem to go unanswered most of the time,
even after we recite many prayers.It’s not “filling a void”. Unfortunately, Chassidus draws people in because it’s “feel-good Judaism”. The mesorah of the litvaks is a true mesorah, not something that was invented just a couple hundred years ago.
Just because people are drawn to something doesn’t make it right. Look at home many Jews were nebach lost to the haskalah movement.Why, the Thank You Hashem movement isn’t a cult?
Ishpurim: Many people will not understand your recent comment.
You might want to repeat your comment,
written in normal language, instead of secret code.DaMoshe: Over the past 42 years, you are the ONLY person
I know who referred to Chassidus as “feel-good Judaism”.
I invite you (or anyone) to explain how Chassidus is “feel-good Judaism”.DaMoshe, what makes Litvaks mesorah any more true then say sephardic, or temani culture lol
if you ask me litvishe culture is the most driest and unemotional unjoyous form of judaism. sephardic and other parts of judaism have way more life and energy. and chassidus injected that into ashkenazi jews
SQUARE_ROOT:
Actually, until the Zionists went against the Torah (and endangered countless numbers of Jews), and against the nations, in making their “State” in 1948, Jews did indeed have access to the Kosel.Unlike the “Modern Orthodox” who detract from the Torah by adding on their heresies to the Torah (Kol haMosif gore’a), Torah Jews gain immense spiritual fulfillment in the full richness of the Torah (minus the parts for which we need the geula and Beis haMikdash, of course), as much as they are capable of achieving. There is also tremendous unity among Jews, when discussing those loyal to the Torah, as opposed to the heretics and their movements like Zionism.
@hakatan
And to me’arat hamahpelah ? Did the Jews have access to it ?DaMoshe:
“Modern Orthodoxy” is today’s haskala, as it happens.
Also, real chassidus is, of course, not “feel-good Judaism”, as anyone who has learned chassidic Torah can attest.In spite of what is reported we remain proud of MO and its Yeshivot here and in Israel. The RY in YU are outstanding and always were. Dr BDR and SB saw to that. I remember one year each RY gave a shiur on the same inyan in the BM. אשרי עיין ראתה כל אלה.
Chasidus fills a void within the heart of every Yid. Exactly what the Besht was sent to this world for.
All orthodoxy is modern. Rambam was modern, Mishna was modern, 10 commandments were modern – each of these were modern in their times. Stop bashing other people for no reason. If you must, at least find a good reason.
ezra101: I agree with you.
HaKatan: Before “The Zionists” created their state in 1948 CE,
Jewish access to the Kotel was severely restricted,
compared to what Jews enjoy now.For example: Any Jew who blew the shofar at the Kotel
was quickly arrested and imprisoned by the British.Under the rule of the Turkish Ottoman Empire,
Jews had to pay money for access to a small part of the Kotel.lakewhut: Neither the Rabbinical College of America nor the Eitz Chaim Yeshiva, the two institutions that merged in 1915 to form the Rabbi Isaac Elchanan Theological Seminary, were breakaways from JTS. Rather, RIETS emerged and developed along its own trajectory.
The Jewish Theological Seminary had been Orthodox from its founding in 1886 until Solomon Schechter took over as the second President of JTS in 1902, ending the era of Hakham Sabato Morais zt”l and Rabbi Henry Pereira Mendes zt”l. Until Saul Lieberman’s death in 1983, all the professors at JTS were expected to be fully observant. The Seminary’s traditional minyan with separate seating was home to all the members of the Talmud faculty, including Drs. Israel Francus and Dov Zlotnick. When not davening at the Gerrer Shtiebel on the Upper West Side, Professor A. J. Heschel davened at the JTS traditional minyan.
To make matters even more interesting, there were graduates or former students of RIETS that ended up at the Seminary, such as Rabbi Isaac Klein and להבדיל Mordecai Kaplan יש”ו. Likewise, there were JTS graduates who became גאָר פֿרום and became part of the Orthodox milieu, such as Rabbi Herbert S. Goldstein. Goldstein was founder of the West Side Institutional Synagogue, chair of the homiletics department at RIETS, as well as president of the Union of Orthodox Jewish Congregations of America.
