Chabad Media Won

qwerty: To Benedict ARSo. I’m waiting for an answer or to see how you try to squirm out of the question.

I don’t see a question.

On the other hand, there are a number of questions that I have asked you that you have not answered. For example, how to you justify praying with idolaters? And, where did Rabi Akiva say that associating with (or perhaps it was supporting) an idolater makes one like an idolater?

And there are others…

Yankel berel, you are exactly right. Of course their rebbe can’t be moshiach.

I’m just saying what they believe which is that he’s really alive and coming soon to bring the geulah and fulfill the prophecies…

To coffee addict

Very nice but Shmei will squirm out of it, ignore or change the subject like the pathological liar he is. Let the “goon” ARSo answer the question. He’s a total moron believing that Yaakov is alive because Shmei said so. I

To the group

I tried to engage in a discussion with ARSo but he’s acting like a jerk, so AFAIC he’s persona non grata. If he wants to end up with Shmei, gezunterheit.

To yankel berel

I didn’t understand your point. Are you implying that I don’t consider Lubavitchers to be Jewish? I certainly do and therefore Lostspark will be held accountable for yesterday’s despicable statement. He violated several Lavin and Ashes. Despite what L Rebbe said. Gehinnom still exists.

To always

I brought up the Halacha of studying Kabbalah after 40 because ARSo was insinuating that philosopher was Chayav Misah for learning Gemara. Interestingly he has no problem with Lubavitchers who violate the Kabbalah at 40 edict. In addition he won’t criticize Lostspark’s anti-Semitic trope directed at a Godol Byisrael. The Gemara says that anger is a form of idolatry. BA’s jealousy of my superiority has turned him into a supporter of Chabad idolatry.

To ARSo

I quoted Rabbi Plutchok telling me,”Everything you say about Chabad and the Rebbe is correct.” This means I have his Haskomah. But no I didn’t check the Hitler comparison with him, but Dr. Berger agrees with it so that’s reliable. I did quote Rabbi Plutchok saying that the Rebbe’s gaavah was so enormous he convinced himself that he’s god. That says it all As for the question I asked you. There’s actually two of them both on 9/17 at 20:49 am. One is a question and one is a challenge. The challenge is for you to name a living non-Chabad Rabbi who says Yaakov Avinu is still physically alive. The question is based on your statement. You said that if the discussion was Menachem’s belief in the LR and Moshiach you would disagree with everything he wrote. I asked you why you would disagree with him. I’m sure he has phony sources for this garbage. As for the Rabbi Akiva quote, bli Neder I’ll see my Rav tonight and get it. If I’m wrong I’ll admit it. Finally as I’ve said numerous not all Lubavitchers are idolaters and even those who are largely keep it to themselves so there’s no problem davening with them

Coffee,

I would like to ask you a question (according to Rashi et al in the plain and pashut sense)
We say תורה צוה לנו משה מורשה קהילת יעקב the word מורשה (according what I heard at least) is that it means inheritance (and because we say קהילת יעקב it’s understood from יעקב) how can an alive person give over an inheritance, inheritance is only done after death?

Additionally
Doesn’t it say Hashem doesn’t affix His name to a person while he’s alive? (Hashem said to Moshe “אלקי אביך” and the midrash says that’s how Moshe knew he passed away) yet Hashem says אלקי יעקב

Excellent questions on Rashi and the other meforshim!
I suggest you look into it, find some nice answers, and maybe use this as a Dvar Torah or pilpul that you can deliver for parshas Vayechi.

It is obviously unnecessary to point out that even if we have unanswered questions on a true talmid chacham (like Rashi et al), that doesn’t ch”v invalidate their pshat.

