Chalav Yisrael and Imposing on Others

Chevre, let’s take another scenario. Reuven was raised in a home where they kept kosher, but weren’t makpid on chalav yisrael. He went to the right in life, choosing a lifestyle that is quite different from his parents. They don’t approve.

Now he is visiting his parents. His parents keep offering to out on movies for the kids, and they keep declining politely. It’s not easy. Now his mother serves the kids breakfast.

The milk is OU D, chalav hacompanies. Should Reuven increase the machlokes in order to be a baal nefesh, or should he rely on the heter? And if his mother went out of her way about bought heimishe milk and cereal, should he push further and insist on plastic keilim?

I have been told by many respected rabbanim and poskim not to look too closely when I’m in this situation. Hamayvin yavin.

DY: Thank you for the lengthy explanation.

The Emes L’Yaakov makes a flat statement differentiating keilim without offering a rational?

If you are going to eat in someone house and not pay for the food you have no right to demand anything

If you dont trust the Kashruth , then either dont go there or offer to pay for the food.

If the host is willing to go the extra mile you should appreciate the nice offer and accept, but you have no right to demand, If you dont like the house rules, go somewhere else

jdb: Please explain what you mean by ” stretch the boundaries of hetariem”.

Here’s another scenario that rephrases the OP’s question, without the complications of CY vs CS.
There are various kosher l’mehadrin hechsherim, different people hold by different ones. None are treif, obviously.
Say I eat a wide range of those, we will call them Hechsher K, L, M, N and P. Hechsher K is found on many items, and is one of the few hechsherim that is accepted by everyone, but it is also more expensive than the others on things like chicken and meat. I am very price conscious when I shop, buy things when they are on sale, and when it comes to a choice between 2 brands, the price will be the most deciding factor. So I will not buy chicken with K hechsher because it is so much more money than M or N.
If I was sending in a snack item for a kid’s school party, or preparing something for a friend’s kiddush, I would make sure to buy/use items only with Hechser K, but those are not expensive, and they are to be consumed outside of my home.
Now Reuven is coming to my house for shabbos, and he only eats hechsher K. Do I accommodate him and buy the more expensive K chicken? Should I ask him in advance what hechsherim he eats? I know there are many people who are makpid on certain hechsherim at home, but when they go to another frum person, they don’t ask questions. But as the host, how far should I go to try to accommodate their optimal standards?

jdb – that example makes more sense to me than the OP’s scenario. In your situation, it makes sense to at least ask the sheilah, and I wouldn’t be surprised if there are Rabbanim who would allow it (depending on the specifics of the situation).

But in the OP’s case, I personally found it hard to even see where there is even a sheilah.

I had been thinking of pointing out that the only cases that I would think (IMHO) that it might make sense to even ask a sheilah are: 1. If you are visiting relatives, and/or 2. If you are visiting someone out-of-town where chalav yisrael is not available.

My impression is that in general, there are more likely to be leniencies when it comes to family than when it comes to good friends. Family relations can be much more sticky. I have heard of people being more “meikel” about tznius, for example, when it came to relatives who were visiting.

Lilmod, what kind of kula on tznius are you referring to?

Ubiquitin – I agree with almost everything you wrote (except for the fact that if Shimon insists on serving c”y, I don’t think Reuven should argue with him, although perhaps he can offer to provide the c”y).

When I was a kid, we had a frequent Shabbos guest who only ate Yashan (back in the days when that was practically unheard-of). So he used to bring his own challah, and it wasn’t a big deal. He never made us feel like we were less Frum than him because we weren’t makpid on Yashan.

What’s interesting is that many years later, I happened to ask him why he’s makpid on Yashan, and he responded, ”because chadash is an issur d’oraisa”. (Note: I was actually in the middle of eating non-Yashan when he said this!).

Which just makes it more impressive that he didn’t have a problem eating at our house and didn’t make a big deal about the fact that he was makpid on Yashan and we’re not.

may i add some more place to be machmir in this subject. most of us will remember the “hole in the cow stomach” tumult. it was allowed by most kashrus organizations, but one posek did not allow and since his CY company was going to be machmir, all others followed, so as not to be of an inferior kashrus standard and lose the market. When you use Chalav Stam (as it should be called) you automatically enter into the safek of Chalav Treifa. just food for the thought. 🙂

Yerushalmi

So even most poskim who require CY still hold that the punctured stomachs arent an issue?

Isacbalbin
” There is NO posek who permits Chalav Stam”
you are a bit mixed up
Incorrect. R’ Moshe does. He calls it Chalav hacomponies it is what the rest of us call chalav stam, and he says it is muttar (ie halachicly chalav yisroel)

There are certainly cases were we are meikal or somach on Shitos regarding the aspect of blios when its not a Ben Yomo.

There are also cases we’re not (l’chatchilah) and cases where it is ben yomo.

I would be somach on the shitos Pri Chadash (Note, which is muttar according to everyone’s understanding)

No, we don’t pasken like the Pri Chodosh, we pasken like the Chasam Sofer.

Sorry if this sounds overly simplistic regarding the question posed originally, but I think it’s simpler to answer by treating the issue of C”Y as one would food allergies. Hence, it’s incumbent on both the host and the guest to discuss the issue and come up with a plan for the visit that doesn’t overly impose on either the host nor the guest.

To some degree it’s less an issue of kashrus than of mẹnschlichkeit.

oh joseph, no two such people would ever be friends!!