Rabbi Louis Bernstein, rabbi of the Young Israel of Windsor Park in Queens, professor of Jewish History at Yeshiva College, and president of Religious Zionists of America, wrote about the failed plan to establish a joint בית דין comprising rabbinic scholars from both YU and JTS, which might have kept the Conservative Movement within the bounds of normative Halachic practice. The effort was foredoomed to failure, however, as Rav Moshe זצ”ל and others nullified the קידושין of all JTS ordinees.
Interestingly, Rabbi Bernard Louis (Dov Aryeh) Levinthal zt”l, a Kovno native and Talmudist who used to travel by train to Manhattan once a week to deliver a פלפול at RIETS while serving as chief Orthodox rabbi of Philadelphia, signed a קול קורא against JTS that was published in the Yiddish press. His son was Israel H. Leventhal, founding rabbi of the Brooklyn Jewish Center (Conservative). Another signatory of the קול קורא was Rabbi Simon Finkelstein zt”l, also a native of Kovno and Talmudist who authored many ספרים. Finkelstein’s son was Dr. Louis Finkelstein, professor of Talmud at JTS as well as chancellor, and rabbi of Kehillath Israel, an Orthodox shul in the Bronx.
>>>“Modern Orthodoxy” is today’s haskala, as it happens.
Also, real chassidus is, of course, not “feel-good Judaism”, as anyone who has learned chassidic Torah can attest.Mr Hakatan:
I’m not saying chassidus is “feel-good Judaism”, but you certainly do not practice “feel-good Judaism”.
Your posts are also full of anger and self righteous outrage along with vitriolic condemnation of others. It is very not healthy b’ruchnius or even b’gasmius to follow such Judaism.
And as one major gadol once out it “When all a brand of Judaism have to offer is condemnation of others you know that it is bankrupt”
The mesorah of the litvaks is a true mesorah, not something that was invented just a couple hundred years ago.
What a joke! Today’s Litvish persona is a creation of the Yeshivah world of the 1800’s. Those yeshivas were, themselves, a synthetic creation that has never recovered from its origins. In their day, they functioned as a clearing house, creating a unified faceless group, dismissing all the ‘outdated’ local customs and identities, and creating in their stead a neutral, bland and synthetic academia that could not, and did not relate to the everyday world.
The single positive result that has emerged from the yeshivas happened when they came into contact with Hasidic Orthodoxy after the War, which introduced their students to Shulchan Oruch, and strict adherence to Halachah. In this respect, the chasm between the average pre-War yeshiva student and his namesake since the 1970s cannot be overstated. It represents a monumental shift of perspective. Modern Orthodoxy did not of course partake of this shift, as its entire raison d’etre is diametrically opposite to just that perspective.Ari: Much as JTS moved to the left far enough to leave Orthodoxy, YU too has consistently moved further and further to the left, with the passage of time, that some of them already have a toehold outside of Orthodoxy.
Let’s not forget that Avi Weiss, founder of the newest non-Orthodox movement, was not long ago a YU rabbi and teacher.
It’s not only modern Orthodox going to chassidus. Tons of litvaks are learning chassidus, tons of chassidim who didn’t learn chassidus many years ago, started learning chassidus,
This is because people feel empty in life, and chassidus gives meaning. and also this is what the Zohar says that thru learning Zohar we will go out of galus.
(Chassidus explains many ideas in Zohar)
This is what moshiach told the baal shem tov too. לכשיפוצו מעינותיך חוצה .SQUARE_ROOT:
That doesn’t make your earlier inaccurate assertion about the Kosel any less misleading.Besides, the reason for those restrictions imposed by the British was, of course, Zionist terror, wars and agitation (all pre-1948 – never mind the endless wars from then on) that destroyed the peace there.
This same Zionist agitation also compelled the British to limit immigration into then-Palestine during WW II, about which the Zionists of course knew (as the source of the troubles) and despite which the Zionists still lobbied governments against allowing in Jews to their countries then.
@Ari Knobler, The following is a direct quote from Shiurei Harav (A conspectus of the Public Lectures of Rabbi Joseph B. Soloveitchik Edited by Joseph Epstein), page 54. “…modern orthodoxy, with its snipped wings and rootlessness, unable to fathom the depths of religious experience.” spoken by the Rav himself…
Maybe what damoshe means by “feel-good Judaism”.that someone can feel good and proud that he’s a jew and he was brought up that yiddishkeit one has to be tense am I doing things right or will I go straight to ………..
yid, thanks for bringing this quote, hope you mis-represented it by mistake and not on purpose.