However, I’ll give some thoughts that may answer your questions:

THOUGHTS TO ANSWER YOUR FIRST QUESTION:

1. The idea of מורשה is mainly emphasizing the WAY that Yidden received Torah: Just as a yerusha is passed automatically to all the children, even a little baby, so to Torah belongs to every Jew just because he/she is Jewish (as the Rambam writes: כֶּתֶר תּוֹרָה הֲרֵי מֻנָּח וְעוֹמֵד וּמוּכָן לְכָל יִשְׂרָאֵל. שֶׁנֶּאֱמַר (“תּוֹרָה צִוָּה לָנוּ משֶׁה מוֹרָשָׁה קְהִלַּת יַעֲקֹב”. כָּל מִי שֶׁיִּרְצֶה יָבוֹא וְיִטּל.

This doesn’t necessarily mean that we are getting Torah from a dead person. On the contrary, we are inheriting Torah FROM HASHEM.

2. קהלת יעקב does not necessarily imply an inheritance from Yaakov, for the Jewish people are called בני ישראל\כלל ישראל\בני יעקב\קהלת יעקב all the time, not necessarily referring to something that they have received from Yaakov himself.

Actually, the Ramban writes that מורשה קהלת יעקב means that Yaakov himself RECEIVES the inheritance as well:
וְדָרְשׁוּ רַבּוֹתֵינוּ (מדרש תהלים א), שֶׁלֹּא אָמַר מוֹרָשָׁה בֵּית יַעֲקֹב אוֹ זֶרַע יַעֲקֹב וְאָמַר קְהִלַּת יַעֲקֹב, לְרַמֵּז שֶׁיִּקָּהֲלוּ רַבִּים עֲלֵיהֶם וְתִהְיֶה הַתּוֹרָה לְעוֹלָם מוֹרָשָׁה לְיַעֲקֹב וּלְכָל הַנִּקְהָלִים עָלָיו, הֵם הַגֵּרִים הַנִּלְוִים עַל ה’ לְשָׁרְתוֹ וְנִסְפְּחוּ עַל בֵּית יַעֲקֹב, וְנִקְרְאוּ כֻּלָּם קְהִלָּתוֹ.
“Torah will always be an inheritance FOR YAAKOV and all those who gather around him.”

3. The Gemara (Sanhedrin 91b) states that the inheritance of Torah was since ששת ימי בראשית, way before the birth – and certainly death – of Yaakov:
תורה צוה לנו משה מורשה קהילת יעקב מורשה היא לכל ישראל מששת ימי בראשית.

These are just some points I thought of right away.
תן לחכם ויחכם עוד.

—

A THOUGHT TO ANSWER YOUR SECOND QUESTION:

Hashem said אלקי יצחק during Yitzchak’s lifetime. Rashi asks (בראשית כח, יג), how can this be, לֹּא מָצִינוּ בַּמִּקְרָא שֶׁיִּחֵד הַקָּבָּ”ה שְׁמוֹ עַל הַצַּדִּיקִים בְּחַיֵּיהֶם לִכְתֹּב אֱלֹהֵי פְּלוֹנִי?

Rashi answers: כָּאן יִחֵד שְׁמוֹ עַל יִצְחָק, לְפִי שֶׁכָּהוּ עֵינָיו וְכָלוּא בַבַּיִת, וַהֲרֵי הוּא כְמֵת וְיֵצֶר הָרָע פָּסַק מִמֶּנּוּ, תַּנְחוּמָא – Yitzchak was different because his eyes became dimmed and he was confined to the house, he was like dead and the yetzer harah already left him.

Maybe, the same can be said about Yaakov: Since he is in a state SIMILAR to death (as Rashi writes: נדמה להם שהוא מת – he seemed dead to them), it is okay to say אלקי יעקב.

Again, this is just a thought.
תן לחכם ויחכם עוד.

To the group

Maharsha explains Yaakov Lo Meis to mean that his soul is immortal. So Maharsha and Ohr Hachaim don’t learn the Gemara literally. More good news. This time Shmei got caught with his pants down As I’ve said on many occasions Schneersohn’ is a lying Kofer because he rejected the Gemara in Cheilek. Again, Rava said that the events at the final redemption will mirror what happened at Yetzias Mitzrayim, meaning that only a small percentage will be redeemed. Since the Rebbe rejected this Gemara, all Chabad has to excuse his Kefirah. This is what Shmei came up with. He quoted Rav Yochanan saying, “It’s not satisfactory to Hashem that you said this about them is according to Resh Lakish most of the Jewish people will be doomed to Gehinnom. rather even if one learned only one law he has a share in Olam Habo. Very nice. Here’s the problem..That quote has nothing to do with Rava’s statement which comes 30 lines later on the Amud. Another failed attempt by Shmei to cover up for the Kofer in the box.

To coffee addict

You scored a direct hit with your two questions. Great job .ARSo the Shmei puppet can’t answer either question so he says, We don’t die from a question..” When we add my two questions is why do Maharsha and Ohr Hachaim not accept Rashi’s statement literally. So now there are 4 powerful challenges to the ridiculous notion that Yaakov is still alive. So you don’t kill yourself if you have a question but when you have 4 powerful questions that all prove that Rashi’s Pshat isn’t meant to be literal a rational person realizes he was wrong. As for Shmei’s bubba maasehs, pay no attention to them..I caught the lying Kofer in my previous post where he falsely represents a statement of Rav Yochanan. We have two liars. One ARSo whos unable to admit that he was fooled by Shmei. And Sbmei who pushed this Yaakov alive garbage to fool people into believing that his god Rebbuh is still alive.

Qwerty:This time Shmei got caught with his pants down As I’ve said on many occasions ———— is a lying Kofer [ר”ל, עפ”ל] because he rejected the Gemara in Cheilek. Again, Rava said that the events at the final redemption will mirror what happened at Yetzias Mitzrayim, meaning that only a small percentage will be redeemed. Since ———- rejected this Gemara, all Chabad has to excuse his Kefirah. This is what Shmei came up with. He quoted Rav Yochanan saying, “It’s not satisfactory to Hashem that you said this about them is according to Resh Lakish most of the Jewish people will be doomed to Gehinnom. rather even if one learned only one law he has a share in Olam Habo. Very nice. Here’s the problem..That quote has nothing to do with Rava’s statement which comes 30 lines later on the Amud. Another failed attempt by Shmei to cover up for the Kofer in the box.

Qwerty, a small tip: When asking a question, express a little less anger and hate in your tone; that way, you’ll look like less of a fool when it is answered.

You are correct that Rav Yochanan didn’t make his statement directly to Rava, but you are wrong because Rav Yochanan made his statement THREE times on the page, and you only noticed the ONE time that wasn’t relevant (“you see what you want to see”)!

The other two times, Resh Lakish stated that a portion of Jews wouldn’t be redeemed (though nowhere near the amount that Rava holds), and Rav Yochanan ARGUED, and said that Hashem isn’t happy with this.

In my post that you are quoting, I wrote all of this in short because I already explained it at length in an earlier post. I though you would remember.

The point is: Even Resh Lakish argues with Rava, and Rav Yochanan certainly does. The same is regarding Rav and Rav Kahana on the page.

And even Rava is explained by meforshim NOT to mean that Jews will miss out from Redemption.

If you don’t understand any of this because it’s to complicated for you, fine. But drop all of the attacks on anything that you can’t grasp.

P.S. Here is an excerpt of my earlier post where I explained the sugya at length (full post is September 5, 9:54am):

The posuk says that at the time of redemption, “two thirds will be wiped out and one third will remain.”
Thirds of what?
Resh Lakish says that only one third of the Jews (Arpachshad ben Sheim’s descendants) will survive, all others will die.
R’ Yochanan says, “Hashem is not happy with you saying such a thing” – that so many Jews (or non-Jews, depends on which meforash) will die! Instead, one third of Sheim’s descendants will survive. i.e., ALL the Jews and many non-Jews will survive.

…Even the statement of Rava needn’t be understood literally (that most Jews will not be redeemed). Meforshim explain that the majority of Jews who won’t be present at the Geula refers to the many PREVIOUS generations of Jews from before the Geula. These people will rise for techiyas hameisim and greatly outnumber the group of Jews who were part of the generation that was present at the actual time of Geula. [See footnotes in Artscroll, referencing Maharal and Yaavetz.]