This is a quote from RYBS eulogy for R Heller. He is using “modern Orthodoxy” (note my capitalization) exactly the way I use it above: a modern state of “orthodoxy” in general – that I guess RYBS is trying to improve and bring it back to the old ideals. Here is the quote in the context, so you can judge by yourself:
As long as Rav Hayyim was with us, among us, there existed a strong tie between us and earlier generations. . . . When I visited him at home, on the West Side of Manhattan, with its congeries of bustling, hollow, Jewish life; with its synagogues, societies, clubs, and their auxiliaries, I always felt as if I were entering another world, as if I had breached some border separating two realms of being—the domain of earlier generations, of Shakh, Taz, and Gra, and that of **** modern Orthodoxy ***** , with its snipped wings and rootlessness, unable to fathom the depths of religious experience. . . . Moved by old, forgotten tales, he chuckled and sorrowed with his heroes. Images he described came to life, pushed their way into his modest room. Do you know where this power came from? Not from any art of speech or imagery! He never used a metaphor. He lived the events he recounted. He himself belonged to those generations, whose greatness he transmitted to us. . . . O he was a remnant of the ancient scribes.
There are two major Hasidic sects without living Rebbes, Breslov and Lubavitch, to which many of the Neo-Hasidic from Modern Orthodoxy gravitate..
Maybe a combination of them can be made under a Neo-Hasidic leader like R. Moshe Weinberger, the Woodmere Rebbe, R. Yussi Zakutinsky, the Lawrence Rebbe, or R. Judah Mischel, the Camp HASC Rebbe.
The new group’s name can be taken from both Breslov and Lubavitch. Breslovitch or Lubavlov would fit the bill.
WWMN (We Want Moshiach Now) – Chabad slogan.
NNNM (Na Na Nachman MeUman) – Breslov slogan.
If you look at the above, similarities and parallels can be noted.
The problem with the WS was chilul Shabbos בפרהסיא. The solution included LSS. Cantor SG from New Haven and RSK from Brooklyn
DaMoshe, +1!! Do not be fazed by all the krume attacks on you! I do not have time now to help you respond.
Umm Litfaks mesora is the same as chasdim. It stems from the GRA . Its about the same time as the Besht
Re the feel good aspect , one can argue that litfaks have also a feel good intellectual argument where its all about torahNow the real mesora is Yekkis and ashkenzai jews. Not litfaks. That means doing things like the Rema. And yes saying yotzer on YT etc.
Now we need to fast forward to todays society where you have a point. Chasdim aren’t suppose to be just a feel good thing. Its supposed to be about really observing extra Keddusha (extra tznuis) davening for long even in the weekdays in a hurry etc. Meanwhile litfaks historically, Litfaks only cared about torah and halchaha but not tefila or kedusha.
Fast foward to today, unfortunately chasdim are being abused as about feeling good and partying at R Shayla while fressing meat. It became about olem hazah . Tznuis has gone down too. And we have formally non chasdim part of newly made fake chasdish movements that think thats what’s important about life. meanwhile Litfaks are now the leaders on kedusha, davening long and being ehlrich. So technically in 2024 you are correct alot of being chasdish is fake
>>>Much as JTS moved to the left far enough to leave Orthodoxy, YU too has consistently moved further and further to the left, with the passage of time, that some of them already have a toehold outside of Orthodoxy.
You seem clueless about YU. Whatever issues you may have with them (I’m confident you never discussed their haskafa or anything else about them with an intelligent person affiliated with them) their current leadership is a lot less controversial and definitely to the right of who and what it was forty years ago.
Something that may motivate Modern Orthodox adherents to return to traditional Orthodoxy can be considered to be a Baal Teshuva movement helping Jews come closer to Torah and Mitzvos.
MO is a newfangled 20th century American movement, that while still mostly observant, has no mesorah and was designed for minimal observance while modernizing their religion.
@chaim87
Litvaks mesorah is from the gra? All litvaks I know never learned the first 3 shaarim of nefesh hachaim, at most they learned shaarim 4. They didn’t either learn any kabala seforim from the gra. The gra writes that you should educate even children not to serve hashem for reward – gan Eden and punishment – gehenom.
Today’s “yeshivish” Jews have no connection to the ways of the gra,
From nefesh hachaim shaar 3 perek 8
מטעם שודאי ראוי להאדם הישר חכם לבב הקבוע כל הימים בת”ת ומצות אשר נאמנה את אל רוחו לידע מציאות זה הענין הנורא דרך כלל שאדון יחיד ית”ש מלא את כל ואין עוד מלבדו ית’ להלהיב מזה טוהר קדושת מחשבתו לעבודת התפלה לכוין לבו באימה ויראה ורתת למקום הוא מקומו של עולם. (ומקומו של עולם הוא הוא כוונת ענין הצמצום. והוא מבואר כנ”ל)
Could be litvaks daven long but the focus is on the simple meaning of the words, the focus of chassidim is in addition to contemplate before davening on גדלות הקל – אחדות ה’ and to arouse love for hashem. And not to focus on our needs during davening as the Zohar writes against that (brought also in nefesh hachaim shaar 2)
Chassidus came to awaken Jews to serve hashem with feelings of love and fear, all the actions – hidurim – came out from it,
Chitzonius vs pnimius,
Today could be many chassidim don’t work on פנימיות and not either חיצוניות, or only chitzonius. and could be many litvaks work on חיצוניות – being careful in halacha, chumros etc. That’s not chassidus, chassidus is penimius.
Shtreimal is not even a chassidus thing,
Kedusha is chassidus the focus was on davening which automatically kept a person away from the opposite of kedusha – see likutai Torah, from Zohar. Screaming about shmiras enayim is not the derech of chassidus, and does not accomplish anything.“their current leadership is a lot less controversial and definitely to the right of who and what it was forty years ago.”
Surely you jest. You can’t seriously believe that today’s YU is more to the right than it was under Rabbi J.B. Soloveitchik.
All the homosexual rights started in YU in the late ’90s, when YU officially recognized and funded YU homosexual clubs. This was shortly after RJBS passed away. Since the ’90s it has gotten much worse; in the 2000s even the YU mashgiach Joseph Blau himself was defending the homosexual movement.
UJM
I won’t argue with you but only repeat that your knowledge about YU seems limited to hearsay coming from it’s opponents.
Mods, was my response not approved, or did it not go through?
You are describing one nitch of chasdus called chabad. I hate to say this but Chabad isn’t the only chasidsha group nor does it have a right to claim that only its way is the true way. There are many ways to serve hashem including many chasdisha ways. The big broad chasdisha groups whether its belz, satmar, Ger or chabad all believed that the way to serve hashem with more of a feeling and heart while Litfaks were more focused on just observing whats strictly required by the torah. That means that things like davening we only to obeserve the halcha part but who says its needs to be with a bren and fire or that everything needs a minyan. When it comes to kedusha thats not anyhwere in the torah so who says we need to do more. Most chasdim aside for chabad actually do very much scream about shmiras enyiam (look at the shomieri emunim’s sefer tahros kakodesh) and thats a big thing. Yes that is a chasdisha thing and you have no right to say it isn’t because its not chabad’s thing. The idea of kedusha is, that nowehere in the torah does it explicltiy outline the exact limits. But if one lives for a deeper meaning and wants to do it for hashem kedusha is a focus. Its 100% a chasdisha concept that must be spoken about. Same is true about kashrus where chasdim have more chumras bec even tough techincally maybe chalov stam is permitted we live to a higher standard than just what the torah allowed.
Yes chabad differs in that its about training your mind while other chasdim believe its about being extra observant than just the torah but chasdis is living for more then the torah and a code of laws. Once again sorry but chabad is just one of many chasdism.
This is all leads to my point, the old school litfak is almost non existent aside for the “frum Modern orthdox black hats who still kind of subscribe to that.
indeed, one of the Litvishe Rebbeim of the previous generation called some of the “litvishe” yeshivos – as litvishe teachers of Hungarian students. By now, it is Hungarian teachers teaching Hungarian students zecher l’Lita…
Btw, I am not sure why you spell them/us with F. Litvaks are mispronouncing Sh, not V! According to R Twersky, two Yidden in 1920s were negotiating a border between Russia and Lithuania (representing corresponding countries). They thought of going thru shtetls and asking them to recite Shir Hashirim. The ones that say “Sir haSirim aser leSlomo” would belong to Lithuania, the rest to Russia. (Maybe we need 2 people like that for Russia-Ukraine border now).