@ARSo
Re RAMBAN agreeing to RASHI whether Daniel could be mashiach.

1] I cannot imagine RAMBAN giving a public answer in front of the King and afterwards sending written accounts all over Spain , all the while knowing that RASHI , the foremost mefaresh on the gmara , is disagreeing with his pshat. If RAMBAN uses that as proof klapei huts and klapei pnim [for his coreligionists who were under constant pressures to convert] , It must have been in RAMBAN’s own opinion ,totally ironclad.

Not something which someone could come tomorrow and say – hey, this is against an offene RASHI in sanhedrin.
Per force that he agrees with RASHI.

2] RAMBAN consistently brings , and argues with RASHI wherever he disagrees with his pshat , whether al hashas or al hatorah. If he would argue with RASHI in sanhedrin, why is he keeping quiet about it ?
Per force that he agrees with RASHI.

3] So , if RAMBAN agrees with RASHI that Daniel is a fitting candidate even though he was niftar already , then why is he disqualifying j on the grounds that he died ? The answer is simple. There is no problem in dying in of itself. There is a problem ,however, in dying WITHOUT realization of nevu’ot hanevi’im.

Why is that a problem ? Because we cannot have a situation of a free for all vacancy, where first come first served, the mashiach job is open for all wannabe’s who happen to lay claim to throne.
So, to lay a claim and start the mashiach process and FAIL by dying [dissappearing/hiding/going on permanent sick leave] without realization of the nevu’ot , is a reliable filter to keep out all plastic mashiachs.

Daniel, however, never started , never lay a claim to the throne, so why should he be any less qualified than a living person who would want to lay a claim and be equally subject to the reliable filter we mentioned before ?

So, there is ample reason to reject j ,according to all of RASHI’s explanations, on the sole grounds that he started and subsequently failed
Ditto with habads late leader .

There is no point whatsoever going into whether Yaakov Avinu died or disappeared. This is totally irrelevant here.
.

To coffee addict

Let’s focus on your statement that Hashem doesn’t attach His Name to someone who’s dead. So Shmei answers that regarding Yizchok the term Elokei Yizchok was used even though he was alive. So Shmei speculates that “perhaps” we can say the same about Yaakov, to wit since he seemed dead we can say he was dead sort of. So now we need Shmei to invent his own Torah to prove the insanity that Yaakov is still alive. The Gaon said that the simplest answer is the truth. And the simplest answer is that When Rashi said that Yaakov is alive he meant alive as per Maharsha and/or Ohr Hachaim, that is not literally alive. Surely youRashi wasn’t following the Pshat of a lying weasel like Shmei who needs to believe that Yaakov is alive to convince dummies like ARSo that the Rebbe is still alive. Why doesn’t ArSo see what’s obvious to all? Because he’s insanely jealous of me and can’t deal with the thought that I beat him Nebach.

qwerty: ARSo was insinuating that philosopher was Chayav Misah for learning Gemara.

Another brazen lie! (You tend to do that, following the premise that a big lie will be believed. I wonder which mass murdered you got that from…)

Show where I insinuated that or tell us all publicly that you were wrong. That’s a challenge, and if you don’t face up to it you should never play chess again!

qwerty, I assume to me: BA’s jealousy of my superiority…

You are possibly more deluded than the Lubaviches who say their rebbe is alive!

Philosopher, I once wrote this in response to one of your “challenges” from the “Rif”:

“I read and reread the Rif in the Ein Yaakov and I still can’t find what you’re referring to that יעקב לא מת was only until Eretz Yisroel (I do remember a different meforash saying that, not the Rif).
Would you be so kind as to quote the words that you’re referring to (as I requested once already)?”

Well, I found the meforash who says this, it’s the Chochmas Menoach, but not the Rif, as I said.

Meanwhile, it’s Philosopher and Qwerty who are misquoting meforshim (Philosopher: the Rif. Qwerty: Ohr Hachaim) while they claim (baselessly) that I am doing it.