@chaim 87
If I find the sefer, I’ll look at it iyh.
My point is – that by ALL chassidim the chumros and hidurim came as a RESULT of love and fear of hashem – which came from davening in the ways of chassidus, hishkashrus to the rebbe .
It was not the first step. This was like you said the litvishe derech. (I think the chazon ish said, that chumros can BRING to love and fear of hashem)
about shmiras enayim it also talks a drop about it in chabad seforim, (קונטרס העבודה פרק ב) but the focus is to think about hashem, and understand the importance of קבלת עול – which BRINGS to guarding ALL ones senses. And also the long term success in shmiras enayim depends on constantly feeling connected to hashem – see Tanya התשובה, לקותי תורה I forget which maamer, look in the מפתח,
Screaming about how bad it is can actually lead to falling into it ח”ו see below in kitzur sh”u
This that you mention that this was and is the derech of other chassidus, you need to see exactly how often it was mentioned and in the context (like I said you can find it in chabad seforim also just not often) and how they write to deal with it
Btw in kitzur shulchan aruch he writes also how to be careful:הרוצה לשמור את עצמו מחטא זה, ישמור את פיו מניבול פה, משקרים, מרכילות, מלשון הרע ומליצנות, וכן ישמור את אזנו משמוע דברים כאלו, גם יהא זהיר לקיים נדריו, ולא ירבה בדאגה. וגם יהא זהיר מהרהורים רעים. וקודם שהולך לישן, יעסוק בתורה, או יאמר ד’ מזמורי תהלים הראשונים. ויזהר שלא לישן בחדר יחידי.
Chaim87, any names of G-d must be spelled with a capital first letter.
@sechel83
Your point about all chasdism vs litfaks is very nice in philosophy. In the reality of 2024 many chasdim just do it out of fear and the chumras come first. Leaving out chabad but look at some of the other sects and the fear factor instilled in it. Meanwhile, many litfaks today (have lots of ehlricha chadsdim mingled in) already observe chumros bec of love of hashem or as you say as a result. They sing and daven long too. This line has blurred and one can probably say litfaks today are more chasdish. (For example when chasdim only observe ceratin chumors bec they are bullied into it, is that a “result of love for hashem? I think even its leaders will argue that they need to observe the chumaros and then they will love hashem like the chazon ish. (I won’t say which chasidus bullies but we know it exists)Re Kedusha, its defintley the approach of Toldas Aron as per the shomieri emunim to yell about it. I believe most of Hungarian jewry does. Almost every chasdisha rav yells about it by his drashas in 2024. In general the derech of hungrain chasdim were to publcially speak and yell about it. I know chabad doesn’t but others do. And in 2024 it has grown to every chasdis aside for maybe chabad. Please don’t start quoting old chasdisha sefarim as thats an endless debate. You’ll find one way but there are tins the other way. Just look around at most chasdim today and its a fact they all preach about it. I don’t know of screaming about it causes people to be nechashal more. But we all do see that Chabad today in 2024 most defintley has plenty of tznuis and kedusha issues. You can’t deny that. Thus, the idea that its approach is more the right path isn’t convincing.
Lastly, while my keep point remains that chasdism and litfaks switched roles almost, Ill also say there is a 3rd dynamic. People who abuse the chasdic view you illustrate. The view that you just need to love hashem and everything else will come. As someone pointed out thats a feel good thing and it took off like fire in certain new movements. It only works if while thanking hashem you really seek to live a life of what hashem wants of us. Not a life of fluxury and ostentatiousness but if i say I love Hashem all is good.
Chaim > chasdim just do it out of fear and the chumras come first.
I have an idea about the chumros – why so many people run for chumros bein adam l’makom, but not always bein adam l’chavero. As you say – fear.
You have a relationship with Hashem and you have only limited information about what He expects from you. What if $50 lulav is not enough for a chashuve Yid like you? My neighbor who is an am haaretz spent $100, so it may be $200 is expected from me?! This is a Jewish version of Pascal wager : if your error on being machmir costs you $100, and your error on meikel costs you olam habo, the choice is obvious.
It looks easier when you are dealing with people who provide you with feedback.
Someone is selling a car. You say – how about $2000 for this clunker? The guy agrees. So, obviously the price was right.
Your wife asks – when are you going to be home? After the latest maariv in town and a class after that. OK, says the wife … obviously, she is happy that you are learning and she has the zechus to put kids to sleep.There two possible errors here:
1) it might be that Hashem did not really care about $200 for the esrog. OK, so the loss is just $150, right? No, the loss will be all the time and effort you spent pursuing these chumros while neglecting other issues and learning and maybe stealing more from others for the chumros (if yo are meikel on using OPM, other people’s money).2) you can’t always rely on getting feedback from people.
a) They may think that you are dishonest and rude person, but they will not tell you that in your face. Did you have hear people saying bad things about others? Do they usually say it in their face or only behind their back?
b) they may know that they can’t expect more from you. A wife would be the first to know that.
c) they may not understand themselves at the moment that you are not doing enough for them. They may not know choshen mishpat to know, for example, that you have to disclose problems with your clunker when you sell it, or that the buyer is not allowed to insist on a lower price same way as the seller is not allowed to insist on a higher …So, bottom line is that one should appreciate complexity of human psychology and be fearful that they are not machmir enough in bein adam l’chavero , that are so machmir that Hashem will not forgive them until people do ..
Some examples for the baal shem tov about doing something good with a self motive or feeling
כשמתענה אדם אפילו משבת לשבת, ויהיה לו פניה אפילו קטנה, שיאמר בלבו שהוא עושה דבר גדול שעינה את עצמו כ”כ הרבה, ויזדכך מאד בזה, זה התענית בא לסט”א. רק יחשוב בלבו, מה מעשי נחשבים נגד עבודת המלאכים שעבודתם בתמידות להש”י, ואני טפה סרוחה וסופי לעפר.המהלך בדרך יחידי <ושונה ומפסיק ממשנתו כו’, קשה דהל”ל ומפסיק ממשנתו והוה ידעינן דהיה שונה, עוד קשה מעלה עליו הכתוב ולא מפרש איזה כתוב.
וי”ל> הפי’, <כי ה>הולך בדרך הישר, ואפילו הכי הוא יחידי שאינו דבוק בהשי”ת, ושונה ומפסיק ממשנתו, ר”ל מפסיק א”ע מהש”י מחמת משנתו, דהיינו שבאה לו גדלות והתפארות מחמת משנתו <שסובר שהוא משנתו שלו>, ואומר מה נאה אילן זה, ועל עצמו אומר כן בלבו, כמ”ש כי האדם עץ השדה, <ואומר דהוא אלנא די רבא ותקיף>, ומה נאה ניר זה, כמ”ש נירו לכם ניר, <פי’ שאומר שמכין לעצמו חלק לעוה”ב ע”י משנתו>, מעלה עליו הכתוב <פי’ כתוב שנ’ תמים תהיה עם ה’ אלקיך, פי’ אפי’ כשתעסוק בתורה שנאמר בה תורת ה’ תמימה, וז”ש תמים תהיה, אפילו בעסק התורה תהיה עם ה’ אלקיך, ולא תימא הלא התורה ממילא נקרא תורת ה’, וז”ש מעלה עליו הכתוב הזה, שכולל כל התורה>, כאלו מתחייב בנפשו.Here we see the chassidus approach of what is kedusha – bitul – not feeling self, and what is kelipa – feeling self.
This is explained in Tanya at length (see I.e. perek 6 and 35)@chaim87
I agree with a lot of what you’re saying,
What I disagree about is the “fact/rumer” that litvaks are more “chassidish” today then the chassidim.
It could be true that they are more machmir, but that’s not chassidus, and it could be true that some chassidim do less chumros or hidurim (or even violate halacha ch”v)
Chumros and hidurim coming from fear of gehenom and wanting to get gan Eden is not chassidus
Using schar and onesh to keep oneself from doing something forbidden is definitely good, to do chumros – some chassidishe seforim say better not do the chumros .
My point is that chassidus is NOT judged based on ones actions.
A person can keep every halacha with all the chumros and have never learned chassidus, never went to a rebbe etc. Chassidus came to the world to awaken deeper levels of the neshama. Different chassidus had different ways to do that but ALL branches of chassidus stressed on being connected to the rebbe,
If one doesn’t have that, he may be a binuni according to Tanya (or a tzadik in the comen language) but he’s not more “chassidish”
If one is connected to a tzadik and workiun the ways of chassidus according to his level that’s chassidus. (He may be a rasha and may get gehenom)
- You must be logged in to reply to this topic.